TruTrak and LNAV+V & LNAV/VNAV

George Mohr

George Mohr

Line Up and Wait
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Gmohr
Hi all,

Can anyone with the certificated TruTrak let me know if the unit WILL or WILL NOT follow the vertical guidance from a GPS LNAV+V, or LNAV/VNAV. I'm aware that it will do LPV. I've got a 430W if that matters.

Thanks!!
G
 
If it will do an LPV, the AP has no way of knowing the pilot is flying an LPV, LNAV/VNAV, LNAV+V, or LP+V, so if it works for any one, it will work for the others.
 
That's what I thought too. But then I read something to the contrary, and had me thinking that the vertical guidance also had some kind of quality signal that the AP could use to discriminate between LPV and something lesser. Can anyone with the unit confirm for us?
 
George Mohr said:
Hi all,

Can anyone with the certificated TruTrak let me know if the unit WILL or WILL NOT follow the vertical guidance from a GPS LNAV+V, or LNAV/VNAV. I'm aware that it will do LPV. I've got a 430W if that matters.

Thanks!!
G
Click to expand...

I can confirm that it will fly an LNAV+V. I have an Avidyne IFD-540 coupled to a TruTrak Vizion.
 
pburger said:
I can confirm that it will fly an LNAV+V. I have an Avidyne IFD-540 coupled to a TruTrak Vizion.
Click to expand...


According to some sophisticated owner circles, the Vizion is a VFR only AP, not worthy of any meaningful IFR operations. What is your opinion about that as an owner?
 
Unit74 said:
According to some sophisticated owner circles, the Vizion is a VFR only AP, not worthy of any meaningful IFR operations. What is your opinion about that as an owner?
Click to expand...

No idea where these “sophisticated owner circles” are, but my trutrak is a damn fine autopilot regardless of what the visibility conditions are. Not even sure how that really matters.

And can confirm...it flies an LNAV+V from my ifd540 like it’s on rails. There’s several videos on YouTube that shows this as well.
 
Lynn Dixon said:
No idea where these “sophisticated owner circles” are, but my trutrak is a damn fine autopilot regardless of what the visibility conditions are. Not even sure how that really matters.

And can confirm...it flies an LNAV+V from my ifd540 like it’s on rails. There’s several videos on YouTube that shows this as well.
Click to expand...

Some Beech owners have been snubbing their nose at TT because it wont do an LPV legally. Kinda like if they were driving a Rolls and asked for a jar of Grey Poupon and they were handed French's instead.
 
Unit74 said:
Some Beech owners have been snubbing their nose at TT because it wont do an LPV legally. Kinda like if they were driving a Rolls and asked for a jar of Grey Poupon and they were handed French's instead.
Click to expand...

Not sure where they are getting this false information. There is nothing in the pilot guide, or installation manual that forbids or " illegalizes" and LPV approach. The TruTrak will follow WHATEVER the navigator tells it, so its more of a failure on the navigator if anything. The Navigator actually sends the steering commands to the AP, giving it a bank angle, etc. If the Navigator is capable of commanding an AP to do an LPV both vertically and laterally and will send that via GPSS Steering over ARINC, the TruTrak will command the servos to do it.

My plane flies them without any issues at all....like its on rails... all the way down to the touchdown zone. If you let it of course :)

Its all discussed, with even a video posted as proof it does indeed do it right here: https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=152021
 
i guess with the release of their new firmware ...its time POA debates on GFC 500 VS TT - AGAIN
 
WannFly said:
i guess with the release of their new firmware ...its time POA debates on GFC 500 VS TT - AGAIN
Click to expand...

There are only two things I want in my TruTrak that the GFC500 has:

1. Indicated airspeed climb
2. Auto Pitch Trim capability (its an additional $3000 on the GFC500, but it IS available)

Having some audio cues would be nice, but not a big deal.
 
Lynn Dixon said:
There are only two things I want in my TruTrak that the GFC500 has:

1. Indicated airspeed climb
2. Auto Pitch Trim capability (its an additional $3000 on the GFC500, but it IS available)

Having some audio cues would be nice, but not a big deal.
Click to expand...

Not sure I'd want either of those...Not sure why some think that IAS climb is a MUST have..The TT will climb at whatever rate we punch in and will not go lower than programmed minimal airspeed. So safety not an issue and it takes all of 2 seconds to change the rate of climb as we get higher to maintain the IAS. Unless you're looking for fully autonomous flight I don't see where this would influence my decision on which A/P to purchase.
Auto Trim is something that seems to have it's share of problems. I know several folks that have had (sometimes scary) issues with auto trim and just seems to be adding another point of failure.
I would like to see a less sensitive trim warning on the TT.
 
IAS climb is what we all do normally, and its less work, so it makes sense to want that. And pitch trim is just a workload saver. Neither are deal breakers for me, and are not enough to overcome the price savings on the TT vs GFC500.
 
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Flybuddy said:
Not sure I'd want either of those...Not sure why some think that IAS climb is a MUST have..The TT will climb at whatever rate we punch in and will not go lower than programmed minimal airspeed. So safety not an issue and it takes all of 2 seconds to change the rate of climb as we get higher to maintain the IAS. Unless you're looking for fully autonomous flight I don't see where this would influence my decision on which A/P to purchase.
Auto Trim is something that seems to have it's share of problems. I know several folks that have had (sometimes scary) issues with auto trim and just seems to be adding another point of failure.
I would like to see a less sensitive trim warning on the TT.
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You're not wrong Flybuddy. IAS climb is certainly not a "need to have" as the TruTrak is certainly easy to adjust mid-climb. Having these features also does not influence my decision on the AP either, hence why I bought a TruTrak :) It would be nice to have in a long climb as I usually find myself adjusting my climb rate on several times on my way to 10k feet, my 177RG slows its climb down quite a bit around the 7k foot mark and thats about when the engine has gotten good and heat soaked too. hah. I usually step from 700fpm, to 500fpm to 300fpm in those long climbs. Easy enough to do on the TruTrak, but it sure would be nice to just set it at 90 MPH and forget about it.

I really want auto-trim though. I had one bit of a "surprise" with my TruTrak, that was really my fault. I was in a descent, one that I sort of hand to "step" down as I had to level off to clear some Tennessee mountains. In this whole process of approaching, descending, clearing, and descending, working traffic etc...I totally ignored the TruTrak hollering about nose down trim. I was making power adjustments which I thought was taking care of the trim requirement. While totally focused on watching traffic and planning my entry into the pattern, the TruTrak got tired of hollering for nose down, and it completely disengaged causing my nose to "pop" up and scare the crap out of me! hah. It wasn't a dangerous situation, but during all the busy work that nose popping up wasn't expected and after I took a second or two to realize what the heck was going on, I sort of laughed and thought "the trutrak got tired of yelling at me and said peace out". Having auto-trim would have been really sweet to reduce some of that workload for a new pilot like me.

Having said all that.... those things are not "need to haves" but more like "nice to haves". For the price of the TruTrak I can live without them. There is rumblings that we *might* get IAS climb as an update at some point....since the experimental version has it.
 
The expe
Lynn Dixon said:
You're not wrong Flybuddy. IAS climb is certainly not a "need to have" as the TruTrak is certainly easy to adjust mid-climb. Having these features also does not influence my decision on the AP either, hence why I bought a TruTrak :) It would be nice to have in a long climb as I usually find myself adjusting my climb rate on several times on my way to 10k feet, my 177RG slows its climb down quite a bit around the 7k foot mark and thats about when the engine has gotten good and heat soaked too. hah. I usually step from 700fpm, to 500fpm to 300fpm in those long climbs. Easy enough to do on the TruTrak, but it sure would be nice to just set it at 90 MPH and forget about it.

I really want auto-trim though. I had one bit of a "surprise" with my TruTrak, that was really my fault. I was in a descent, one that I sort of hand to "step" down as I had to level off to clear some Tennessee mountains. In this whole process of approaching, descending, clearing, and descending, working traffic etc...I totally ignored the TruTrak hollering about nose down trim. I was making power adjustments which I thought was taking care of the trim requirement. While totally focused on watching traffic and planning my entry into the pattern, the TruTrak got tired of hollering for nose down, and it completely disengaged causing my nose to "pop" up and scare the crap out of me! hah. It wasn't a dangerous situation, but during all the busy work that nose popping up wasn't expected and after I took a second or two to realize what the heck was going on, I sort of laughed and thought "the trutrak got tired of yelling at me and said peace out". Having auto-trim would have been really sweet to reduce some of that workload for a new pilot like me.

Having said all that.... those things are not "need to haves" but more like "nice to haves". For the price of the TruTrak I can live without them. There is rumblings that we *might* get IAS climb as an update at some point....since the experimental version has it.
Click to expand...
The experimental version doesn’t have IAS climb. The experimental version is the Vizion 385, which has the exact same features as the certified version. The Sorcerer, which is experimental only, has IAS climb. It also accepts analog Nav inputs for flying a VOR or ILS. That doesn’t mean they can’t add IAS climb to the certified unit, but the experimental unit has the same features of the certified unit.
 
So for a light IFR guy, rare to mins if ever, mostly burger runs and 1k ft ceilings, cancels flights if it even remotely seems like hard IFR, is the Trutrak the way to go or is it spending a few extra Thousand on a GFC gonna be worth the expense?
 
Only you can decide that. I would recommend you get an actual price quote on the systems with installation before making your decision.
 
Jesse Saint said:
The expe

The experimental version doesn’t have IAS climb. The experimental version is the Vizion 385, which has the exact same features as the certified version. The Sorcerer, which is experimental only, has IAS climb. It also accepts analog Nav inputs for flying a VOR or ILS. That doesn’t mean they can’t add IAS climb to the certified unit, but the experimental unit has the same features of the certified unit.
Click to expand...

My mistake.. I was thinking the Sorcerer WAS the experimental version of the Vizion.
 
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