Transcontinental by Archer (Boston to LA)

[eshazen]

Planning a summer trip in my Archer from Boston round trip to LA, stopping both ways in Madison, WI to pick up a co-pilot. Thinking of a northerly outbound route (I90 to around Rapid City, over to Casper, WY and then down between the mountain ranges to Flagstaff, AZ) with a Grand Canyon tour. An alternative would be to pick up I80 around Rawlins and follow it to Salt Lake city, then down to Las Vegas (but missing the Canyon). What do folks who've flown out there have to say about those choices? Is there anything particular to watch out for flying down from Rawlins past Grand Junction to the Grand Canyon area? Is the I80 route to SLC reasonable for a flatlander?

For the return we want to go through Tucson, AZ so we would cross south of the mountains.

Earliest we can get underway would be mid-June, so we expect it to be hot! I'm CP/IA/Multi but no mountain experience other than the White mountains in NH. Well aware of DA issues. Expect to keep the Archer 200-250lb below max TOW.

 

[RyanB]

No real advice, but if you do carry out this plan, please keep us updated on your adventures. I’d love to read all about it!

 

[dans2992]

Consider flying through monument valley. Spectacular views.

 

[sourdough44]

If things work out I have a plan in works for the Grand Canyon & surrounding area the last week in March, heavily weather dependent of course. There is a new Grand Canyon chart download available, freshly updated.

That area will be like an oven mid-later summer. You could alway improvise towards Yellowstone, Glacier Park then the Pacific NW.

 

[JOhnH]

If you could leave a few weeks earlier, perhaps we could link up somewhere along the way. We plan to fly from Daytona Beach to Seattle in late May for a 3-4 week excursion. We will be hitting the Grand Canyon among other spots. Flying a Bonanza V35.

 

[James331]

Both sounds fun, make sure you check out the special chart for the canyon, lots of tours, remember density altitude is a thing. Overall ether sounds fun, might as well check the canyon out.

 

[frfly172]

At that time of year you have to consider,the density altitudes.

 

[MountainDude]

What is the practical ceiling of your plane?

 

[eshazen]

What is the practical ceiling of your plane?

I've cruised at 12500 in the summer when it was pretty hot (with a decent load). Climbed to 13500 once, and it was still climbing. At some point I'll take her up and see how high she'll go. I did take another Archer up to 16,300' once, but that's a story for another time

Mont Blanc (15,777')

 

[dans2992]

I had a Comanche up to 21,500 once. Just testing out new O2 tanks and wanted to see how high it could go.

Never been to the flight levels since. Performance up there with no turbo is.... bad.

 

[James331]

What is the practical ceiling of your plane?

Don’t think you’d need to go that high, did something similar in a loaded 207.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Highly recommend you go with the far-northern route on the way out and stop for a bit in McCall, ID to take a mountain flying course. http://mountaincanyonflying.com/

You can also fly I-80 pretty easily all the way to the west coast. If you're looking to follow roads, US 151 out of Madison will lead you down to I-80 near Cedar Rapids, IA. Suggest you plan a stop at Norfolk, NE where they have decently priced fuel and an on-field restaurant.

On the way back, maybe then you can take the southern route and hit the Grand Canyon. The real trick on the southern route is to point at Las Vegas, NM (KLVS) - The rocks get pretty big just north of there.

Happy to chat more about this, I was based at KMSN for about a decade and now I'm at KUES, about 45nm east of there. I've flown GA to the west coast a few times now, it's a great adventure.

 

[EdFred]

Did a similar trip a few years back in a Cherokee 180D. Route ended up being counter clockwise with the starting point in Michigan.

Trip was in July, Stayed below 10,000ft the whole way except hopping over the last bit of hills in New Mexico. I could have flown a bit further south, and stayed under 10,000 the entire trip.

I have the entire trip documented with daily write ups if you want more info.

 

[cowman]

I've done something similar to this. One way to go is to go to Roswell, go up to the CNX VOR, then head to Palm Springs with a refuel stop inbetween to keep you out of the real high terrain. Then you can go from Palm Springs through a very easy to manage mountain pass and right into the LA area. Best advice is to plan to stop more than you expect and ground yourself in interesting places. Also try to fly through the high elevations in the morning. You WILL notice density altitude in an Archer at a 5,000' elevation field but it can certainly handle it.


https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/ky-to-ca-in-an-archer-ii-how-insane-am-i.109652/

The actual route I ended up with:

 

[James331]

Highly recommend you go with the far-northern route on the way out and stop for a bit in McCall, ID to take a mountain flying course. http://mountaincanyonflying.com/

You can also fly I-80 pretty easily all the way to the west coast. If you're looking to follow roads, US 151 out of Madison will lead you down to I-80 near Cedar Rapids, IA. Suggest you plan a stop at Norfolk, NE where they have decently priced fuel and an on-field restaurant.

On the way back, maybe then you can take the southern route and hit the Grand Canyon. The real trick on the southern route is to point at Las Vegas, NM (KLVS) - The rocks get pretty big just north of there.

Happy to chat more about this, I was based at KMSN for about a decade and now I'm at KUES, about 45nm east of there. I've flown GA to the west coast a few times now, it's a great adventure.

Seems pretty expensive.

Id say CC might be a better bang for the buck for some adventure experience / flight training.

https://www.bush-air.com/school.htm

I've done something similar to this. One way to go is to go to Roswell, go up to the CNX VOR, then head to Palm Springs with a refuel stop inbetween to keep you out of the real high terrain. Then you can go from Palm Springs through a very easy to manage mountain pass and right into the LA area. Best advice is to plan to stop more than you expect and ground yourself in interesting places. Also try to fly through the high elevations in the morning. You WILL notice density altitude in an Archer at a 5,000' elevation field but it can certainly handle it.


https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/threads/ky-to-ca-in-an-archer-ii-how-insane-am-i.109652/

The actual route I ended up with:

Big bear is much more fun, cheaper fuel and just a better experience vs PSP or TRM,
https://www.bigbearcityairport.com/

only good fun around there is up in the high desert
http://www.pappyandharriets.com/

 

[eshazen]

cowman... wow, thanks for the route and a link to the thread! I'll go over it carefully. I really wish I could do it in April. Earliest I think I can possibly manage is departing late May, when it will doubtless be much hotter. That said, probably we won't go quite as far south as you did.

Did you get out to Catalina?

 

[dans2992]

Catalina should be resurfaced by then, which will be good.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Highly recommend you go with the far-northern route on the way out and stop for a bit in McCall, ID to take a mountain flying course. http://mountaincanyonflying.com/

Seems pretty expensive.

Id say CC might be a better bang for the buck for some adventure experience / flight training.

https://www.bush-air.com/school.htm

I dunno, I did a 1-day abbreviated thing there that sounds like it had all the elements of their two-day course, minus about 4 hours of ground. I just paid an hourly rate that was reasonable enough that I don't even remember it... And to this day, that was the best flying and learning experience I've ever had. Being able to fly into the Idaho backcountry is fantastic, and makes it much more than just a mountain course.

 

[BillTIZ]

I’ve flown round robin, Las Vegas to Augusta Maine and return. East out of VGT through Page AZ and then Pueblo CO. Need to watch the La Veta pass SW of Pueblo, it was clear with no issues. After that the rest east bound was easy.

Coming home we went south to Scranton PA, then towards Tullahoma TN, THA. Then west to Sulfer Springs TX, Childress and picked up I-40 to Moriarty NM. Flying west along I-40 is no issue.

Flying along I-80 should be no issue, if you are concerned about high DA, fly early mornings.
I had a T-41B, (C-172 with 210HP), and have hit max altitude in summer around 13K feet.

 

[MountainDude]

I don't see any problem with any of your plans. Please include Sedona valley in your plans. It is gorgeous. Some other nearby places that are incredible from the air:
- San Francisco mountains north of Flagstaff and the volcanic peaks NE of it
- Little Colorado river
- Marble Canyon to Page
- Lake Powell (incredible)
- Monument Valley
- Escalante (north of lake powell)

 

[dans2992]

Yep, yep, and yes. All excellent stuff.

 

[eshazen]

Has anyone landed at Grand Canyon Caverns airport (L37) recently? It's gravel, and there's a report from several years ago which reported that it was a bit soft. Looks like an entertaining stop- fly in, visit the caverns.

 

[Morgan Green]

What an awesome plan and sounds like a great time!

 

[murphey]

Planning a summer trip in my Archer from Boston round trip to LA, stopping both ways in Madison, WI to pick up a co-pilot. Thinking of a northerly outbound route (I90 to around Rapid City, over to Casper, WY and then down between the mountain ranges to Flagstaff, AZ) with a Grand Canyon tour. An alternative would be to pick up I80 around Rawlins and follow it to Salt Lake city, then down to Las Vegas (but missing the Canyon). What do folks who've flown out there have to say about those choices? Is there anything particular to watch out for flying down from Rawlins past Grand Junction to the Grand Canyon area? Is the I80 route to SLC reasonable for a flatlander?

For the return we want to go through Tucson, AZ so we would cross south of the mountains.

Earliest we can get underway would be mid-June, so we expect it to be hot! I'm CP/IA/Multi but no mountain experience other than the White mountains in NH. Well aware of DA issues. Expect to keep the Archer 200-250lb below max TOW.

Rule of thumb for out west --- lose 10% of your gross weight, e.g. for 2400# archer, leave out at least 240# of stuff.

 

[N1120A]

Tucson can be deceptive for DA, because it isn't THAT high, but gets so damn hot there. Also watch out for runway closures that cause you to take off into less than ideal winds. Get into a headwind as soon as you can to climb and protect your cylinders.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Tucson can be deceptive for DA, because it isn't THAT high, but gets so damn hot there. Also watch out for runway closures that cause you to take off into less than ideal winds. Get into a headwind as soon as you can to climb and protect your cylinders.

How will a headwind protect your cylinders?

 

[N1120A]

How will a headwind protect your cylinders?

Can climb at a higher airspeed, with the nose further down

 

[dans2992]

Can climb at a higher airspeed, with the nose further down

Maybe it matters if you’re trying to out climb terrain, but that’s about it.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

Can climb at a higher airspeed, with the nose further down

You can do that regardless of wind, as long as you're not pointing at rocks. A headwind or a lateral route allowing for a low climb gradient will both allow extra speed to cool the jugs. Even an IFR Archer in Tuscon can still make it out via the ODP.

VFR... Well, I'd climb VFR at the desired airspeed, and if that didn't work, I'd go with ridge lift if possible and trained! Did that out of Spanish Fork, UT last summer. Had my VSI pegged at +2000 fpm climbing through 9500... Whee! Not bad for 70% or so power at best.

 

[eshazen]

Yes, thanks for the D/A and heat reminders. I'd already heard the "10% below gross" rule and we will do our best to follow it. Even out here on the east coast it gets hot enough occasionally that I have to practice my "constant oil temperature climb"

 

[murphey]

Maybe it matters if you’re trying to out climb terrain, but that’s about it.

Unless you're heading due north, Tucson area is fairly flat, not much reason to out climb terrain.

 

[cowman]

High DA day in the flatlands: "Oh, gee I'm climbing kinda slower than normal. Look at that DA hehe."

High DA day in high altitude areas: "OH #$&*@! am I even climbing? "

Also worth noting is when starting up/taxiing/taking off from a high elevation you don't want to have the mixture full rich like you're used to. I'm honestly not the expert on this as I only had to do it once but I just kind of estimated it by setting the mixture to a little richer than it would normally be around that altitude. Seemed to work OK. There might be better methods.

 

[eshazen]

Trip is underway! Writing this from Sedona, AZ which is currently one of my favorite spots in the USA! Beautiful red rocks all around, lots and lots of hiking trails, great airport.

Day 1 -- BED to C29 (Bedford, MA to Middleton WI)

Departing runway 29 Bedford

Wachusett Reservoir in MA

Umass Amherst campus

Adirondack mountains

Mohawk River (upstate NY)

Niagara Falls

Approaching Port Huron

 

[eshazen]

Day 2 - June 9th. C29 to 6V4 (Middleton WI to Wall SD)

Filed IFR. Stopped in Austin, MN and Pierre SD. Mostly above overcast so not much to see.

Fuel stop in Pierre, SD

Wall, SD

Seeing the sights in Wall!

I have no pride

 

[eshazen]

June 10th -- Wall to Casper WY via Badlands, Rushmore, Devils Tower.
Beautiful weather, not much wind, so smooth sailing. Badlands really spectacular.
Rushmore not very impressive from the air,
but Devil's tower much nicer. Too bad I only have my iPhone camera!

Stopped in Gillette, WY for lunch. My impression is that seeing that place from the air
is enough! Nice airport and FBO though. Then on to Casper, WY where we spent two
nights visiting my sister.

The Badlands

Black Hills

Mt Rushmore (not very impressive from altitude)

Lead and Deadwood (open pit mine)

Devil's Tower

Big Tits (oh, sorry, I forget their real name) near Devil's Tower

Industry alive and well outside Gillette, WY

 

[eshazen]

June 12th: Casper, WY to Marble Canyon (L41)

This was a fantastic day! Gorgeous scenery down behind the front range, Arches, Canyonlands, Lake Powell, then down into Marble Canyon.
Winds aloft at 10,500 were light and variable, remarkably, so it was smooth the whole way. Visibility around 100 miles! Could see the Wind River range and Bighorns with snowy peaks in the far distance.

We spent the night at Marble Canyon Lodge. It's basically a motel with attached restaurant and gift shop. Not fancy but comfortable and not expensive (around $85 for a night). Flying in to the canyon was the highlight of the trip so far!

Alcova Reservoir outside Casper

Pathfinder reservoir

Near Rawlins, WY

Snowy peaks of the front range from near Meeker

My navigator Schuyler doin' it the old fashioned way!
Yes, we brought every sectional chart for the whole trip.

Descending into Rifle

Grand Junction

Departing Grand Junction

Near Moab

Near Moab

Unnatural colors (chemistry at work!) near Moab

Dead Horse Point State Park

Heading down into Marble Canyon from Page

Marble Canyon. If you look closely you can spot the 35' wide runway in the middle!

Not a very big target!

Made it! On the ground in Marble Canyon

The little airport is great! They have just repaved it so it's quite smooth. Parking on asphalt for around 6 planes, and if you want to tie down you can push back on the gravel where there are some chains.

The canyon

Navajo Bridges

↑

 

[eshazen]

June 13th -- over the Grand Canyon to Flagstaff.
After all the build-up, the flight over the canyon was not all that exciting.
For one thing, the weather changed, so it was a bit hazy and there was significant wind
so we were fighting turbulence the whole flight. Spectacular, nonetheless.

We fueled up at Page before heading out. What a busy place! All the tours operate
out of there. Don't fuel at the first FBO (Jet Center), go down around the corner to Classic
where the fuel is much cheaper.

Here's the runway at Marble in the early AM

The Dam at Lake Powell

Heading down Marble Canyon

Heading down the Zuni corridor

A small fire on the south rim

 

[eshazen]

Bedtime here. Stay tuned for more!

 

[AGLyme]

GREAT post... love the pics. General Aviation is the best.

 

[Pilawt]

Outstanding photos. Keep 'em coming!