Time Building Problem

D

Dane R

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Apr 12, 2018
Messages
15
Location
TX
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Display name:
drosey44
Hello all!

I'm an 18 year old newly ticketed private pilot. I move into college in 4 weeks. Originally I had planned to complete my instrument rating before school started, but getting my PPL took longer than expected due to many different reasons. I do want to fly as a career so obviously I need to build hours, preferably as quick as possible so I can obtain my commercial ticket and start getting paid to fly. I plan on completing my instrument rating during Thanksgiving break or Christmas break when I can train at my flight school back home.

Point is, I'd like to fly while at school, to remain proficient as well as build hours. (I only have 50 hours)

The problem: There is no access to airplanes in my college town. There are 3 airports within a 45 minute drive of my college and none of them have any aircraft rental opportunities. We've looked into flight clubs as a financially efficient way to build hours, but the nearest flight club is about an hour and a half away. It seems like my only option right now is to drive 2 hours back to my home airport just to be able to rent airplanes, but that would get pretty expensive considering my car gets about 14 mpg. Also, it seems like it would take me significantly longer to get to 250 hours if I was restricted to only flying on breaks and summers.

My parents and I have looked into buying an airplane and hangaring it at an airport near my school. We've also looked into partial ownership of an airplane but we have no clue how to find partners in my college's city. I've also heard about people leasing airplanes but I don't know how that works at all. This is all new and fairly confusing to us, as I don't come from a flying family, so I figured I'd ask you guys for any ideas. We're trying to figure out numbers and find the cheapest way to go about earning my hours. Open to just about anything. Thank you all!
 
Give us an idea where you are and maybe somebody here knows somebody there. The is is a pretty big community all across the country.
 
Mike Smith said:
Give us an idea where you are and maybe somebody here knows somebody there. The is is a pretty big community all across the country.
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I'll be attending Baylor University in Waco, Texas. 2 hours south of Dallas, 1 1/2 hours north of Austin.
 
Find an IFR Cessna 150. You could get one in the $20,000 range. You don't need a wiz bang glass cockpit to get an instrument rating. A friend went that route and got his private, instrument and commercial ( rented an Arrow for the complex) in a 150 and sold it for what he paid for it. Bought a Cessna 170 to build tailwheel hours and in two years started flying a Thrush AG plane that was his goal at the start.
 
I would recommend checking out the Texas Soaring Assocation it Midlotian. They may have opportunities to build time towing gliders. Would also look good on you resume to have a commercial Glider certificate and a reasonable amount of glider time. Looks like about 1:15 hours drive. Might be worth considering getting an economy car. Frequently glider operations might have a bunk house available for spending the night, I couldn’t tell if they do or not from the web site.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
brcase said:
I would recommend checking out the Texas Soaring Assocation it Midlotian. They may have opportunities to build time towing gliders. Would also look good on you resume to have a commercial Glider certificate and a reasonable amount of glider time. Looks like about 1:15 hours drive. Might be worth considering getting an economy car. Frequently glider operations might have a bunk house available for spending the night, I couldn’t tell if they do or not from the web site.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
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Looks like I'd need 100 hours of tailwheel time to be a tow pilot according to their website.
 
YakDriver makes a good recommendation. I would also suggest considering a C-172. Go ahead and get your Inst/Comm and CFI by next summer. Then offer to teach students from your college (or the local area) in whichever airplane you get. This way you'll be building time AND making a few bucks.

If you can get 1000 hours w/ 500 PIC time by the time you graduate, there may be a King Air job (no ME required to get the job) if you're interested.
 
@Dane R .... Being at Baylor, I'm really surprised you haven't found some folks at KATC willing to share their planes.

Post a few notices on the FBO bulletin boards. And walk the hangar row getting to know the neighbors and leaving them a card saying that you are looking for flight opportunities. Shoe Leather and Networking can work wonders.

And you should go find Aaron Dabney, a really good flight instructor in the Waco area with a really nice Piper Cub. http://www.masterthetailwheel.com/about

And time building is about time in thee air, not going fast. So a Cub can be perfect for that. Not to mention it will teach you how to use your feet.
 
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murphey said:
Once you get settled at school, look into the various organizations at Baylor. You might find an aviation club, and a couple of members might be interested to share the cost of a 150/152.

Best bet is to head over to Texas State Tech College, which has both an A&P school and pilot,training. You may find a couple pilot students that want to partner in a 150/152.

http://www.tstc.edu/programs/AircraftPilotTrainingTechnology

http://www.tstc.edu/campuses/waco
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@Dane R ... Like more and more universities, Baylor offers a professional aviation program that can be a "zero to hero" program for those wanting to be a professional pilot. And the flying part of their program is done at TSTC.

So as Murphey suggested, talking to the folks at TSTC and at Baylor's Aviation Program might be worth your time.


If you don't ask the questions, you will never know the answers.
 
AggieMike88 said:
@Dane R ... Like more and more universities, Baylor offers a professional aviation program that can be a "zero to hero" program for those wanting to be a professional pilot. And the flying part of their program is done at TSTC.

So as Murphey suggested, talking to the folks at TSTC and at Baylor's Aviation Program might be worth your time.


If you don't ask the questions, you will never know the answers.
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Hey Mike! So I was actually going to major in Baylor's Aviation program until I decided that if crap hits the fan and I can't get a medical anymore, I wouldn't have much to fall back on. Therefore, I am getting a business degree from Baylor basically as a Plan B. With that being said, I do have Aviation as a secondary major/double major, I just won't be flying in the program at TSTC. I'll be taking 27 hours of aviation classes such as meteorology, accident investigation, etc. just because everything aviation is my passion and I figure these kind of classes would help me be a better pilot.

Also, it's funny you mention Aaron Dabney, I actually have him as my professor for one of my aviation classes the fall semester!
 
Dane R said:
So I was actually going to major in Baylor's Aviation program until I decided that if crap hits the fan and I can't get a medical anymore, I wouldn't have much to fall back on. Therefore, I am getting a business degree from Baylor basically as a Plan B.
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Smart!
 
I can’t believe there are no opportunities for aircraft rental in Waco... it’s a good sized airport. I’d bet with more digging you’ll find something. There’s probably an EAA chapter in the area or a local pilots group, good ways to meet folks.
 
Wait a minute. You’re young, starting out & want to fly for a living? You also want to fly while away at college? You seem to be putting more resources into your ‘backup plan’ than primary plan.

It’s true, there are no guarantees with most things. One needs motivation and faith at times to more forward. One thing about ‘backup plans’, it’s not so much in the degree, but the individual. What I mean is, some can land in their feet no matter what life throws at them. Then there are others that make things difficult even starting with a few silver spoons stuck in their mouth.

I would get on the faster track towards an aviation future. There may not be a lot of time to rearrange things for this Fall. There are plenty of ‘mid-tier’ avaiation schools that will speed things up for you. You’ll never get things done trying to fit flight training into Christmas break, or whatever. Just some ideas.
 
sourdough44 said:
Wait a minute. You’re young, starting out & want to fly for a living? You also want to fly while away at college? You seem to be putting more resources into your ‘backup plan’ than primary plan.

It’s true, there are no guarantees with most things. One needs motivation and faith at times to more forward. One thing about ‘backup plans’, it’s not so much in the degree, but the individual. What I mean is, some can land in their feet no matter what life throws at them. Then there are others that make things difficult even starting with a few silver spoons stuck in their mouth.

I would get on the faster track towards an aviation future. There may not be a lot of time to rearrange things for this Fall. There are plenty of ‘mid-tier’ avaiation schools that will speed things up for you. You’ll never get things done trying to fit flight training into Christmas break, or whatever. Just some ideas.
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I read business degree was Plan B. So he’s putting lots of effort into Plan A.

Baylor is a good school and a degree from there will do you well. You’re 18, so odds are fair you will decide next year that maybe you like something else better and just want to do something related to aviation but not fly for a living. Don’t forget to have some fun while you’re in college. You may have to take a trip down Highway 6 for a better chance at that. I might be a little biased, though.
 
Dane R said:
Also, it's funny you mention Aaron Dabney, I actually have him as my professor for one of my aviation classes the fall semester!
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As I said... Aaron is a very good instructor and someone very worth having in your Aviation Community Network. And as such, he might know of airplane owners who are willing to allow others to fly their planes once the appropriate checkouts have been done.
 
aggie06 said:
I read business degree was Plan B. So he’s putting lots of effort into Plan A.

Baylor is a good school and a degree from there will do you well. You’re 18, so odds are fair you will decide next year that maybe you like something else better and just want to do something related to aviation but not fly for a living. Don’t forget to have some fun while you’re in college. You may have to take a trip down Highway 6 for a better chance at that. I might be a little biased, though.
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Nah, I35. More people, more variety, same distance.
 
aggie06 said:
You may have to take a trip down Highway 6 for a better chance at that. I might be a little biased, though.
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When I was at Texas A&M during the Eighties, I knew I wanted to be a pilot. But never really pursued it. Now a days, I still give myself a mental kick in the rumpus for not taking advantage of the very cheap (even back then) flight training that was available. I think the flying club was a university recognized organization and got some funding, helping to keep costs of operating the club in the very reasonable range.

@Dane R .... For the "middle term" timeline, once you're at Baylor, you might become the guy who organizes the flying club. At first, it just might be a study group for the various exams, but no airplanes. But once a certain number are part of the group, you begin organizing for the purpose of purchasing an aircraft. Or find someone who will lease the club an aircraft, and you help to launch a non-equity club around it.

For non equity club organization, AOPA's Pat Brown (from KIWS in Houston) can provide you resources. And for running and promoting the club, we have several folks here that are very successful at it, including Kent (@flyingcheesehead) and Christy (@Christy Wong)
 
AggieMike88 said:
Now a days, I still give myself a mental kick in the rumpus for not taking advantage of the very cheap (even back then) flight training that was available.
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I do the same thing. I wish I had learned when I was in College Station and it was cheap.
 
You may also check out Temple for a flying club there. Not too far away from you.
 
Dane R said:
Hello all!

I'm an 18 year old newly ticketed private pilot. I move into college in 4 weeks. Originally I had planned to complete my instrument rating before school started, but getting my PPL took longer than expected due to many different reasons. I do want to fly as a career so obviously I need to build hours, preferably as quick as possible so I can obtain my commercial ticket and start getting paid to fly. I plan on completing my instrument rating during Thanksgiving break or Christmas break when I can train at my flight school back home.

Point is, I'd like to fly while at school, to remain proficient as well as build hours. (I only have 50 hours)

The problem: There is no access to airplanes in my college town. There are 3 airports within a 45 minute drive of my college and none of them have any aircraft rental opportunities. We've looked into flight clubs as a financially efficient way to build hours, but the nearest flight club is about an hour and a half away. It seems like my only option right now is to drive 2 hours back to my home airport just to be able to rent airplanes, but that would get pretty expensive considering my car gets about 14 mpg. Also, it seems like it would take me significantly longer to get to 250 hours if I was restricted to only flying on breaks and summers.

My parents and I have looked into buying an airplane and hangaring it at an airport near my school. We've also looked into partial ownership of an airplane but we have no clue how to find partners in my college's city. I've also heard about people leasing airplanes but I don't know how that works at all. This is all new and fairly confusing to us, as I don't come from a flying family, so I figured I'd ask you guys for any ideas. We're trying to figure out numbers and find the cheapest way to go about earning my hours. Open to just about anything. Thank you all!
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Hey Dane. I know you said you were looking to buy a plane, possibly. Have you seen this one?

https://columbiamo.craigslist.org/avo/d/great-classic-1961-piper-colt/6627535030.html
 
Baylor has to have a flying club. SMU is a tenth the size and has one. They'll have connections to rental planes. At worst that will be where you find a partner to buy your first plane. Very surprised there's nothing to rent at KACT.
 
Shouldn’t have a problem finding a rental between Waco, Temple, Belton, McGregor, Killeen and others. I flew out of Temple and Killeen for a couple of years when I worked out of Killeen.
 
Answering the original question: AOPA's flying club network shows a club at KTPL 37 minutes away. https://www.facebook.com/templeaeroclub/
Rentals/Instruction may be available here: http://texasaero.com/ here: https://www.s3inc.com/home/kbfs-home/

Now, on to the plan... I'll just get to the point. You've got the plan backwards. Your desired career is in a strong job market and you have the resources in the Baylor aviation program to enter it well trained and ready to start work. They have resources to help place you in your first job. And going through the aviation science major gets you the ability to get all of your hours and training in 4 years, and reduces the ATP hours requirement to 1000 instead of 1500. That 500 hour difference is at least 2-3 years of trying to build time on your own.

The business idea is great. Make it a minor and add an internship in business to that and you'll have enough on your resume to get your foot in the door should you need plan B.

Majoring in Plan B puts you years behind on plan A.
 
Eric Gleason said:
Answering the original question: AOPA's flying club network shows a club at KTPL 37 minutes away. https://www.facebook.com/templeaeroclub/
Rentals/Instruction may be available here: http://texasaero.com/ here: https://www.s3inc.com/home/kbfs-home/

Now, on to the plan... I'll just get to the point. You've got the plan backwards. Your desired career is in a strong job market and you have the resources in the Baylor aviation program to enter it well trained and ready to start work. They have resources to help place you in your first job. And going through the aviation science major gets you the ability to get all of your hours and training in 4 years, and reduces the ATP hours requirement to 1000 instead of 1500. That 500 hour difference is at least 2-3 years of trying to build time on your own.

The business idea is great. Make it a minor and add an internship in business to that and you'll have enough on your resume to get your foot in the door should you need plan B.

Majoring in Plan B puts you years behind on plan A.
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I do understand what you’re saying. A lot of my decision also had to do with the price Baylor was charging for their professional aviation program. We are saving upwards of 40-50k by doing my training on the side. Also, they struggle with aircraft availability. If we’re going to pay all that money, I’d want an airplane available when i want it.
 
Dane R said:
I do understand what you’re saying. A lot of my decision also had to do with the price Baylor was charging for their professional aviation program. We are saving upwards of 40-50k by doing my training on the side. Also, they struggle with aircraft availability. If we’re going to pay all that money, I’d want an airplane available when i want it.
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I think your plan is fine.
 
Dane R said:
Hey Mike! So I was actually going to major in Baylor's Aviation program until I decided that if crap hits the fan and I can't get a medical anymore, I wouldn't have much to fall back on. Therefore, I am getting a business degree from Baylor basically as a Plan B. With that being said, I do have Aviation as a secondary major/double major, I just won't be flying in the program at TSTC. I'll be taking 27 hours of aviation classes such as meteorology, accident investigation, etc. just because everything aviation is my passion and I figure these kind of classes would help me be a better pilot.
Click to expand...

You know that the aviation degree can help you with more than just being a pilot right? In fact, having a degree isn't strictly necessary to be a pilot if you have a commercial ticket, 1000 hours and a pulse. The aviation degree will give you credentials to work in non-flying jobs in the aviation industry, of which there are many.

From the web page at: https://www.baylor.edu/aviation/index.php?id=940432

A recent study has shown that the best performing pilots have obtained flight instructor certification, received advanced pilot training in college, and graduated with collegiate aviation degrees - all of which you will achieve at Baylor University!​

There you go - sounds like the route you really want. You're young, grab the brass ring.
 
Dane R said:
I do understand what you’re saying. A lot of my decision also had to do with the price Baylor was charging for their professional aviation program. We are saving upwards of 40-50k by doing my training on the side. Also, they struggle with aircraft availability. If we’re going to pay all that money, I’d want an airplane available when i want it.
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Are you sure about those figures? Some quick math in my head makes that seem more than optimistic. And don't forget the opportunity costs. You'll spend a couple of years making up that extra 500 hours, and the difference in salary between a right seater in a regional jet and what you'll make towing gliders or whatever is pretty staggering.

Between what you'll spend on owning/renting and making less money, I think you'll eat up most of what you think you'll save. And you won't have the career placement advantages that graduates of the aviation professional program will have.
 
If you’re looking to build time I’d highly recommend looking for a N3 pup with a N number, or one that you could somewhat easily get a N number, normally they can be had for under $8k and burn like 2GPH of autofuel, also you can do some backcountry with them which will put you far ahead of the ATP Inc types.
1546301.jpg
 
ClaxStarr said:
James have you seen any for sale lately?
I only see one for sale... hoping he responds, there isn’t a date on the add.
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Over the last 6mo a few, but I need to adult better and I have a 185 so I haven’t bought one, but for your mission a N3 would rock
 
aggie06 said:
You may also check out Temple for a flying club there. Not too far away from you.
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You just need to get yer sectional out and drop by, or make phone calls using Google to the airports in driving distance. Waco, despite what some of us think, is smack dab in decent aviation country. From your first post I'd have thought you were headed to the middle of Idaho or something.
 
Dane R said:
Hello all!

I plan on completing my instrument rating during Thanksgiving break or Christmas break when I can train at my flight school back home.

Point is, I'd like to fly while at school, to remain proficient as well as build hours. (I only have 50 hours)
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That's a very aggressive and IMO optimistic expectation regardless of whether you're able to build time while at school or not. I wasn't on any kind of career track like you but I did my private in under 50 hours and three months time. I flew VFR for a few years afterward renting from FBO's and joining a flying club that was a little over an hour away. Did lots of XC's VFR for lunches and whatnot. Then I partnered in a plane based at the airport in my home town and I started working on my instrument. Flying two and three times a week, it took almost six months. Doing commercial afterward only took a month, but the instrument training took a long time. Not saying you couldn't do it over a couple college breaks but boy it sure seems like quite a few stars would have to align favorably to pull it off.

Its good to have a plan and there's nothing wrong with having high expectations. But don't be too disappointed if you end up having to revise your timeline a little. Aviation is still going to be there when you get the certs no matter how long it takes.
 
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