Thoughts on Seattle Avionics (FlyQ) company purchase?

Interesting.... I remember when SA was creating that horrible "MyWingMan" for Bendix, I think FlyQ used the same early base code.
 
My instinct is that this is probably only good news for the founders (who generally make a bundle when their hard-built company is gobbled by a larger one). There's also a bit of irony in that the company is now gushing about how great it will be for them to be part of a bigger enterprise with deeper pockets, but they had some uncomplimentary things to say about Foreflight when they were bought by Boeing (the innovation will end, loss of interest in the little guy end of the market, etc.). Looking over the company that bought them, I'm left scratching my head a bit (what the heck is the "skateboard division" about?). Lots of buzzwords flying about, which tends to make me wary. Time will tell.
 
Hopefully the new owner makes the FlyIQ product more relevant by integrating with Garmin equipment. Huge growth potential. I liked FlyIQ, however they self-limited their market by fencing out Garmin.

Next few posts are Garmin haters with a different point of view....
 
My understanding has been that Seattle Avionics would dearly love to have FlyQ working (directly) with Garmin gear, but it's Garmin that won't play nice with them (they say it's Garmin's decision, not Seattle Avionics, but held open the possibility that if enough people asked nicely, Garmin might come around eventually). As a FlyQ user with a Garmin GTX345, I'd welcome their handshake...but it doesn't look like Garmin is willing (seems to me that Seattle Avionics needs Garmin more than Garmin needs them, so Seattle Avionics is reduced to suggesting users send Garmin a nice note asking pretty please, not a strong bargaining position). I could be wrong.
 
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I expect subscription prices will soon match FF and Garmin. Oh well!
 
From a legal standpoint, the sale cannot wipe out lifetime subscriptions. Someone has to have that liability and the resources necessary to deliver on the promise. To do otherwise IIRC is called a fraudulent conveyance. Almost certainly the buyer either bought the corporation intact, so the obligation is unchanged, or he bought the assets of the corporation and assumed the liability.

That and $25K in legal bills might enable you to retain your lifetime subscription in the event the acquirer tries to pull the plug.
 
airdale said:
From a legal standpoint, the sale cannot wipe out lifetime subscriptions. Someone has to have that liability and the resources necessary to deliver on the promise. To do otherwise IIRC is called a fraudulent conveyance. Almost certainly the buyer either bought the corporation intact, so the obligation is unchanged, or he bought the assets of the corporation and assumed the liability.

That and $25K in legal bills might enable you to retain your lifetime subscription in the event the acquirer tries to pull the plug.
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The question would be: lifetime to what? What happens as subscription levels move around? Products change names? There's almost always a legal out for "lifetime" anything.
 
arnoha said:
The question would be: lifetime to what? What happens as subscription levels move around? Products change names? There's almost always a legal out for "lifetime" anything.
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Good point. At one point Garmin was offering "lifetime" data subscriptions for its consumer GPS products. "Lifetime of what?" Well, it turned out that "lifetime" referred to the lifetime of the product as determined by Garmin.
 
Have you ever known a small company that was gobbled up by a bigger one that resulted in lower prices, better quality and an interface that you didn't have to relearn because all the original coders left and the new ones thought they could re-invent the wheel? I read it with nothing but disappointment. Data plan paid up until 2023... that gives the free ones enough time to catch up. The old owners always say the same thing as they call their yacht salesperson. . .
 
I was a little surprised by the sale. As a lifetime subscriber it will be interesting to see what transpires.
 
I have about a year left on a three year FlyQ subscription. It'll be interesting to see if they offer the same kind of deals anymore. I have a Garmin GTX345 but I do get ADS-B traffic and weather on FlyQ, it comes thru my IFD440.
 
I hope they put the extra resources to make a version that works well on android. My ipad is pretty much only used for flying or to play white noise to put my baby to sleep.
 
I hope the new owners consider smoking the Garmin Peace Pipe.

I had to ditch it when I got the Garmin Stack in the plane. I didn't want to do an exercise in concessions and compromise with my new investment.
 
As a lifetime subscriber, I don't see much on the positive side that might come of this but I am afraid that the "lifetime" of the FLYQ product might come to an end while they start up a new product.
I also doubt they'll be an interconnectivity improvement with Garmin products as Garmin is very proprietary and has a business model that intentionally isolates their products.
 
I agree with a lot of the comments so far. I am glad I didn’t make the switch when my FF subscription came do earlier this year. Lesson here: nothing is forever. Not even Garmin.
 
Rgbeard said:
I hope the new owners consider smoking the Garmin Peace Pipe.

I had to ditch it when I got the Garmin Stack in the plane. I didn't want to do an exercise in concessions and compromise with my new investment.
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i dont see garmin agreeing to it unless SA discontinues their agreements with dynon.
 
I have a lifetime subscription too but am making the move to Garmin Pilot. My new plane's ADSB doesn't talk to FlyQ.
 
I Fly Low 'n Slow said:
My understanding has been that Seattle Avionics would dearly love to have FlyQ working (directly) with Garmin gear, but it's Garmin that won't play nice with them (they say it's Garmin's decision, not Seattle Avionics, but held open the possibility that if enough people asked nicely, Garmin might come around eventually). As a FlyQ user with a Garmin GTX345, I'd welcome their handshake...but it doesn't look like Garmin is willing (seems to me that Seattle Avionics needs Garmin more than Garmin needs them, so Seattle Avionics is reduced to suggesting users send Garmin a nice note asking pretty please, not a strong bargaining position). I could be wrong.
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I think Garmin would dearly love to have a completely walled garden. They only play nice with ForeFlight because ForeFlight's market share is so large that it might have caused Garmin's hardware sales to drop if they didn't. Supposedly, Jepp worked with Garmin first to bring their plates to an outside EFB, but got very few takers due to Garmin Pilot's smallish market share. Then, they went onto ForeFlight and got a lot more takers, and ForeFlight rewrote the Jepp EFB as well.
 
NealRomeoGolf said:
I have a lifetime subscription too but am making the move to Garmin Pilot. My new plane's ADSB doesn't talk to FlyQ.
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Which is the reason I went with L3. It hands out ADSB info like candy. Even lets the 430W know there's traffic.

I feel sorry for anyone that decided Garmin ADSB was a good option.
 
EdFred said:
Which is the reason I went with L3. It hands out ADSB info like candy. Even lets the 430W know there's traffic.

I feel sorry for anyone that decided Garmin ADSB was a good option.
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The L3 (the NGT-9000? with the screen) is a nice unit... But it won't play well with my Garmin GPS, sharing only traffic and not weather. I believe that is Garmin's fault, not L3's, but the Garmin ADS-B gives me much better functionality. So no need to feel sorry for me. :p
 
So far I'm liking GP but I find FlyQ's flight planning to be easier. Heading up to TVC tomorrow to see a friend and will be my first flight with GP.
 
airdale said:
From a legal standpoint, the sale cannot wipe out lifetime subscriptions. Someone has to have that liability and the resources necessary to deliver on the promise. To do otherwise IIRC is called a fraudulent conveyance. Almost certainly the buyer either bought the corporation intact, so the obligation is unchanged, or he bought the assets of the corporation and assumed the liability.

That and $25K in legal bills might enable you to retain your lifetime subscription in the event the acquirer tries to pull the plug.
Click to expand...

I didn't go back and find/review the original agreement, but a lifetime subscription could be easily nullified if it contained a clause that states that the license terms may be changed or voided if the company is acquired. Simple as that.
 
NealRomeoGolf said:
So far I'm liking GP but I find FlyQ's flight planning to be easier. Heading up to TVC tomorrow to see a friend and will be my first flight with GP.
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I've kept both GP and FlyQ subscriptions for this reason. I have the IFR subscription of FlyQ, cheaper than Garmin Pilot and I really like the flight planning on FlyQ. I've kept the VFR subscription of GP mainly for the log book. I do use GP in flight for traffic and weather too. I really like being able to generate log book reports from fly.garmin.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
The L3 (the NGT-9000? with the screen) is a nice unit... But it won't play well with my Garmin GPS, sharing only traffic and not weather. I believe that is Garmin's fault, not L3's, but the Garmin ADS-B gives me much better functionality. So no need to feel sorry for me. :p
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The L3 unit shares the info. The Garmin unit refuses ro display it. How do I know that? Because every other device out there shows it. Wait until Boeing and Garmin decide they don't want to play together and we will see how much you love Garmin.

But you also prefer your horticulture with barriers, so the defense and justification of Garmin is expected.
 
EdFred said:
The L3 unit shares the info. The Garmin unit refuses ro display it.
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I know... Like I said, it's Garmin's fault.

That doesn't change the fact that it doesn't work with my GPS so the Garmin is a better ADS-B solution for me, contrary to what you said. No need to feel sorry for me.

But you also prefer your horticulture with barriers
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:rofl: Good one! :)

I do like at least two walled-garden solutions, but in both cases, the walled garden tends to be a good thing for me, simply because I have multiple devices that all play really well together inside that walled garden. If I have "free and open" devices that I have to mess with to make work, and that still don't work as well together, that is not a net positive, because the walled gardens don't really keep me from doing anything I want to do.
 
Well my first contact with the new company: I wonder if it is just me, so I'm posting this: When I was using FlyQ web edition it used to populate the left window with all the airports listed on my view. Now it is blank, and I have to click on a certain airport to pull up the information - and what used to be a list of area airports in the left window is now a pop-up only if you click on the map to bring it up (good luck if you have pop up blocker I suppose). Secondly, it used to open the right window to a view of my local area. Now I have to click on the stack of papers and go through the options and then do that again when I reloads later in the day. It used to just open up over my home field. I'm a paid up customer for the app.

So I wrote to product support. Guess what. It's not a Woodinville number anymore. . . AFV Partners - Aviation Data & Technology "customer service" out of Colorado. I'm in the midst of three emails. Steve P. used to email directly if you had a problem and explain if it was on my end or another. So far, with the email change there is a deer in the headlights sort of thing going on with knowledge of the website programming. If I had to guess it's that someone fiddled with it and swept away a few features. Or it could be with my browser. Or its what happens when a holding company buys out a company. Notice, AFV is "holding company" not a software developer.
 
I was just thinking of the company the other day. I stopped using the web flight planning and wait until I'm around my iPad instead. I just happened to buy a lifetime subscription months before the AFV company buyout. I had hopes maybe the extra resources would mean I could someday use the software on Android. Not looking good after reading this last post.
 
They're probably here to monetize their acquired assets, and kick it when it's done.

Good luck to Fly-Q users. I used to be one and liked their product.

I've seen too many good software products get acquired and then treated poorly. "Milked the cow 'til it died" is a descriptive choice of words.

If they don't have a coding staff.... well......
 
I just renewed in March and have tried to contact support for both my airplane not being listed as an option, they don't have an option for mogas in the fuel section, and they don't seem to have a method of creating custom checklists.

In total it was 2 separate emails in a span of about 35 days, haven't heard any replies about either. If this doesn't improve, I'll end up having to go to ForeFlight for all their options even though I'm restricted to VFR. WingX doesn't have the features I'm looking for either.
 
Sounds like what happened to Remington, Bushmaster, and Marlin when acquired by Cerebus Holdings. “Milked to death” is an apt description.

I’m a satisfied user of FlyQ for several years. As a CFI, it only costs $19.95/yr.
I now expect that too, to evaporate...
 
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