Thinking about a Ford F 150 Ecoboost

[Dave Arata]

I don't see the value.

That's EXACTLY where I'm at. I've got a 1995 Mastercraft Prostar 190 in phenomenal shape. Bought it 8 years ago for $8000.00 with 180 hours on it. A 2021 Prostar 190 retails for around $80k. Is it better than my boat? In every way, yes. But, is it ten times better? Not a chance. That's the value for me. If floats, starts every time and has a silky smooth wake. The old school slalom guys occasionally give the passing thumbs up, so there's that. Similar to my old and ugly Armada. Can a new F-150 do everything the Armada can? Absolutely, and do everything better. But, is it worth the asking price? Not to me.

 

[Ted]

The move to direct injection plays a pretty big part in aiding the higher compressions and keeping things cooler on the intake charge. Most of those turbo'd engines from the 90's/00's were around 8.5:1 compression, where the EB v6 is a 10:1 compression setup. Lots of good tech that made its way into the engine platform.

Direct injection, variable cam timing/lift, better turbos and intercooling, better ignition systems, better cylinder head and combustion chamber designs, and complex engine algorithms.

 

[SoonerAviator]

That's EXACTLY where I'm at. I've got a 1995 Mastercraft Prostar 190 in phenomenal shape. Bought it 8 years ago for $8000.00 with 180 hours on it. A 2021 Prostar 190 retails for around $80k. Is it better than my boat? In every way, yes. But, is it ten times better? Not a chance. That's the value for me. If floats, starts every time and has a silky smooth wake. The old school slalom guys occasionally give the passing thumbs up, so there's that. Similar to my old and ugly Armada. Can a new F-150 do everything the Armada can? Absolutely, and do everything better. But, is it worth the asking price? Not to me.

Also why I still run my 1976 open bow runabout with a 351w. Although, I've been eyeing the early '00s Cobalt 262 models now that they've come down out of the stratosphere. Can pick them up for about $40K versus a new Cobalt 26-footer at $150K+. Absurd prices in boats even with some record volumes the last year or two.

 

[Half Fast]

Ford (and I'm sure others) have done some interesting things to allow turbos, high boost, and high output on the modern engines while also getting really good fuel economy and running 87. My understanding is it comes to higher compression than what you'd expect, very retarded ignition timing and very rich mixtures under higher boost levels, and I'm sure some other items thrown in like EGR to help. When driving an Ecoboost Mustang it lets you look at the AFR, and towards the top end it gets down in the 10:1 range. I didn't see timing, but I imagine it's retarded a lot. @jesse has a 3.5 EcoBoost that he tows his camper with, and with the ap he has to see what the computer is doing I think it's shown as much as 5-10 degrees ATDC for timing (yes, ATDC not BTDC).

The engine's optimized for around town and the EPA tests as far as mileage goes, so it makes sense the 5.0 will get better mileage while towing. Really, it's a pretty smart way to do things and something I've thought about for a long time. The concept is not unlike what we do on higher powered aircraft engines, too.

I suspect having a modern 10-speed electronic tranny is another big piece of the magic. The engine can be kept in the optimum spot on the power band.

My wife tows her horse trailer with our V6 F150 and it works quite well. No complaints.

 

[brcase]

My dad had a 2012 with the 3.5. His experience was that mileage was nowhere near as promised, despite him driving fairly conservatively and often with an empty (cargo-wise) truck. Ongoing transmission issues from the first year on. It also had the issue of cutting out (almost like you turned the key off) when you needed power the most, like a short on-ramp. They were never able to fix the issue despite intercooler changes, ECU re-flashes, etc etc. The final straw was when it would start shuddering on the freeway any time it was under an increased load (hills). The only way to stop it was to manually downshift. Then it would do it in that gear. And repeat…until you were in 2nd or 3rd, doing 30-40mph…

I was 99% sure it was the converter lockup clutch going out and the shudder was it chattering under load…but all the dealer would do is keep giving him revised ECU settings through a reflash.

That truck was good for about a year (other than grossly over-promised fuel mileage), then one problem after the next. He unloaded it with 75k.

When my wife was shopping for here F150, she talked to our mechanic that basically said just get one later than 2012. Apparently he was aware of issues with early models.

Brian

 

[bfmetcalf]

My 2016 3.5L Ecoboost has been perfect. I've got 95K miles on it now and it hasn't skipped a beat. Pulls my 20' fiberglass walleye boat (probably around 4500 lbs) with ease and my mother in laws 28' camper no problem. I couldn't believe the difference in power from my '05 5.4L F150. I average around 19 MPG and around 11-12 towing the boat.

 

[Bill]

Yup. When I bought a fully loaded F-150 Lariat in '08 for $30K and they now want $60K minimum for that same truck, I don't see the value. I don't care what tech gizmos, engine choices, or revised towing capacities they want to slap on it. It isn't worth twice what I paid for a similar truck 13 years ago, inflation or not. I'll let someone else eat that initial depreciation hit and I'll catch a nice used one a few years later.

That's what happens when a vehicle goes from being a working man's vehicle to an upper middle class status symbol. Nobody wants a Mercedes Benz or BMW anymore, they're all lining up to buy $60-100k trucks and SUVs.

 

[bnt83]

That's EXACTLY where I'm at. I've got a 1995 Mastercraft Prostar 190 in phenomenal shape. Bought it 8 years ago for $8000.00 with 180 hours on it. A 2021 Prostar 190 retails for around $80k. Is it better than my boat? In every way, yes. But, is it ten times better? Not a chance. That's the value for me. If floats, starts every time and has a silky smooth wake. The old school slalom guys occasionally give the passing thumbs up, so there's that. Similar to my old and ugly Armada. Can a new F-150 do everything the Armada can? Absolutely, and do everything better. But, is it worth the asking price? Not to me.

My pickup is a 1979 Dodge D200. I haven't pulled anything with it forever but wouldn't hesitate to. If the engine or tranny blew up I'd just fix it and keep it.

My DD is a 2004 Grand Marquis and its been great so far. I've got an 05 also that is much much cleaner that I could not pass up for the price. The 04 has a Class 3 hitch on it but so far I've only pulled about 1500 pounds with it.

 

[GLMS_NC]

My 2016 3.5L Ecoboost has been perfect. I've got 95K miles on it now and it hasn't skipped a beat. Pulls my 20' fiberglass walleye boat (probably around 4500 lbs) with ease and my mother in laws 28' camper no problem. I couldn't believe the difference in power from my '05 5.4L F150. I average around 19 MPG and around 11-12 towing the boat.

Therein is the big difference with the 3.5 vs the V8 - tow mileage.

 

[bfmetcalf]

Therein is the big difference with the 3.5 vs the V8 - tow mileage.

Yup, but it pulls it incredibly well. Having all that power at such a low RPM is awesome. Most of the time I can forget the boat is even back there.

 

[GLMS_NC]

Yup, but it pulls it incredibly well. Having all that power at such a low RPM is awesome. Most of the time I can forget the boat is even back there.

It does pull well. But at a higher cost, and that was my point, and you seem to concur.

 

[bfmetcalf]

It does pull well. But at a higher cost, and that was my point, and you seem to concur.

For sure agree on the cost part. My old 5.4L would get 16mpg pretty much no matter what, towing it may have dropped to 14 or 15mpg. But the ease of pulling with the 3.5 is far beyond that thing. I haven't pulled anything with the 5.0 Coyote, but have heard it does pull well, just revs higher doing it.

I don't think you can go wrong with any of the engines other than the NA V6. They all have good power, get good mileage and seem to hold up well.

 

[Brad Smith]

I bought a 2018 F-150 with the 5.0 V8 even though I know the specs are better with the turbos. I’m a V8 guy since 1975 so there’s a lot of nostalgia working there. I don’t do maximin towing so the towing limitations compared to the turbos aren’t a concern. The V8 will do for most people, but technology marches on and those with no attachments to V8 will gravitate toward the turbos with their better specs. I’m very happy with my purchase and glad others are happy with theirs. When it comes to sound, the V8 wins every time.

 

[Albany Tom]

I seem to remember that as a kid, we had a GMC truck with a GVWR around 20,000 lbs that had an inline 6. Manual transmission of course, but dual speed differential. Not fast, but ran forever and was pretty indestructible. I think Ford had a similar engine.

 

[bfmetcalf]

I seem to remember that as a kid, we had a GMC truck with a GVWR around 20,000 lbs that had an inline 6. Manual transmission of course, but dual speed differential. Not fast, but ran forever and was pretty indestructible. I think Ford had a similar engine.

Yup, Ford had an inline 6 and it was a pretty good engine. My buddy's dad had one, he dropped it into reverse going 65 accidentally and locked the tires up. Truck ran forever, they don't make em that way anymore.

 

[SoonerAviator]

Yup, Ford had an inline 6 and it was a pretty good engine. My buddy's dad had one, he dropped it into reverse going 65 accidentally and locked the tires up. Truck ran forever, they don't make em that way anymore.

Ford's notable I6 was the 240/300 CID series. Stout engine for sure, lots of low-end torque like most inline engines. Pretty popular engine choice through most of the F-series trucks (and some cars) from the mid-60's up until the 1996 when they introduced the V6 to replace it.