Things I Learn in IFR Training - Who Knew?

Jim K said:
Good point. That was one thing I learned.... when you feel overwhelmed, pull that throttle back and roll the trim back. If that doesn't do it you can always get a delay vector.
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Fantastic idea - I will use that !
 
WDD said:
Fantastic idea - I will use that !
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Another one I learned the hard way... if they give you a fix you aren't expecting, ask for a vector, especially if you have a gps that requires you to spin a knob to input letters.
 
I’ll do that. We were given a fix that we couldn’t find for a while. Had to ask for spelling
 
Anyone 1/2 through their training have a day where they seemed to forget how to hold a course and altitude at the same time? Amazed they had enough coordination that they could drive home?
 
WDD said:
Anyone 1/2 through their training have a day where they seemed to forget how to hold a course and altitude at the same time? Amazed they had enough coordination that they could drive home?
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So much so that I thought long and hard about throwing in the towel....
 
Nathan Miller said:
So much so that I thought long and hard about throwing in the towel....
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I'm there myself right now brother. Although I'm too stubborn to actually do that, so I'm just contemplating that I must surely must have no ability for this - maybe early Alzheimer's? Brain tumor? Got to shake that off. Not that you fall from the horse, but how you get back on it???

In all seriousness - any tricks you used that kept yourself going?
 
One thing most new instrument pilots do not grasp, is the only minimums for landing is the visibility, not the ceiling. The DH means nothing other than “make a decision”. The rabbit can penetrate at 200 feet. It can be a zero ceiling with 1800 rvr and be perfectly landable (for cat I).
 
WDD said:
Anyone 1/2 through their training have a day where they seemed to forget how to hold a course and altitude at the same time? Amazed they had enough coordination that they could drive home?
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Of course. I even had a day where 1/2 way through a lesson, I took off the foggles, said, "your airplane," and made my CFII fly us home.
 
Kritchlow said:
One thing most new instrument pilots do not grasp, is the only minimums for landing is the visibility, not the ceiling. The DH means nothing other than “make a decision”. The rabbit can penetrate at 200 feet. It can be a zero ceiling with 1800 rvr and be perfectly landable (for cat I).
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Another thing most don't realize is seeing any part of the approach lighting allows one to continue descending to TDZE+100, so noting TDZE is an important part of briefing the approach. (Or easier, just realize you can continue 100 below DH.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Of course. I even had a day where 1/2 way through a lesson, I took off the foggles, said, "your airplane," and made my CFII fly us home.
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I did something very similar - except I fired my CFII for being a toolbag. Got another instructor, never looked back, got my ticket (albeit a year later).
 
WDD said:
In all seriousness - any tricks you used that kept yourself going?
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I had to use this technique twice - once pre-solo and again while working on my IRA. The pre-solo moment was the more heart wrenching of the two - probably due to being younger and having less confidence in myself. I was sitting in my car prior to a lesson one day. And I was really dreading it. I felt like I wasn't making progress and maybe the problem is me and I'm just not cut out for flying. But I *really really* wanted to persist but my demons kept telling me I'm no good and I should just save the time and money. I fought back by reflecting on times where I prevailed when the odds were stacked against me. Any victory - big or small - where I felt tempted to give up and instead I pushed through. There were moments I had completely forgotten about until I remembered one small victory which reminded me about another and another. I'm just an average Joe (maybe just an average loser), but I realized there was more in my past than I give myself credit for.

To each their own - we all face different demons. This is a small glimpse into my demons. The trick is figuring out that you actually have demons (read: imaginary roadblocks we mentally put in our own way.) and just realize they're imaginary. Confront the POS demon and kick em to the curb.
 
It's finally starting to make sense. Had a great flight today in real IMC

1) IMC is for me is less disorienting and more comfortable than the blinders
2) ATC calls CTAF at un towered fields "Advisory Frequency" (This tidbit is not in any of the study guides).
3) GPS Hold in the 650 does not give you the magenta line to follow on the outbound leg. You just follow the course, but it will ping you to turn to the inbound leg.
4) Vectors to final are extremely easy
5) In the 650, adding a new destination airport will not bring up that airport's approach options unless you first "Activate the Leg"
 
WDD said:
It's finally starting to make sense. Had a great flight today in real IMC

1) IMC is for me is less disorienting and more comfortable than the blinders
2) ATC calls CTAF at un towered fields "Advisory Frequency" (This tidbit is not in any of the study guides).
3) GPS Hold in the 650 does not give you the magenta line to follow on the outbound leg. You just follow the course, but it will ping you to turn to the inbound leg.
4) Vectors to final are extremely easy
5) In the 650, adding a new destination airport will not bring up that airport's approach options unless you first "Activate the Leg"
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4) until they aren’t. Have your CFI give you a few late turn across final and/or to close in and/or high slam dunks. Now’s the time to learn what you can salvage and what you can’t, or even attempt to.
 
WDD said:
It's finally starting to make sense. Had a great flight today in real IMC

1) IMC is for me is less disorienting and more comfortable than the blinders
2) ATC calls CTAF at un towered fields "Advisory Frequency" (This tidbit is not in any of the study guides).
3) GPS Hold in the 650 does not give you the magenta line to follow on the outbound leg. You just follow the course, but it will ping you to turn to the inbound leg.
4) Vectors to final are extremely easy
5) In the 650, adding a new destination airport will not bring up that airport's approach options unless you first "Activate the Leg"
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Number 3 still takes me by surprised every time. It’s very odd to me.
 
Salty said:
Number 3 still takes me by surprised every time. It’s very odd to me.
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I can see a logic for displaying it that way. On the inbound leg you are to be centered on a particular course. Radial, Localizer or RNAV Leg, maybe even an NDB Bearing. On the outbound leg you are on a heading in the opposite direction. You aren’t supposed to be centered on a particular line. How far away from and paralleling the inbound course is going to vary depending on speed. As is the point when you should begin the turn to inbound.
 
WDD said:
2) ATC calls CTAF at un towered fields "Advisory Frequency" (This tidbit is not in any of the study guides).
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I believe it is defined in the AIM as the Common Traffic Advisory Frequency. A rather old term.
 
PeterNSteinmetz said:
I believe it is defined in the AIM as the Common Traffic Advisory Frequency. A rather old term.
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Gold star for helping me with that connection! I’ve been using the term CTAF so long it didn’t occur to me to connect that to the phrase “advisory”.
 
Also....

When we were in the clouds, ATC told us about a plane on our left. CFI said we had to acknowledge, but never say we can see the plane. If we did that takes the responsibility of separation away from ATC while we're flying IFR.
 
Appreciate the updates and tips. I’m hoping to start my IR this winter and need all the help I can get.


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WDD said:
Also....

When we were in the clouds, ATC told us about a plane on our left. CFI said we had to acknowledge, but never say we can see the plane. If we did that takes the responsibility of separation away from ATC while we're flying IFR.
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Only if they respond with “maintain visual separation” and you acknowledge it. If they tell you to maintain visual separation you can refuse it. This does happen sometimes. Now let’s get down to the nitty gritty here. If you are in the clouds, and you see the traffic, something has already gone seriously wrong.
 
luvflyin said:
If you are in the clouds, and you see the traffic, something has already gone seriously wrong.
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That would indeed be a bad day…… :)

Cloudgoat.png
 
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WDD said:
Also....

When we were in the clouds, ATC told us about a plane on our left. CFI said we had to acknowledge, but never say we can see the plane. If we did that takes the responsibility of separation away from ATC while we're flying IFR.
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Remember that atc has no clue if you're in a cloud. I will respond with "35E is IMC" to let them know that I can't see them and I'm not going to, so give me a vector if you have to. I once had a controller respond "oh, you probably won't see them then", to which I of course had to reply, "I sincerely hope not". He was laughing as he gave me a turn. Always fun when you're in imc and have to get vectors to avoid "vfr" traffic.
 
[QUOTE="Jim K, post: 3131747, member: 36848" Always fun when you're in imc and have to get vectors to avoid "vfr" traffic.[/QUOTE]
That's a fact! VFR traffic that's not even talking. Some crazy people out there...
 
It's good that we have a place to go to share our struggles in training. I've noticed that the easiest way to maintain a track in a G5 or Aspen equipped plane is to put the diamond on the heading tick mark and keep it there. Don't know who needed to hear that, but the answer was me about 20 hours ago. Ugh!
 
Flew the club 182RG with its new dual Garmin 275's Saturday - flight directors are cool. :D The new GFC-500 and the 750 all being coupled and flying auto approaches is cool too!
 
Pugs said:
Flew the club 182RG with its new dual Garmin 275's Saturday - flight directors are cool. :D The new GFC-500 and the 750 all being coupled and flying auto approaches is cool too!
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Cool. Did it have syn vis?
 
asicer said:
Cool. Did it have syn vis?
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No. Some discussion about whether we should spring for that but given how long the plane was down for this and the issues in getting all right the desire is to fly it for now.
 
Ground Speed X 5 = Desired FTM Decent Rate; helps with glide slope

Doing some ground last Saturday, and the CFII told me this trick. For a 3 degree glide slope, take your ground speed X 5 to get your proper decent rate on the VSI. I tried it on the simulator, and it did help with keeping on glide slope. In my case, 80 knots (close to the 90 mph in my airspeed ) X 5 = 400 FPM


Autopilot can be used on Check Ride

This is amazing to me. Apparently allowed. Downside? Have to turn it off on your approached. DPE can disable it at any time. DPE will require that you know everything about how to proficiently use it. Given I've been training in non AP planes so far, I'm not adding that to the list of things to do for the check ride. I'll learn how to use an AP later.
 
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Holding Altitude: Tricks?

What I'm focusing on now is holding / not busting altitude (+/- 100). I think this will be the one area I might be at most danger with. I find on the sim I'm fighting it with yoke, then trim, then sometimes throttle. In the sim I seed to get a bit of pilot induced oscillation. Any tricks to offer?
 
WDD said:
Holding Altitude: Tricks?

What I'm focusing on now is holding / not busting altitude (+/- 100). I think this will be the one area I might be at most danger with. I find on the sim I'm fighting it with yoke, then trim, then sometimes throttle. In the sim I seed to get a bit of pilot induced oscillation. Any tricks to offer?
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for the record, when we get a hundred threads on "I'm thinking of starting IR soon, what can I work on ahead of time?" and everyone and their brother says "work on holding a heading and holding altitude"................THIS is why.
 
Bill said:
Another thing most don't realize is seeing any part of the approach lighting allows one to continue descending to TDZE+100, so noting TDZE is an important part of briefing the approach. (Or easier, just realize you can continue 100 below DH.
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Or more than 100 feet below DH…and it also applies to MDAs.
 
WDD said:
Holding Altitude: Tricks?
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Pitch control.

Look at the attitude indicator (AI). Find the pitch attitude that holds level flight in your current configuration and power setting. Hold that pitch attitude. If you are low, increase the attitude to something above the level pitch attitude. If you are high, decrease it below the level attitude. If configuration and/or power changes, you'll need a new level pitch reference.

It works the same for holding a glide slope, i.e. holding a fixed rate-of-descent on approach. Establish the attitude that delivers the desired performance then bracket it up/down to make corrections.

Your instrument scan goes from the AI, to something else you need to check, then right back to the AI. Check that the bank angle and pitch attitude is where you want it then scan to the next other instrument, and right back to the AI. AI, something, AI, something, AI, something, AI, etc.
 
WDD said:
Autopilot can be used on Check Ride

This is amazing to me. Apparently allowed. Downside? Have to turn it off on your approached. DPE can disable it at any time. DPE will require that you know everything about how to proficiently use it. Given I've been training in non AP planes so far, I'm not adding that to the list of things to do for the check ride. I'll learn how to use an AP later.
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Actually you have to use it if you have it for at least one approach. If you have one they want to to demonstrate you know how to use it. It can be harder than you think if you haven't flown it a lot in training. (e.g. VTF when to switch from HDG to NAV).
 
Hang 4 said:
Actually you have to use it if you have it for at least one approach. If you have one they want to to demonstrate you know how to use it. It can be harder than you think if you haven't flown it a lot in training. (e.g. VTF when to switch from HDG to NAV).
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This. Some AP's aren't necessarily intuitive to get to fly w/in 100', either. I believe that anything in the airplane that isn't nop'd is fair game to be asked to demonstrate during a checkride.
 
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