Thank you Cleveland!!

What Should I Do?

  • Send the note as is with the receipt and check.

    Votes: 7 15.6%

  • Suck it up, and just send the check with no note.

    Votes: 25 55.6%

  • Add more to the note and really them know how I feel.

    Votes: 5 11.1%

  • Other (specify)

    Votes: 8 17.8%
  • Total voters
    45
EdFred

EdFred

Taxi to Parking
Joined
Feb 25, 2005
Messages
30,651
Location
Michigan
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Display name:
White Chocolate
I got this in the mail. What should my response be? $5.00 isn't going to kill me, but it's the principle of the thing.
 

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The clerk who porcesses your check isn't going to know what you're talking about. Send your note to a local newspaper columnist and the Cleveland Clinic. Even then they're going to ignore it.

"Do you think a doctor doesn't have to feed a parking meter?"

And don't accept any more lifeline flights to Cleveland.
 
Pay the bill while raising cane. $5 isn't going to break you or the airport authority but principle is worth something.
​
 
Just pay it. It isn't going to break you. It would be nice if they would waive it, but they are under no obligation to do so.
 
Send in the payment with the note; which probably won't go anywhere. But, spend a few more bucks and send copies with a letter to the Mayor, perhaps a couple city council members (conservatives if there are any) then follow it with copies to a few radio and TV stations. Provide more detail on what exactly the flight was and what you may know about the parties involved.

If there is no response at all, we may know how little people really care. That in it self would be the sad loss.
 
Costs more than that to park downtown. Don't be such a stingy bastard.
 
Did the city/FBO know your flight was a lifeline flight?

I would:
Send in the payment with a polite note
Send a note to lifeline as to why you will not accept any more lifeline flights to Cleveland. Maybe lifeline will make a call to the City.

It’s unfortunate that this City may be unwilling to help people in need. The people in need are the ones who get the short end of the deal on this one:mad:
 
Steve said:
Deduct the expense.
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Yeah, and except it as part of your charitable help towards others. I am going to start doing these flights once I have 250PIC.
 
Send a note to see if they will waive it because of the passion flight. If not Scotts idea is perfect but be a penny short.
 
JRitt said:
Send a note to see if they will waive it because of the passion flight. If not Scotts idea is perfect but be a penny short.
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Ohh! what a good idea!

Dr. Evil would approve
drevil_million_dollars.jpg
 
JRitt said:
Send a note to see if they will waive it because of the passion flight. If not Scotts idea is perfect but be a penny short.
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No, be a penny over. They may try to return it for 'overpayment'.
 
I suspect thy won't accept pennies. Usually these bills say "No cash" somewhere on them.

But its a hell of an idea, and I support sending pennies too, especially if there's no "no cash" disclaimer!
 
I was gonna make the check for $4.98 and tape 2 cents to the bill, but that might be a bit too sardonic.

If there's a no cash disclaimer. I get free checks from my bank and only write about 4 a year. Maybe I'll use about 25 checks, all for different amount to make up the $5.00. Or maybe purposely make it 39 cents short. Then they have to spend another 39 cents to collect 39 cents.
 
I think the check with the note as written would suffice. However, I'd first make sure that it you weren't just billed in error. I can visualize a bunch of different scenarios that would result in a erroneous bill.

1. New people.
2. People unfamiliar with P & Ps.
3. People just not paying attention.
4. Line kid writing down N# of your plane instead of the one he was
supposed to.
5. Etc.... Etc...

But as soon as I was sure it wasn't a mistake..........I'd totally let them have it.
 
. . . and with any letter(s) you send, be sure to copy Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, Clark Howard, you get the picture.

HR
 
EdFred said:
I was gonna make the check for $4.98 and tape 2 cents to the bill, but that might be a bit too sardonic.

If there's a no cash disclaimer. I get free checks from my bank and only write about 4 a year. Maybe I'll use about 25 checks, all for different amount to make up the $5.00. Or maybe purposely make it 39 cents short. Then they have to spend another 39 cents to collect 39 cents.
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Make it 1 cent over. Then they have to invest a check, a stamp, and some manpower to refund that 1 cent.
 
I believe I would attach a copy of the bill and a notice that you will no longer fly or deliver organs to Cleveland until this charge is dropped on flights by your origanization.

and send it to the mayor, city counsel, and the medical facility you service.

not that you'd stop understand :)
 
OK, so it's a landing fee. Why get your undies in a bundle? Life is too short to wig out over something so incidental.
 
I said the $5 wouldn't kill me. It's just the principle of the thing. "Oh, you're volunteering your time and money? Well give us some too."
 
Like they even know.

Pay it, and send a separate letter to the airport manager / director (cc AOPA & Lifeline) informing them nicely of th emission of Lifeline and organization slike Lifeline (Angel Flight, etc.), and ask them if they'd consider making exceptions for legitimate charitable-purpose flights.

Tell them that they'd be helping their own citizens, and that good-faith acts of kindness like that are shared around the pilot community, and rewarded by increased patronage of the field and its based businesses.

Cite to examples of FBOs whose thoughtful actions have gained them valuable business, and increased prestige.

Honey, not vinegar... much better chance of success.

Just my $0.02.
 
SCCutler said:
Like they even know.

Pay it, and send a separate letter to the airport manager / director (cc AOPA & Lifeline) informing them nicely of th emission of Lifeline and organization slike Lifeline (Angel Flight, etc.), and ask them if they'd consider making exceptions for legitimate charitable-purpose flights.

Tell them that they'd be helping their own citizens, and that good-faith acts of kindness like that are shared around the pilot community, and rewarded by increased patronage of the field and its based businesses.

Cite to examples of FBOs whose thoughtful actions have gained them valuable business, and increased prestige.

Honey, not vinegar... much better chance of success.

Just my $0.02.
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I forget who the member was or the FBO but it was an FBO in Columbia or Jefferson City, MO that provided an aircraft for free to move a sick child. That is undoubtably the most generous in GA involving an FBO beside the corporate jets that are provided quite often.
 
EdFred said:
I said the $5 wouldn't kill me. It's just the principle of the thing. "Oh, you're volunteering your time and money? Well give us some too."
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I understand that. But from my point of view, life is filled with enough stress and hassle that you have to pick your battles, and to me this one wouldn't be worth the effort. I'd focus on some bigger fish to fry.
 
EdFred said:
I said the $5 wouldn't kill me. It's just the principle of the thing. "Oh, you're volunteering your time and money? Well give us some too."
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Ed, who did you talk to about waiving the lading fee? Your first post does not indicate that you talked to anyone. How are they supposed to know? The receptionist is probably not authorized to waive those fees. Did you talk to the manager?

Frankly, Ed, I kind of think that the way you are pursuing this is petty and a bit childish. If you want to pursue it, the best way to do it is to talk to either the manager of the FBO or the airport manager. Anyone else could probably care less.

Just pay the 5 dollars.
 
FBO waived their ramp fee. This is the city of Chic- er Cleveland. Ken, I'm unmarried with no kids. I have lot of time on my hands.
 
EdFred said:
I said the $5 wouldn't kill me. It's just the principle of the thing. "Oh, you're volunteering your time and money? Well give us some too."
Click to expand...

Sure, and those feelings are legitimate and what you are doing is commendable.

But let me ask just because you have decided this is a worthy cause should the airport that you are using be forced by your decision to waive their fees?
In essence have the tax payers support your charity?

If you agree some would say that is a very liberal way of thinking. :D:D
 
I used to work at an airport with a ramp fee ($5 for singles, etc.)

When an air ambulance arrived, I asked if we could waive the ramp fee. "Nope. They're a for-profit business, basically just like a charter."

I honestly can't remember if we waived fees for Lifeline/Angel flights or not. I'm guessing yes, but...

When I talked to the owner of the FBO about the whole idea of ramp fees (I really hated them, as *I* had to be the bad guy to inform the pilot that just chose our field that we'd have to charge him), He said that he started charging fees because pilots would fly in, make long-distance calls on the phone, take the courtesy car somewhere and never fuel it, and just generally take advantage of the FBO. So, I asked if we could waive it for people who didn't use any of these (formerly) free services.

"No. Just showing up is using a service. I have to pay $42,000 a MONTH just between liability insurance on the ramp and the lease payments to the city for the ramp and building." :eek:

Now, in this case, I don't really agree with the fee. The city presumably got plenty of federal $ to build the airport, etc. etc. But honestly, none of us know why that fee is really there. There may be a legitimate reason.

And honestly, I really never understood the bitching and moaning of pilots over a $5 fee. You just paid how many hundred dollars to fly in here, and it's not worth $5 to you to have this place to fly into to begin with? Sheesh.

Count me as "on the fence" but really, Ed, go get a job at McDonald's and quit after an hour. You'll get more money out of it and waste less time.
 
heh that reminds me, i picked up an app for mcdonalds today at lunch. should fill the monster out...
 
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Most airports will waive fees for Angel Flights, but some of them need to be alerted to the flight in advance. My Volunteer Pilots dispatcher has always handled this for my flights.

So, going with the principle that one should "never attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity", I would:

Send a check for the landing fee (keep a copy for your taxes so you can deduct it if they don't refund it). Include a note stating that the flight in question was a charity flight and give them the sponsor name, contact info and the mission number.

Then, write a letter to the authority that levied the fee (airport manager, airport authority, city treasurer), explaining that you were billed for this fee, and have sent in payment, but are wondering if the fee policy exempts charity flights like the one you were on. Add language that says "If this fee is not waived for charitable flights, who can my organization contact to lobby for a change in policy? These flights are of significant value to your community and we'd all like them to continue."
 
EdFred said:
I got this in the mail. What should my response be? $5.00 isn't going to kill me, but it's the principle of the thing.
Click to expand...

Which airport was this?

I'm sure if they would have known you were an angel flight, they would have waived it.

I know at Burke Lakefront (Cleveland) they charge a $5 and bill the aircraft owner based on the tower records for all planes landing. You can check in at the terminal and pay the fee in person (cash) if you choose, or they will mail you a bill. If you went in and talked to them, I'm sure they would have waived it for your case.

Can't expect them to waive a fee if you didn't tell them though!
 
bjohnson said:
I would:
Send in the payment with a polite note
Send a note to lifeline as to why you will not accept any more lifeline flights to Cleveland. Maybe lifeline will make a call to the City.
Click to expand...

Would you actually not give your services to a Lifeline passenger over a $5 landing fee?
 
EdFred said:
I was gonna make the check for $4.98 and tape 2 cents to the bill, but that might be a bit too sardonic.

If there's a no cash disclaimer. I get free checks from my bank and only write about 4 a year. Maybe I'll use about 25 checks, all for different amount to make up the $5.00. Or maybe purposely make it 39 cents short. Then they have to spend another 39 cents to collect 39 cents.
Click to expand...
Whatever happened to "legal for all debts public and private"?!
 
I'm reminded of the time I came back from Mexico last November. I had'nt been to Mexico so I had to buy a customs sticker that was only good until the end of the year. I politely groused about it to the customs guy. His reply was: "How much did you pay for gas in that thing"?
 
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