Sport to recreational pilot

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Woody1331

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Woody1331
I am trying to find the happy middle until the MOSAIC update is announced. I am currently in training. If, while working towards my recreational pilot certificate I get my sport pilot certificate, could I get an endorsement that allows me unlimited cross country flight in a Cessna 172 since I have received the required cross country training?

Thanks in advance.
 
I suppose I should have prefaced this with, there are a lot of aspects of Private pilot that I just truly do not need or want. Once the weight rating goes up on sport pilot it will fit me perfectly.
 
I am not aware of any endorsement that would allow someone with only a sport certificate and no medical to solo a 172.
If there were at this time, that would be amazing for me. But I think we have to wait for Mosaic.
 
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No, I'm talking about advancing FROM sport pilot TO recreational pilot. You have to receive the cross-country training to get your sport pilot certificate, so it begs the question does that move forward with you to the recreational pilot?
 
You can get an endorsement onto a Rec ticket that allows flight beyond the 50 mile limit, so in theory, yes you could do a long XC in a 172 once you have your Rec Certificate. No way you can fly a 172 with just Sport, though.

But practically, you may have a tough time getting an instructor for Rec. Almost no one has that ticket, and I suspect most CFIs aren’t familiar with Rec Pilot.

Why not just stick with Sport? Many LSAs are capable aircraft, and people do use them for long distance travel.
 
Woody1331 said:
No, I'm talking about advancing FROM sport pilot TO recreational pilot. You have to receive the cross-country training to get your sport pilot certificate, so it begs the question does that move forward with you to the recreational pilot?
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Not automatically. You would need your instructor to endorse your Rec certificate for travel beyond 50 miles. But your instructor could take notice of your SP XC training to justify his signature. Talk to your CFI.
 
Largely because I live in Kansas with a constant 30 mph wind. Not to mention the updrafts from 107° temperatures. The air turbulence throws the little LSA planes around like a toy and much less so in a 172.
 
That's what I was thinking, but the FAA makes it sound like the endorsement is only good for one specific area. EX Wichita Kansas to Branson missouri. I'm just curious, and my instructor is not sure, if he could give an overall endorsement for cross country.
 
Woody1331 said:
That's what I was thinking, but the FAA makes it sound like the endorsement is only good for one specific area. EX Wichita Kansas to Branson missouri. I'm just curious, and my instructor is not sure, if he could give an overall endorsement for cross country.
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Refer to CFR 61.101(c):

(c) A person who holds a recreational pilot certificate may act as pilot in command of an aircraft on a flight that exceeds 50 nautical miles from the departure airport, provided that person has -

(1) Received ground and flight training from an authorized instructor on the cross-country training requirements of subpart E of this part that apply to the aircraft rating held;

(2) Been found proficient in cross-country flying; and

(3) Received from an authorized instructor a logbook endorsement, which is carried on the person's possession in the aircraft, that certifies the person has received and been found proficient in the cross-country training requirements of subpart E of this part that apply to the aircraft rating held.
 
Baked Potato said:
Sure, but you can't solo in a 172 until you actually have a Recreational or PPL. (If that is what you were asking)
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Not even close. My instructor can train sport and rec. If, in the process of getting my rec certificate I do the cross country training and the solos in an LSA to get my sport certificate ON THE WAY to getting my rec certificate (technically only adding 3 hours of cross country training) could my instructor give me the ability to cross country in a Cessna with my recertificate. Essentially giving me daylight VFR, unrestricted XC with 1 passenger in a Cessna.
 
BTW, I once considered doing the same thing. I discovered, though, that, having my SP cert, it was almost as easy to get Private as it would have been to get Rec plus the endorsements. And PP has much greater privileges and flexibility.
 
Half Fast said:
Refer to CFR 61.101(c):

(c) A person who holds a recreational pilot certificate may act as pilot in command of an aircraft on a flight that exceeds 50 nautical miles from the departure airport, provided that person has -

(1) Received ground and flight training from an authorized instructor on the cross-country training requirements of subpart E of this part that apply to the aircraft rating held;

(2) Been found proficient in cross-country flying; and

(3) Received from an authorized instructor a logbook endorsement, which is carried on the person's possession in the aircraft, that certifies the person has received and been found proficient in the cross-country training requirements of subpart E of this part that apply to the aircraft rating held.
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So, it doesn't have to be a point A to point B endorsement?
 
Rgbeard said:
Who knew that Rec Pilot was still a "thing"?
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Lol, I am pretty sure it will go away completely with the new MOSAIC ruling in 2023. It will get swallowed up by LPA rating.
 
Can someone please explain to me what a "recreational" pilot is. I get a lot of recreation out of flying my Archer. Does that make me a rec pilot? :confused2:
 
Essentially a sport pilot but with a heavier aircraft and only within a 50 MI radius. You can get different ratings like cross country, or night flying.
 
As a somewhat disinterested third-party looking at this I've been led to believe that the challenge to ALL of this is finding a qualified instructor.

What's available in one's area probably more determines the type of license you achieve, unless you're willing to travel.
 
Rgbeard said:
As a somewhat disinterested third-party looking at this I've been led to believe that the challenge to ALL of this is finding a qualified instructor.

What's available in one's area probably more determines the type of license you achieve, unless you're willing to travel.
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Sport pilot fits most of my needs. Technically it should be easier than PPL. But availability of sport planes nearby is very slim. Then instructors who will train you in them. Practically it may be harder for me to get sport than PPL due to that.
(And I'm not sure anyone here even advertises Recreational cert)
 
The PPL is so onerous vs the recreational pilot because it has:
13 knowledge items rather than 12, and that one extra being radio communication
5 extra training hours and 10 extra total hours (which wouldn't matter if you have SP)
Cross country training - for which you want to do anyway?
basic instrument maneuvers
and night ops.


Do I have this right?
 
EdFred said:
The PPL is so onerous vs the recreational pilot because it has:
13 knowledge items rather than 12, and that one extra being radio communication
5 extra training hours and 10 extra total hours (which wouldn't matter if you have SP)
Cross country training - for which you want to do anyway?
basic instrument maneuvers
and night ops.


Do I have this right?
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Almost. SP also has instrument training, though without a required number of hours, so there’s not much more needed for PP if any.
 
EdFred said:
The PPL is so onerous vs the recreational pilot because it has:
13 knowledge items rather than 12, and that one extra being radio communication
5 extra training hours and 10 extra total hours (which wouldn't matter if you have SP)
Cross country training - for which you want to do anyway?
basic instrument maneuvers
and night ops.


Do I have this right?
Click to expand...


TSAR.
(that sounds about right.)
 
Half Fast said:
Almost. SP also has instrument training, though without a required number of hours, so there’s not much more needed for PP if any.
Click to expand...

Which is why I question the Sport ==> Rec Pilot considering one needs a medical (absent basic med), will be doing cross country flights, and being in a 172, presumably using the radio.

Makes 0 sense to me.
 
Woody1331 said:
Largely because I live in Kansas with a constant 30 mph wind. Not to mention the updrafts from 107° temperatures. The air turbulence throws the little LSA planes around like a toy and much less so in a 172.
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I live in Nebraska and fly an LSA. If you're getting bounced off the canopy, fly higher.
 
Woody1331 said:
Largely because I live in Kansas with a constant 30 mph wind. Not to mention the updrafts from 107° temperatures. The air turbulence throws the little LSA planes around like a toy and much less so in a 172.
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If you don't like the turbulence in an LSA, you're probably not going to like them in a C172. If you fly in the morning you won't even have to worry about them. Regarding MOSAIC, I too am hopeful there is a meaningful positive change in regulations (like opening up flying a C172 as a Sport Pilot). But given that MOSAIC has been decoupled from any congressional mandate and the FAA is rudderless I'm back to being pessimistic that any beneficial rule change will be coming in the next few years. If there are no medical concerns I would just get a PP...
 
idahoflier said:
If you don't like the turbulence in an LSA, you're probably not going to like them in a C172. If you fly in the morning you won't even have to worry about them. Regarding MOSAIC, I too am hopeful there is a meaningful positive change in regulations (like opening up flying a C172 as a Sport Pilot). But given that MOSAIC has been decoupled from any congressional mandate and the FAA is rudderless I'm back to being pessimistic that any beneficial rule change will be coming in the next few years. If there are no medical concerns I would just get a PP...
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I have no desire or need to fly at night or in bad weather. The ONLY benefit to me in pp is passengers. I am fairly sure that recreational pilot with a cross country endorsement will give me everything I want and desire except being able to have three passengers.
 
Woody1331 said:
I have no desire or need to fly at night or in bad weather. The ONLY benefit to me in pp is passengers. I am fairly sure that recreational pilot with a cross country endorsement will give me everything I want and desire except being able to have three passengers.
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You need to consider that the other pilot licenses are somewhat boutique items, and obtaining these may be wildly more difficult than a PPL.

You may want to break down and get the PPL like the vast majority of pilots rather than continually defend your decision, and be a rarity. In your area, depending on resources, this may be the "EASY BUTTON".
 
Woody1331 said:
You have to ask yourself, if you're in such bad shape that you can't pass a class 3 medical, should you really be flying anyways?
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There are questions in the medical form that may have no bearing on our current ability to fly as safely as anyone else. Note all the questions stating "have you ever in your life", and require a lot of work to obtain a SI for, even if they are items that happened during childhood, decades ago. (For example)
 
Woody1331 said:
You have to ask yourself, if you're in such bad shape that you can't pass a class 3 medical, should you really be flying anyways?
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What does the ability to pass a third class medical have to do with the ability to fly an airplane?
 
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