Smartwatch Pulse/Oximeter Question

[Cogito]

I have a Garmin smartwatch with oximeter function but it won’t work at altitude because of aircraft vibrations. I was surprised to see that an Apple Watch Ultra worked accurately in flight, no issue. I have an apple watch from before they included blood oxygen readings which I wear for daily use and like the size (and price) better than the Ultra. Does anyone know if the regular sized apple watch’s oximeter works in GA aircraft or one needs to shell out for the Ultra?

btw, I know there are finger-based pulse oximeters, we had brand new one which died on us during a ferry flight from California to Florida last weekend. The built-in Aithre oxygen sensors in the plane were also unreliable.

Thanks for the help

 

[Stewartb]

My Apple Watch 7 pulse oximeter requires 15 seconds of holding my wrist flat. With that, it works every time.

 

[Sundancer]

If you're up high a lot, ask around if a USAF, Navy, or USMC air base hosts an altitude chamber event for civilians. It used to happen at the chamber at Andrews AFB. I crosseds paths with civilians there when getting a chamber ride for my Reserve unit. I think (not sure) the FAA set it up for them. Not every base has a chamber - they're really aren't that many - but look 'em up under the base phone books under "Aeromed" or "Physiological training" or just call the base and ask the operator to transfer you to the clinic/hospital/or chamber.

They won't blow your lungs out with a RD at higher altitudes like for the military - they have a kinder, gentler protocol for "guests", but you'll get a real good feel for your personal hypoxia symptoms.

 

[Brad W]

I did a civilian chamber ride back in the early 1990's, at Langley AFB. Back then it was offered as a program through the FAA. had to go through them to register....FSDO maybe??
It was more than just a ride.... it was a full day. Half a day of classroom training on all things physiology, and then the chamber ride. I think it also was supposed to include a ride in that gyroscope puke chair thing but their was broken at the time. Oh, and we did do a rapid decompression.
here's a screenshot form my logbook notation. I sketched the ride profile.
yeah, if they still offer it I highly suggest it!


looks like it didn't come through readable
basically it's an ear check to 5,000 ft
then a period of time for O2 saturation
then about 5 minutes at 25,000ft ( I lasted 4 minutes then put the O2 back on myself...wish I'd have pushed it longer)
then down to 18,000ft for 5 minutes where we did a vision demo, looking at a map off O2 then on
and a rapid deco from 8,000ft to 22,000ft in approx 4 seconds

 

[Sluggo63]

I don't know if there are too many chambers any more. When I was getting out back in 2016 the Aerospace Physiology folks started using a machine to simulate hypoxia. Basically wearing a mask that would decrease the O2 content of what you were breathing to match being at altitude.

It just isn't the same if you're not trapped in a box with the farts of 12 of your best friends wafting about.

If anywhere in the Air Force was keeping them around, I'd say you have the best chance at one of the four pilot training bases (Columbus, Laughlin, Vance or Sheppard).

Also Randolph may have one too.

 

[David Loftus]

My Apple Watch 7 pulse oximeter requires 15 seconds of holding my wrist flat. With that, it works every time.

My Apple Watch 7 is very finicky. Often it takes several attempts to get a reading in flight as any type of bump during the 15-second measurement period seems to generate an error message. I keep a couple of $25 fingertip pulse oximeters hanging from each of my center sticks that are almost bullet proof, and verified accurate with my doctor's office. In my previous life I sold Garmin the sensors for their pulse oximeter watches. And owned Garmin D2 Delta and other models that claimed to provide pulse ox. The real challenge for Garmin, Apple, and others is that blood perfusion on the wrist is much more difficult to measure reliably than a fingertip. And their engineers openly admit it. Unfortunately the marketing people don't advertise the shortcomings. PPG sensors for the wrist have wild variability with color of skin, hair, etc, that make the results highly questionable in the best of circumstances. Let alone with vibrations and turbulence of an aircraft. I would not trust my life to my Apple Watch 7, Ultra, or anything else measuring on the wrist. If I am using oxygen, I am monitoring with my fingertip units.

 

[NealRomeoGolf]

Weird. My Garmin works in flight.

I have it track my O2 during sleep. I've always wondered how accurate they really are.

 

[Cogito]

My Apple Watch 7 is very finicky. Often it takes several attempts to get a reading in flight as any type of bump during the 15-second measurement period seems to generate an error message. I keep a couple of $25 fingertip pulse oximeters hanging from each of my center sticks that are almost bullet proof, and verified accurate with my doctor's office. In my previous life I sold Garmin the sensors for their pulse oximeter watches. And owned Garmin D2 Delta and other models that claimed to provide pulse ox. The real challenge for Garmin, Apple, and others is that blood perfusion on the wrist is much more difficult to measure reliably than a fingertip. And their engineers openly admit it. Unfortunately the marketing people don't advertise the shortcomings. PPG sensors for the wrist have wild variability with color of skin, hair, etc, that make the results highly questionable in the best of circumstances. Let alone with vibrations and turbulence of an aircraft. I would not trust my life to my Apple Watch 7, Ultra, or anything else measuring on the wrist. If I am using oxygen, I am monitoring with my fingertip units.

Your apple watch experience could be similar to mine with a garmin, except I stopped trying after 3 attempts. Any other pilots use apple watch 7 (or 8) to check blood ox? The AW ultra worked every time.

 

[Stewartb]

Do you wear your watch loose? It needs to be firmly against your skin to work. Tighten the band or slide it up your wrist a little and see if it works better.

 

[Alien Mind]

I love my Apple Watch (7) for many reasons, O2 measurement in plane is not one of them! I tried dozens of times but only succeeded once! any slight vibration means it starts its 'I need 15 seconds' again. Sort of impossible in a Cherokee. I revert to the fingertip thing on every flight. Oh well.

 

[Cogito]

I love my Apple Watch (7) for many reasons, O2 measurement in plane is not one of them! I tried dozens of times but only succeeded once! any slight vibration means it starts its 'I need 15 seconds' again. Sort of impossible in a Cherokee. I revert to the fingertip thing on every flight. Oh well.

Thanks Alien, sounds like AW7 can be similar to Garmin in this regard. Maybe Stewartb (above) is a smoother pilot than we or his aircraft is. Anyone have a series 8 (non-ultra) apple watch they've tried using as an oximeter in flight?

 

[RudyP]

Your apple watch experience could be similar to mine with a garmin, except I stopped trying after 3 attempts. Any other pilots use apple watch 7 (or 8) to check blood ox? The AW ultra worked every time.

Works fine for me but the mustang is pretty smooth.

 

[Wrench978]

I have an Apple Watch 6 and I don’t usually have a problem getting my O2 reading. I usually grab my shoulder strap with my watch hand and hold it tight to my chest. I also keep my hand relatively snug.

 

[Sierra_Hotel]

I don't know if there are too many chambers any more. When I was getting out back in 2016 the Aerospace Physiology folks started using a machine to simulate hypoxia. Basically wearing a mask that would decrease the O2 content of what you were breathing to match being at altitude.

It just isn't the same if you're not trapped in a box with the farts of 12 of your best friends wafting about.

If anywhere in the Air Force was keeping them around, I'd say you have the best chance at one of the four pilot training bases (Columbus, Laughlin, Vance or Sheppard).

Also Randolph may have one too.

I went to the one at Peterson around 05-06. Was definitely an interesting experience. Used to still have the certification card for it somewhere but I think it's long since disappeared.

 

[cmsuav8r]

I went to the chamber that the FAA has in OKC back around 2008. It was the same as mentioned above, where half the day is classroom and then after lunch is the simulator. A few minutes in, we were all struggling to breathe with the masks on and then instructor apologized that he forgot to turn something on.

As for the 02 on the watch, finger pulseox are so cheap and accurate if you get a good one, that it doesn't make much sense for me to worry about a watch that has it.