SI Class 1 for ADHD...now what????

[BigJimSlade]

I'm not exactly sure what the FAA is thinking.

I'm 18. Just completed my first semester of college last week. I didn't attend the fall semester so I could prepare for the Neurocog after doing poorly on it in April 2021. It's been years since I took ADHD meds - when I was a freshman in high school.

According to the Psychologist, the problem coscreen/ae found was "cognitive function" or something like that. NOT ADHD.

I stayed home for semester, worked a full-time job, and did luminosity and other prep stuff so I could take the neurocog again in November 2021.

Results, according to the psychologist, was I "knocked it out of the park."

Everything was assembled and shipped off to OKC in December. I went off to college. Took the ground school class. And others. Did exceptionally well. Oh, and again, without ADHD.

Today - May 16, 2022, I got OKC's answer.

A Special Issuance Medical Class 1 Medical Certificate, valid until 12/31/2022. So, yes, after waiting for 6 MONTHS for a response from OKC, they're giving me a WHOLE 6 MONTHS of a Class 1 Certificate.

Beginning in December 2022 and that at 12 month intervals:

- A current neuropsychological and cog eval from the psychologist regarding your history of ADHD.
- Results of a current CogScreen.
- An assessment and statement from an instructor pilot regarding operational flight experience, etc.

It's suggested "to avoid a lapse in your certification, we recommend that you obtain the information listed above 60 DAYS PRIOR to the expirations of your airman medical certificate."

That's right - the FAA wants me to do perform the the same thing I just did - TO THE TUNE OF $1,500 - less than a year from when I had it done last.

Is this a joke? Also, if Cogscreen-AE is so spectacular in recognizing problems - and you can't study for it - then why do they think taking it all over again IN LESS THAN A YEAR will result in something different than the last time I took it? They state that it's because of my "history of ADHD". Yet, twice now, the Cogscreen - and the report from the psych. - has said that I DO NOT HAVE ADHD.

 

[mryan75]

Yet, twice now, the Cogscreen - and the report from the psych. - has said that I DO NOT HAVE ADHD.

Well someone with some letters after their name clearly said you did at one point, as you say you took ADHD meds. Which means you were diagnosed with ADHD. If I were you I’d be pretty happy that I got a medical at all, and would comply with the terms of the SI.

 

[allPrimes]

Yeah, it all sucks. I get my SI for 6months at a time, too, and have to pay a lab to test my urine for drugs and alcohol even though I've been sober for >21 years now.

These are the hoops we have to jump through if we want the medical.

 

[Zeldman]

Yeah, I had a SI first class medical for a year. It cost me 30,000 samolians because an AME messed up the EKG.

Turns out after going through several $$$ test, including running a camera up a vein into the heart, it was found that my heart is offset to one side a few 1000s of an inch so it is considered not in normal position. I have to take an inch thick file in everytime I get a medical.

It really behooves me to go to the same AME everytime, but the problem I have is everytime I find a good AME that person retires.

Welcome to the world of aviation. A 6 month 1st class medical SI is normal, and after age 40 every 6 months is required.

 

[wayneda40]

OP, as you hopefully know... if you don't intend to fly professionally, now is the time to go get the BasicMed.

 

[BigJimSlade]

Well someone with some letters after their name clearly said you did at one point, as you say you took ADHD meds.

Correct. When I was 10. After my teacher suggested to my parents that the reason I wasn’t paying attention could be ADHD, prompting a visit to a psychologist. Do you think that psychologist ever saw a 10 year old that she didn’t prescribe meds to? Not a chance.

I find it interesting that I need to retake the infallible Cogscreen AE every year…and I need a neuropsychological evaluation. So when I do that in November, what will have changed? Thus:

- I attended my first year of college. A’s and B’s.
- I haven’t taken any ADHD meds…still.

So at least the neuropsychologist will have an easy job when submitting a report that addresses “history and symptoms,diagnosis, treatment plan, aviation operational experience, and prognosis.” It will read something like this:

“no changes since last November.”

 

[bflynn]

Understand that neurological disorders are scary to the FAA and for good reason. The Germanwings murder/suicide event spooked a lot of people. They are not changing any time soon.

your choices are to comply or not fly. It’s harsh, but that’s what life is. Welcome to adult life. If you don’t want to fly professionally, you could look at a program called BasicMed, which is an exam with your doctor, nothing goes to the FAA. But to go pro, you’re with this.

 

[Tools]

Well, so ya know and to help relieve the stress of “am I missing something?”, no.

You’re not wrong. All your analysis is correct. It DOESNT make sense.

However, when you hear people say “the reason is...”, or “the FAA wants (or thinks)...”, be wary. We don’t know what goes on in their tiny little pea brains. Just like they don’t know what goes on in our tiny little pilot brains.

The fact remains that it IS what you have to deal with UNLESS you get a lawyer and go back at them, or go to the NTSB.

I was told less than two weeks ago by a POI that THAT is the only way to EVER effect change in the FARs. And that was in response to a CLEAR oversight in a reg that is written wrong. They know it was, they say they can’t change it until enough people complain formally, and will continue to enforce the incorrectness of it!

Truth is often stranger than fiction.

 

[AchillesLastStand]

Understand that neurological disorders are scary to the FAA and for good reason. The Germanwings murder/suicide event spooked a lot of people. They are not changing any time soon.

your choices are to comply or not fly. It’s harsh, but that’s what life is. Welcome to adult life. If you don’t want to fly professionally, you could look at a program called BasicMed, which is an exam with your doctor, nothing goes to the FAA. But to go pro, you’re with this.

Thats kind of a sweeping statement. Conflating a childhood ADHD diagnosis with the mental issues of the German Wings’ pilot. By that logic, I have to be weary of a ton of people that I know….

 

[bflynn]

Thats kind of a sweeping statement. Conflating a childhood ADHD diagnosis with the mental issues of the German Wings’ pilot. By that logic, I have to be weary of a ton of people that I know….

Take it up with the FAA if you want to argue about it. I'm just saying what is.

Given what they just announced this morning about the China crash, don't expect a change any time soon.

 

[Chris Charanza]

This scenario is exactly what I'm afraid will happen to me once I finally clear the ADHD hurdle. I'm just waiting on the paperwork to get through the system although I'm not even sure if I'd be going on an SI after the cogscreen or not. I know I'm only chasing a 3rd class medical so maybe it won't be the same although whatever happens (assuming i get the medical certificate) i plan on going basic med at the end of the day anyway so it might not matter so much anyway in my case.

 

[mryan75]

And that was in response to a CLEAR oversight in a reg that is written wrong. They know it was, they say they can’t change it until enough people complain formally, and will continue to enforce the incorrectness of it!

I’m going to out on a limb here and say the FAA probably has a different take on the matter than you suggest.

 

[mryan75]

Thats kind of a sweeping statement. Conflating a childhood ADHD diagnosis with the mental issues of the German Wings’ pilot. By that logic, I have to be weary of a ton of people that I know….

I know I wouldn’t want a pilot with either severe depression or an inability to pay attention. Call me crazy (pardon the pun).

 

[mryan75]

Correct. When I was 10. After my teacher suggested to my parents that the reason I wasn’t paying attention could be ADHD, prompting a visit to a psychologist. Do you think that psychologist ever saw a 10 year old that she didn’t prescribe meds to? Not a chance.

I find it interesting that I need to retake the infallible Cogscreen AE every year…and I need a neuropsychological evaluation. So when I do that in November, what will have changed? Thus:

- I attended my first year of college. A’s and B’s.
- I haven’t taken any ADHD meds…still.

So at least the neuropsychologist will have an easy job when submitting a report that addresses “history and symptoms,diagnosis, treatment plan, aviation operational experience, and prognosis.” It will read something like this:

“no changes since last November.”

Well I’m glad you got it sorted and I wish you the best. It’s u fortunate how many parents have screwed their kids over by getting them psych prescriptions from school psychologists, but I completely understand the FAAs position.

 

[WDD]

Do you want to be an airline pilot / commercial pilot / get paid for flying? Then be amazed you got your medical, and just do what you need to do to keep it.

Do you want to only fly for fun? (Which I don't think so, as you would have gotten a third class instead). If flying only for a hobby, then do not let the medical get revoked, and don't renew it but live with Basic Med for the rest of your flying days.

BTW - if you're after an airline career, you are to be congratulated for figuring out how to get your first class medical. SO much smarter than spending years and money only to find out you can't get a medical.

 

[Salty]

I know I wouldn’t want a pilot with either severe depression or an inability to pay attention. Call me crazy (pardon the pun).

There are dozens of vocations in which that would be true that don't have such ridiculous limitations (by which I mean forcing you to jump through huge hoops because of a childhood diagnosis that's known to be over-diagnosed)

 

[AnonPIlot]

Understand that neurological disorders are scary to the FAA and for good reason. The Germanwings murder/suicide event spooked a lot of people. They are not changing any time soon.

your choices are to comply or not fly. It’s harsh, but that’s what life is. Welcome to adult life. If you don’t want to fly professionally, you could look at a program called BasicMed, which is an exam with your doctor, nothing goes to the FAA. But to go pro, you’re with this.

You can get 'BasicMed' if you've ever had an SI granted?

 

[Palmpilot]

You can get 'BasicMed' if you've ever had an SI granted?

Yes.

 

[mryan75]

There are dozens of vocations in which that would be true that don't have such ridiculous limitations (by which I mean forcing you to jump through huge hoops because of a childhood diagnosis that's known to be over-diagnosed)

You consider expecting pilots who fly other people around to not have any form of psychosis or other major mental disorder “ridiculous”?

Okay.

 

[Terry M - 3CK (Chicago)]

I think not too many years ago (5-10?) there was no path to a med if you had an ADHD Rx on your chart.

Also - you noted a cognitive issue with the 1st test. Certain psych meds result in cognitive decline which is a concern of the FAA too.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

Understand that neurological disorders are scary to the FAA and for good reason. The Germanwings murder/suicide event spooked a lot of people. They are not changing any time soon.

your choices are to comply or not fly. It’s harsh, but that’s what life is. Welcome to adult life. If you don’t want to fly professionally, you could look at a program called BasicMed, which is an exam with your doctor, nothing goes to the FAA. But to go pro, you’re with this.

It’s also complete bs. This posters history has nothing to do with German wings. That’s everyone’s excuse when okc is being a dick. They are not keeping us safe. If you could see some of the crazy people they allow to have a first class and compare that to this story you would change your tune.

it is something he will just have to comply with but it’s not right. He’s getting screwed for no legitimate reason.

 

[bflynn]

It’s also complete bs. This posters history has nothing to do with German wings. That’s everyone’s excuse when okc is being a dick. They are not keeping us safe. If you could see some of the crazy people they allow to have a first class and compare that to this story you would change your tune.

The FAA is hyper sensitive about neurological issues because we cannot predict what the brain will do. They got much more sensitive after GermanWings. Even though ADHD and depression/suicide aren't even close to the same thing, they are both neurological and therefore a red flag to the FAA.

I agree, the safety impacts between the two are nowhere close to even. But the outcome is nearly identical.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

The FAA is hyper sensitive about neurological issues because we cannot predict what the brain will do. They got much more sensitive after GermanWings. Even though ADHD and depression/suicide aren't even close to the same thing, they are both neurological and therefore a red flag to the FAA.

I agree, the safety impacts between the two are nowhere close to even. But the outcome is nearly identical.

It should not be nearly identical. That’s the point. The FAA is wrong. They let people fly that should not fly and ground people that are fine. It’s stupid.

 

[Magman]

Is “MOSAIC” any closer to reality yet?

 

[WDD]

The FAA is hyper sensitive about neurological issues because we cannot predict what the brain will do. They got much more sensitive after GermanWings. Even though ADHD and depression/suicide aren't even close to the same thing, they are both neurological and therefore a red flag to the FAA.

I agree, the safety impacts between the two are nowhere close to even. But the outcome is nearly identical.

When real world evidence and theory compete - RWE wins. For GA, we have years of data of people flying on a drivers license and Basic Med without a rash of crashes, suicides, etc.

If 3rd class is eliminated and replaced from the start with with Basic Med we can let the FAA focus on the ATP’s / first class medicals.

I just don’t see data that all the effort and resources of third class is effective.

 

[WaitingForSI]

When real world evidence and theory compete - RWE wins. For GA, we have years of data of people flying on a drivers license and Basic Med without a rash of crashes, suicides, etc.

If 3rd class is eliminated and replaced from the start with with Basic Med we can let the FAA focus on the ATP’s / first class medicals.

I just don’t see data that all the effort and resources of third class is effective.

So what can we do to push that? If we all were to push harder to eliminate the 3rd class, wouldn’t it have occurred already? Is there any kind of group or movement that is advocating for this?

 

[WDD]

So what can we do to push that?

I have no idea.