Shoulder harness Yes or No

txflyer said:
And if you plan on getting your plane judged like at OSH, ANY modification from stock will ding you.
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How about a modification to your face? Think any judges will ding a guy on that? I think I personally would put in the harnesses and skip the trophy.:yes:
 
txflyer said:
I could not believe the port to get into the belly gun.

It looked like my 12 year old grand daughter couldn't squeeze through it.

If they told me "that's your position soldier" I might have run off and went AWOL. No freakin' way I'm getting down into that thing... :nonod:
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I'm 6'2" and fit in it just fine.
 
Our RV-8A has five point Hooker harnesses. At first, we thought this was overkill, but after a year of flying the RV we both love them. Turbulence is a non-issue when you're strapped down, and aerobatics are a whole lot more fun when you're not coming off the seat.

The issue of a helmet is an interesting one that I've discussed with other RV owners. It's funny, WRT motorcycles, helmets have become accepted, and are even seen as "cool", while pilots who wear helmets are still met with derision, even though the crash benefits are similar.

Mary and I have discussed wearing flight helmets (for crash protection and noise suppression) but decided that the abuse we would take from fellow pilots was just too much to bear. lol
 
Just to be another guy piling on, I always use them in the plane and the car. When I bought my '66 Mooney, it only had lap belts. At the first annual, I had inertial reels installed and didn't feel comfortable flying the time with just the lap belts. If the BAS belts were STC'ed for my plane, I would have done those.

Obviously I would fly in a plane that only has lap belts because I did, but I do not prefer it. I would never fly in a plane that was equipped with shoulder belts and not use them. Except of course when I needed to get something, or move around during cruise.
 
Dav8or said:
How about a modification to your face? Think any judges will ding a guy on that? I think I personally would put in the harnesses and skip the trophy.:yes:
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I agree, but I'm not lying I just had a conversation today with a pilot who crashed a 210, and he said he thinks if he had shoulder harnesses, he'd be dead.

The cargo came forward and screwed him. The crash was manageable, and the passenger ended up only biting his tongue. But all the cargo was on the pilot's side, and that came forward and pushed Glen seat and all forward into the dash breaking 14 bones according to him. So, every crash has it's dynamics.

What I got out of it was watch your cargo. It can kill you when otherwise you'd be o.k.
 
I'm a believer in shoulder harness and have them in my plane.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
I'm 6'2" and fit in it just fine.
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petrolero said:
If you have a shoulder harness there is no choice for TO&L. :dunno:
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txflyer said:
I agree, but I'm not lying I just had a conversation today with a pilot who crashed a 210, and he said he thinks if he had shoulder harnesses, he'd be dead....
...What I got out of it was watch your cargo. It can kill you when otherwise you'd be o.k.
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Like public health (think vaccines) it's a statistics game, percentages, a mitigation strategy.

As a teenager I was in the passenger seat of a Corvair when it went out of control on a wet straight downhill and we went up an embankment, flipped upside down and ended up in a small ravine. None of us had our belts on. My Dad held on to the wheel and only lost a patch of hair from skidding upside down. My brother and I tumbled around the cabin and exchanged seats. Only shock and a few bruises. Fortunately the windows were up. Despite the no belt survival, I never rode in a car again without at least the lap belt fastened.

In the 80s I totaled a sailplane crashing into a hillside of stunted trees (old strip mine). Every component was broken except the rudder and one aileron. The tail cone was broken and the cabin split. I ended up doing a 180, sitting on the ground firmly strapped into my seat holding the stick. My only injury was a very small cut on my thumb's knuckle where some broken plexi hit it. I had a 4 point harness firmly pulled down and it worked well.

I have a 4 point harness in my RV10 and use it for TOs and Landings. I sometimes remove it during cruise but I strap it back up for convective passages and any inkling of rotor or CAT. It's nice having installed some bracketts to hold the shoulder straps out of the way for fair weather cruising.

To me it's just playing percentages the way I see them.
 
After seeing a number of survivable accidents where pilots and/or passengers were killed due to hitting the panel with their heads I think shoulder harnesses are a must. I hate them but wear them. I installed them in my 1960 175 because its simple and could save a life. You can slip them off and behind the seat when cruising but I always make sure me and any passengers up front are wearing them for landing. Better to have and not need than need and not have.

Frank
 
One night working the ER at any hospital will convince you to use any and all restraint devices available in any vehicle.
 
Much better to simply not have the need for a sholder harness.........
 
I used to think they had no benefit because I'd crash hard enough to be dead anyway.

I then read enough NTSB reports to convince me otherwise. Now I'm looking at putting upgraded shoulder harnesses in the 310 vs the stock ones.
 
Edgefly said:
Much better to simply not have the need for a sholder harness.........
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Wearing them while you don't need them is not for dont-need-them's sake, it's for things-change-in-an-instant-without-much-warning's sake.
 
Last time I checked the nice inertial reel ones weren't available for my aircraft and the ones that were appeared decidedly uncomfortable. Might have another look at that issue at the Show, though.
 
Socata's TB series makes it easy. The my Tampico has inertial reel automotive type seatbelts in the front seats. Comfortable and not an issue.
The back seats have separate lap and shoulder belts.

Jim
 
steingar said:
Last time I checked the nice inertial reel ones weren't available for my aircraft and the ones that were appeared decidedly uncomfortable. Might have another look at that issue at the Show, though.
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Do check it out. I bought the ones sold by Alpha and love them. It's pretty much just like your car.
 
txflyer said:
And if you plan on getting your plane judged like at OSH, ANY modification from stock will ding you.

I thought about having mine judged, but after reading the stipulations, I don't think it would even place.

It's been Frankensteined too much.... :sad:


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That's not necessarily true. Av Shilo's Comanche is highly modified and it won both a Lindy at OSH for best Comanche as well as the Comanche Society Best Of award.
 
I wear them whenever I'm in aircraft that have them equipped. I have some students that hate them above anything else. They say that the belt rubs their neck. :rolleyes2:

I look at them and tell them to get over it.
 
Does any one know the shoulder harness upgrade options for a Grumman Tiger? I did google search, not much information available. Thanks
 
I know of two instances where shoulder harnesses ( aircraft type, not car type) would have saved one life and in another accident saved the pilot from being badly injured by the rear seat passenger coming forward in a twin commanche and using him as an airbag. He never flew again. They should be mandatory.
 
I dropped a couple grand adding the real Piper shoulder harness kit to my 1968 235.
 
People who say look at the ED of a hospitable and you'll use all things saftey etc

Quite a few folks I saw they were circling the drain were fat and out of shape, CHF, COPD, diabeties, etc, etc.

If your BMI is over 24 or resting pulse is much over 60bpm or BP could be stated as hypertensive, you are DQed from talking about "saftey"....EVER :lol:
 
Before there were shoulder harnesses the Aeronca C3 had a big cushion into which you could do a face-plant when you crashed, which you were more than likely to do since you couldn't see where the heck you were going, but when someone invented a thing called forward visibility it had to be done away with because that's where they wanted to put the windshield.

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AeroncaC2_P2B.jpg
 
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Henning said:
That's not necessarily true. Av Shilo's Comanche is highly modified and it won both a Lindy at OSH for best Comanche as well as the Comanche Society Best Of award.
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I'm going to observe this year since it's my first trip.

If the collective voice of the people start raving it should be judged, I'll consider it.

I don't hire my polishing done, so it's not mirror finished like I expect many of the birds there will be. I don't know what to expect, so that's why I'll just watch and learn this time.
 
txflyer said:
I'm going to observe this year since it's my first trip.

If the collective voice of the people start raving it should be judged, I'll consider it.

I don't hire my polishing done, so it's not mirror finished like I expect many of the birds there will be. I don't know what to expect, so that's why I'll just watch and learn this time.
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May as well let it get judged, doesn't cost anything.
 
The 'kota has inertia reels. Harnesses on for taxi, departure, and arrival. On long flights I'll release mine and snap it on the handy snap fixture on the overhead. It's easy to reach up and put it back on when I need it. I do find turbulence more tolerable with the harness off since it doesn't chaff my neck.
 
For harnesses that chaff, you can get chaff pads to wrap on the belt from dive shops that handle technical diving stuff.
 
James331 said:
People who say look at the ED of a hospitable and you'll use all things saftey etc

Quite a few folks I saw they were circling the drain were fat and out of shape, CHF, COPD, diabeties, etc, etc.

If your BMI is over 24 or resting pulse is much over 60bpm or BP could be stated as hypertensive, you are DQed from talking about "saftey"....EVER :lol:
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:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl: Funny cause it is true.
 
ARFlyer said:
I wear them whenever I'm in aircraft that have them equipped. I have some students that hate them above anything else. They say that the belt rubs their neck. :rolleyes2:



I look at them and tell them to get over it.
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ROFL. My truck does that. I just wear collared shirts and tuck it under the collar. Silly thing is built into the seat and just hits me wrong. No big deal. Definitely not worth whining about.

You could send the little princesses this link if they really whine loudly, though. Ha.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000CAINRK?pc_redir=1405151148
 
Henning said:
For harnesses that chaff, you can get chaff pads to wrap on the belt from dive shops that handle technical diving stuff.
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Walmart sells fleece pads that attach to your shoulder harness by wrapping around it, and velcroing to itself. No more chaffing.

I think they were five bucks apiece, and they were still in Atlas when we sold him.
 
Count me in the camp of those who don't fly without them. All three airplanes I fly currently are equipped with front shoulder belts, and they don't move until both mine and the passenger's are fastened.

I am familiar with one local case a few years ago, where a Comanche lost power on final and landed in a river or sandbar. Wound up with minimal damage to the airplane, but the pilot's face in about 117 pieces, due to lack of shoulder restraints.

And yes, I do work in the emergency department, and do use every safety device available to me in any motorized conveyance, as I've spent too much time seeing the results of those who do otherwise.

As a student pilot a few years ago, I had one old instructor who refused to put his on, even though the airplane was equipped with them. I told him that as a student, I didn't have standing to force him to put it on, but if we came to a sudden stop, to keep his blood and brain matter on his side of the cockpit. Still didn't phase him...:mad2:
 
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