Should I go to College?

Should I complete a bachelors or associates degree based on my plans?

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forseth11

forseth11

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Forseth11
Hello everyone!

I am trying to decide whether I should stop at my associates of science or finish that and continue onto a bachelors of science degree.

About me:
  • CFI (working on CFII)
  • Wanna be entrepreneur
  • 19 years old
  • Attending community college for associates of science degree
  • I have 3 years of paid software development experience
My Goals:
  • Start multiple businesses (aviation and/or internet oriented)
  • Become a DPE (someday as soon as I can)
  • Have a job / self employed / business where I do not have to be gone for more than 3 days a week
  • Flexible schedule
  • Someday become a sophisticated and accredited investor
  • Maybe fly corporate for a short time
If I were to go for a bachelors degree, it would be one of two things:
  1. Bachelors of Computer Science (current plan)
  2. Bachelors of Business Science
Both of these are kind of obsolete for where I want to be. The computer science one sounds like a good backup plan, but the industry changes so quickly that you are obsolete out of college. Most places look for people with experience, and I have that.

I definitely want to and will finish my associates.

When I have asked this question, here are the responses I get from different kinds of people:
My parents: Suggested to go all the way. My dad says I need it for airlines, but I insist that I do not want to do that, and at most I would get on with a regional to have cash flow while starting businesses on the side. My mom leans toward no college. My dad has a bachelors of business and flies for JetBlue. My mom has a Masters in education and is a teacher.

My friends: It is a 50/50 split. The ones who are going after or have already made their own businesses say I should not go to college. Those who work a regular job say I should go to college. Many people say it is needed to just be there on a resume or for credibility or something like that. I kind of feel like $30,000 is not worth having a little more credibility.

My classmates: They wonder why I don't quit now and just go after this stuff.

Which way do you think I should go and why?
 
I recommend finishing the bachelor's degree. A 4-year college degree is getting to be what a high school diploma was 50 or 60 years ago; not having one will likely shut you out of a lot of possible fallback plans and backup paths. Maybe you won't ever need those---but if you do, you'll be really glad for it. It's not uncommon now for resumes to get filtered by automation for minimum requirements, and if you don't have that degree (and it's on their list) then your resume will never even get to a human being in order for them to see how great the rest of it is.

Honestly, the fact that you have one matters quite a lot more than what it's in (within reason, at least). It also matters that it's from a real school and not something like University of Phoenix.
 
Computer science majors seem to be in huge demand, at least in New England. They get well paid, my daughter just started at a military contractor at $70+k per year, computer science bachelors degree, they are still looking for engineers and programmers.
 
forseth11 said:
Hello everyone!

I am trying to decide whether I should stop at my associates of science or finish that and continue onto a bachelors of science degree.

About me:
  • CFI (working on CFII)
  • Wanna be entrepreneur
  • 19 years old
  • Attending community college for associates of science degree
  • I have 3 years of paid software development experience
My Goals:
  • Start multiple businesses (aviation and/or internet oriented)
  • Become a DPE (someday as soon as I can)
  • Have a job / self employed / business where I do not have to be gone for more than 3 days a week
  • Flexible schedule
  • Someday become a sophisticated and accredited investor
  • Maybe fly corporate for a short time
If I were to go for a bachelors degree, it would be one of two things:
  1. Bachelors of Computer Science (current plan)
  2. Bachelors of Business Science
Both of these are kind of obsolete for where I want to be. The computer science one sounds like a good backup plan, but the industry changes so quickly that you are obsolete out of college. Most places look for people with experience, and I have that.

I definitely want to and will finish my associates.

When I have asked this question, here are the responses I get from different kinds of people:
My parents: Suggested to go all the way. My dad says I need it for airlines, but I insist that I do not want to do that, and at most I would get on with a regional to have cash flow while starting businesses on the side. My mom leans toward no college. My dad has a bachelors of business and flies for JetBlue. My mom has a Masters in education and is a teacher.

My friends: It is a 50/50 split. The ones who are going after or have already made their own businesses say I should not go to college. Those who work a regular job say I should go to college. Many people say it is needed to just be there on a resume or for credibility or something like that. I kind of feel like $30,000 is not worth having a little more credibility.

My classmates: They wonder why I don't quit now and just go after this stuff.

Which way do you think I should go and why?
Click to expand...

IMO being an entrepreneur is not a college course.
 
Why not get a business degree, with a focus on Entrepreneurship? Business degrees generally help you understand the strategic and financial aspects of starting a business, and can still be a generic fallback if the startups don’t work as well as planned.

The one thing I will say, based solely off of your brief introduction, is that you seem unfocused. There are a lot of ideas you are proposing which don’t seem to have a lot of intersections that would allow you to pursue them simultaneously. I’d suggest that you sit down and figure out what you really want to do for a living, see if there’s a marketable need for that skill set, and research what barriers you have to overcome in order to build/sustain a startup.




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FormerHangie said:
Do you have a business opportunity that you can act on now?
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Not at this very moment. I have my own LLC so I can do business as whenever and if anything comes up. I do however have 3 website business ideas and 3 others not associated with the internet which I really want to go after. I also have a small group of friends going after entrepreneurship and are designers, web developers, back end developers, financial adviser, with business experience, and other professional skills. The issue I have is time. I simply do not have any free time anymore. I am either doing homework (25 hours a week), flight instructing, or training.

mscard88 said:
Only you can make that decision for yourself. You may regret not getting the 4 year degree later on in life though. Good luck.
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That is what one person told me. Someone told me that when you are young, you learn very fast, and to use this to complete college. I use the same argument to say, why not use it to learn the steep learning curve for the business sector and learn stuff about that.

PaulS said:
Are you in / going into debt for college?
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For associates, no. For bachelors, yes. I can get about one semester into bachelors before I need loans. This is a major reason I am strongly considering not going for it.

simtech said:
Go for the 4 year, you may need it later in life, and start a business while still in college.
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I can't start anything. I literally have no free time each week. The only way I can do so is extend my college to 6-8 years. The issue with a science degree is that it is very homework heavy with four hour classes for lab hours. For example, on Calculus 2 alone, I spend 7-10 hours per week for the class and homework.
 
What do YOU want? Do you want to be a professional pilot? Then do what it takes to be successful as a professional pilot.
https://www.ctcd.edu/academics/prog...ms/business-and-business-technology/aviation/

If you want to be an "entrepreneur", then do that. But, I'd recommend you have a solid product or service and a workable business plan before bailing out on the traditional route.

If you continue in college, make sure your degree program is something that will make you eminently employable as a new college grad. Successful entrepreneurs are like rock stars, success takes a lot of talent, a lot of social engineering, and a lot of luck. But, successful business men and women get that way through a good education and a lot of hard work.
 
Last edited:
The expression "**** or get off the pot" comes to mind.

Either drop out or go the full way. Stopping in the middle only proves you don't finish what you start.

Sure, there are vocations where an associates degree may be of use. But that doesn't sound like where your aspirations lie. Someone should do a study on the ratio of billionaire dropouts to billionaires in general. Might end some of the "I don't need it anyway" ********.

And as for obsolescence... what field of study doesn't teach 'obsolete' information? History, Literature, Mathematics, Medicine, Law, Economics? Nope. It's all been done before. And the training is to understand the thought processes, not the current incarnation or latest craze.

Stay in school young person. It'll be done before you know it and you'll never have to say "if only I..."
 
SoonerAviator said:
There are entire degrees in Entrepreneurship, much less a single course. Not sure where you’re going with that.


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They also have college courses in Ethic Women Studies. Doesn’t make it worth the money you paid for the piece of paper.
 
forseth11 said:
Not at this very moment. I have my own LLC so I can do business as whenever and if anything comes up. I do however have 3 website business ideas and 3 others not associated with the internet which I really want to go after. I also have a small group of friends going after entrepreneurship and are designers, web developers, back end developers, financial adviser, with business experience, and other professional skills. The issue I have is time. I simply do not have any free time anymore. I am either doing homework (25 hours a week), flight instructing, or training.


That is what one person told me. Someone told me that when you are young, you learn very fast, and to use this to complete college. I use the same argument to say, why not use it to learn the steep learning curve for the business sector and learn stuff about that.


For associates, no. For bachelors, yes. I can get about one semester into bachelors before I need loans. This is a major reason I am strongly considering not going for it.


I can't start anything. I literally have no free time each week. The only way I can do so is extend my college to 6-8 years. The issue with a science degree is that it is very homework heavy with four hour classes for lab hours. For example, on Calculus 2 alone, I spend 7-10 hours per week for the class and homework.
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Finish the associates and move forward on something that provides you with income and schedule flexibility. Unless you need the Bachelors now for an opportunity that requires it, you can get it later should it become a requirement.
 
While many will remind me of all the the exceptions, More education = more options
Don't stop. Now is the easiest time to do this. The older you get generally the harder it becomes to finish or pursue an education. Life gets in the way. In my opinion a bachelors degree is the minimum that you need. Many positions won't even except a resume without a bachelors degree. I've seen people get the promotion just because they were the only one with a degree. Plus an education can never be taken away from you.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
They also have college courses in Ethic Women Studies. Doesn’t make it worth the money you paid for the piece of paper.
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Lol, not sure how you’re equating an liberal arts degree and a business degree, but okay.


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forseth11 said:
I can't start anything. I literally have no free time each week.
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You're posting on POA..you have free time. Just need to manage it better. You seem driven so I have no doubt you can make it work. But I still stand by finishing your 4 year first.
 
forseth11 said:
Both of these are kind of obsolete for where I want to be. The computer science one sounds like a good backup plan, but the industry changes so quickly that you are obsolete out of college. Most places look for people with recent experience, and I have that.
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FTFY.

Normally I would vote for finishing bachelors, but you make a compelling case to not do so, so I voted for finishing your associates. I will observe however, that your 3 year’s experience can go stale pretty fast for the same reason college education goes stale fast.

You also don’t say if you are financially independent yet or not. Living on your own and paying your own bills? Your goals are admirable, but what I would be looking for if you were my son (and I have a 20 y.o. In college so I have some recent experience on this topic) still living at home and eating my groceries is a specific path to meet one or more of those goals.

Good luck.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
They also have college courses in Ethic Women Studies. Doesn’t make it worth the money you paid for the piece of paper.
Click to expand...

The best education you can get in entrepreneurship is to work in a small business. Also, make sure you're working in a field where it's possible to start a small business.
 
SoonerAviator said:
Lol, not sure how you’re equating an liberal arts degree and a business degree, but okay.


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I’m a firm believer that you cannot teach entrepreneurship. A person has the drive and ideas or they do not.

I have my MBA, did nothing in regards in helping me be successful in my businesses. I went to school in my mid/late 20s. By that time I’ve already put together business plans, funded, started, ran and sold 3 successful ventures. I was being ‘taught’ by people with less business experience than myself even at my age.

Being successful doesn’t require a degree. Not all successful professions require degrees. I just hired a VP of sales at a $250k a year salary who never went to junior college. He manages people with bachelor degrees.
 
deyoung said:
I recommend finishing the bachelor's degree. A 4-year college degree is getting to be what a high school diploma was 50 or 60 years ago; not having one will likely shut you out of a lot of possible fallback plans and backup paths. Maybe you won't ever need those---but if you do, you'll be really glad for it. It's not uncommon now for resumes to get filtered by automation for minimum requirements, and if you don't have that degree (and it's on their list) then your resume will never even get to a human being in order for them to see how great the rest of it is.

Honestly, the fact that you have one matters quite a lot more than what it's in (within reason, at least). It also matters that it's from a real school and not something like University of Phoenix.
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This is true if you are going to be an employee. Both mean nothing in the business sector. It will shutout many fallback right... well... in the computer science field, they will hire based on experience without a bachelors degree (have had it). The information age is focused on skills rather than degree in regards to the tech industry. The only case I can see this being useful is to make a little bit extra, but there are 6 month courses which guarantee a job at bachelors pay for computer science which cost $3000 - $5000 to complete. It makes college obsolete for this field. For others, I would definitely need a degree, but I will be spreading myself too thin. I have a love for CS and it can be applied in business startups for efficiency and avoiding using many employees.

PaulS said:
Computer science majors seem to be in huge demand, at least in New England. They get well paid, my daughter just started at a military contractor at $70+k per year, computer science bachelors degree, they are still looking for engineers and programmers.
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Yes, I know. I developed freelance for 3 years, and this experience landed me a job this spring, but after the four interviews, I turned it down because I would rather flight instruct. Most places "require" a degree, but they really value experience and skills more. I also don't ever want to have to work a 40 hour a week job unless it is for my own business to build it.

Jamie Kirk said:
IMO being an entrepreneur is not a college course.
Click to expand...
It is not. That is why I am doing computer science as a fall back. I have 6 fallback plans, college does not play a roll until plan 3.

SoonerAviator said:
Why not get a business degree, with a focus on Entrepreneurship? Business degrees generally help you understand the strategic and financial aspects of starting a business, and can still be a generic fallback if the startups don’t work as well as planned.

The one thing I will say, based solely off of your brief introduction, is that you seem unfocused. There are a lot of ideas you are proposing which don’t seem to have a lot of intersections that would allow you to pursue them simultaneously. I’d suggest that you sit down and figure out what you really want to do for a living, see if there’s a marketable need for that skill set, and research what barriers you have to overcome in order to build/sustain a startup.
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I considered that, but after further review, it does not teach anything on starting a business. It deals more with managing or corporate positions rather than fundamental business stuff. Besides, I can learn much more WAYYYYYYY faster via reading, my contacts, my mentors, and practice. I like your idea though. I think computer science will be more fun for me, and more valuable. When it comes down to it, both amounts of knowledge can be learned faster when teaching yourself. This is why the education system is so obsolete. It hasn't changed in 150 years, but technology has.

I have two very focused business plans, and I have written both business plans, and I just have to complete market research to make it complete. What I really want to do for a living is build businesses, make them passive, then continue to the next. Then use profits to invest in assets and growing. I do not care about the field in most cases, but I want to start with something I am very knowledgeable on. My focus is business and investing its self.
 
Jamie Kirk said:
I’m a firm believer that you cannot teach entrepreneurship. A person has the drive and ideas or they do not.

I have my MBA, did nothing in regards in helping me be successful in my businesses. I went to school in my mid/late 20s. By that time I’ve already put together business plans, funded, started, ran and sold 3 successful ventures. I was being ‘taught’ by people with less business experience than myself even at my age.

Being successful doesn’t require a degree. Not all successful professions require degrees. I just hired a VP of sales at a $250k a year salary who never went to junior college. He manages people with bachelor degrees.
Click to expand...

Something like 30% of businesses fail in the first year or two, 50% in the first 5 years. There are lots of Entrepreneurs who can’t run a business for ****. Sometimes it’s a poor business plan, inadequate capital, or market dynamics. Most of the time, it’s just someone who makes poor decisions with company finances. My comment about a business degree with emphasis on entrepreneurship is that many of those degrees involve finance/accounting related to startups and evaluating cash flow/return on equity. Those courses aren’t meant to teach someone how to be an entrepreneur per say, but how to plan and establish a business once you have a workable idea.

No one said being successful requires a 4-yr degree, either. It’s just a good fallback since it has become the de facto standard for most medium to large companies. Mom-n-Pop businesses and smaller sole proprietorships probably won’t care.


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wilkersk said:
What do YOU want? Do you want to be a professional pilot? Then do what it takes to be successful as a professional pilot.
https://www.ctcd.edu/academics/prog...ms/business-and-business-technology/aviation/

If you want to be an "entrepreneur", then do that. But, I'd recommend you have a solid product or service and a workable business plan before bailing out on the traditional route.

If you continue in college, make sure your degree program is something that will make you eminently employable as a new college grad. Successful entrepreneurs are like rock stars, success takes a lot of talent, a lot of social engineering, and a lot of luck. But, successful business men and women get that way through a good education and a lot of hard work.
Click to expand...
I have three business plans written, and I have a fourth which I will do once I have credibility and expirence because the 4th requires $3M to startup, but the rest cost $300 - $1000, but a lot of time to develop (which I do not have with school).

I want to be a professional pilot, but as a DPE or corporate (not airlines). If possible, I would love to remain a CFI and have a flight school. My goal overall is full time entrepreneur, but as of right now, it is to be part time entrepreneur and full time instructor.

See, I am already employable as a software developer. I will make about 20% less since I don't have a degree, but it works as a fall back.

I think the rock star thing has more to do with big businesses. Smaller ones becoming passive has relatively lower risk (given the owners know the laws, market, have a plan, exit plan, strategy, etc).

I have made mini/fake businesses since I was 10. I started with minecraft servers then I made game mods. Today, I still make about $300 - $400 per month off of the game mods, and I spend less than 4 hours per month maintaining them. I want to work this same model but scale it in a professional area. I have self educated myself via online highschool, and I am doing the same for business knowledge and theories and practices.

Ravioli said:
The expression "**** or get off the pot" comes to mind.

Either drop out or go the full way. Stopping in the middle only proves you don't finish what you start.

Sure, there are vocations where an associates degree may be of use. But that doesn't sound like where your aspirations lie. Someone should do a study on the ratio of billionaire dropouts to billionaires in general. Might end some of the "I don't need it anyway" ********.

And as for obsolescence... what field of study doesn't teach 'obsolete' information? History, Literature, Mathematics, Medicine, Law, Economics? Nope. It's all been done before. And the training is to understand the thought processes, not the current incarnation or latest craze.

Stay in school young person. It'll be done before you know it and you'll never have to say "if only I..."
Click to expand...
Stopping at an associates is a degree, so I don't see it as stopping in the middle. I began college because I didn't have everything planned out yet, and I don't want to feel stuck just because I started. I learned some valuable stuff so far regarding economics, public speaking, and... actually that is about all I found useful. xD Perhaps you are right regarding the billionaire thing, but success is what you create of it. I expect to fail several times before I get it right, and I expect to fail more after that, but I am willing to keep going even with that.

I talked to several employers and others looking for jobs in computer science. The jobs want someone with a degree, two years experience or interning, and 6 months of training at their company. The two years are to make up for college not teaching the skills the market wants. I have a friend who owns 27 companies and many need software developers. He actually contacted me for one of two positions or both if I could: software development at his foundation (since I had experience) and/or instructing at his new school and FBO he is starting.

FormerHangie said:
Finish the associates and move forward on something that provides you with income and schedule flexibility. Unless you need the Bachelors now for an opportunity that requires it, you can get it later should it become a requirement.
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I like this idea. It actually makes me think of something.

To EVERYONE: What if I got my associates then continued with what I want to do while completing 1-2 classes per semester including the summer semester. It would take a lot longer to complete, but I will end up with both without losing time to work on the other.
 
Morgan3820 said:
While many will remind me of all the the exceptions, More education = more options
Don't stop. Now is the easiest time to do this. The older you get generally the harder it becomes to finish or pursue an education. Life gets in the way. In my opinion a bachelors degree is the minimum that you need. Many positions won't even except a resume without a bachelors degree. I've seen people get the promotion just because they were the only one with a degree. Plus an education can never be taken away from you.
Click to expand...
The thing is... I have so many options right now. It another option worth $30,000? The age thing is my argument to stop. If that is the case, I would rather learn the steep learning curve of business development. Since I have experience with 6 programming languages, I believe that going back to college for just programming courses (I will finish basics with associates), then it will be considerably easier. I would rather educate myself in business than for a degree, but time does not permit both at the same time.

GLMS_NC said:
Get the bachelors.

https://www.ssa.gov/retirementpolicy/research/education-earnings.html

http://www.hamiltonproject.org/papers/major_decisions_what_graduates_earn_over_their_lifetimes

https://www.usnews.com/education/be.../how-higher-education-affects-lifetime-salary
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The issues with those is that a majority of people are employees, thus they get paid based on experience and education.

Jamie Kirk said:
I’m a firm believer that you cannot teach entrepreneurship. A person has the drive and ideas or they do not.

I have my MBA, did nothing in regards in helping me be successful in my businesses. I went to school in my mid/late 20s. By that time I’ve already put together business plans, funded, started, ran and sold 3 successful ventures. I was being ‘taught’ by people with less business experience than myself even at my age.

Being successful doesn’t require a degree. Not all successful professions require degrees. I just hired a VP of sales at a $250k a year salary who never went to junior college. He manages people with bachelor degrees.
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Thank you for your input! I think you are the only person one here from the business quadrant.
 
I just have a high school diploma. I'm not one that can sit in class and study. I make a good living without a College education. Heck I own more airplanes than all my friends that threw away $50-$100,000 on a education they don't use. :)
 
SoonerAviator said:
Something like 30% of businesses fail in the first year or two, 50% in the first 5 years. There are lots of Entrepreneurs who can’t run a business for ****. Sometimes it’s a poor business plan, inadequate capital, or market dynamics. Most of the time, it’s just someone who makes poor decisions with company finances. My comment about a business degree with emphasis on entrepreneurship is that many of those degrees involve finance/accounting related to startups and evaluating cash flow/return on equity. Those courses aren’t meant to teach someone how to be an entrepreneur per say, but how to plan and establish a business once you have a workable idea.

No one said being successful requires a 4-yr degree, either. It’s just a good fallback since it has become the de facto standard for most medium to large companies. Mom-n-Pop businesses and smaller sole proprietorships probably won’t care.


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You’re smart with finances or your not. My former VP of sales was a USC MBA graduate. Guy would never understand the bottom line. Also never mattered how much money he made because it was always not enough. Income doubled with me and was more broke than when he started.

When we were looking for a new financial guy a few years ago I told all applicants wanting my business to bring me their financials and portfolios.

You don’t need to go to college to understand how to be financially responsible. And just because you went to college doesn’t mean your financially responsible.
 
Sorry man. In the 1960's most people were fully employable with a high school diploma. By 1990's it was Bachelor's or bust. It ain't moving backwards.

Everyone knows a 'brilliant kid who knows him some computer stuff and can fix my xyz machine every time.' Nobody pays them six figure salaries for that. They just say nice stuff and pat the hapless lad on the head. What they should do is kick the kid in butt and tell them to get some credentials.
 
Studies show that those who complete bachelors degrees on average earn almost $1M over a lifetime than those without. Mercenary considerations aside, completing a college degree, especially with, say project-based honors will help develop and hone critical thinking, writing, and oral communication skills that will be important for a success as a future entrepreneur or business leader. Spending time in college in close association with good mentors will also build valuable professional networks of individuals familiar with your skills and integrity. Finishing up has many pros, especially if you control your debt accumulation. But remember the first sentence. And remember that degrees can remove barriers to advancement or recognition. A degree is a credential of a certain level of accomplishment.
 
forseth11 said:
The thing is... I have so many options right now. It another option worth $30,000? The age thing is my argument to stop. If that is the case, I would rather learn the steep learning curve of business development. Since I have experience with 6 programming languages, I believe that going back to college for just programming courses (I will finish basics with associates), then it will be considerably easier. I would rather educate myself in business than for a degree, but time does not permit both at the same time.


The issues with those is that a majority of people are employees, thus they get paid based on experience and education.


Thank you for your input! I think you are the only person one here from the business quadrant.
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I’m not saying don’t go to college, it has benefits. But I’m 36 and have 7 years of schooling and less than 10% of what I learned in business helped me be successful.

I’m not successful because I went to school. I was successful because I worked when others partied. I saved while others spent. I took chances when others didn’t. I made plans when others followed someone else’s plan.

Now connections at college is absolutely something that can set your business up. But I was working full time while going to school so I didn’t socialize.
 
SoonerAviator said:
Something like 30% of businesses fail in the first year or two, 50% in the first 5 years. There are lots of Entrepreneurs who can’t run a business for ****. Sometimes it’s a poor business plan, inadequate capital, or market dynamics. Most of the time, it’s just someone who makes poor decisions with company finances. My comment about a business degree with emphasis on entrepreneurship is that many of those degrees involve finance/accounting related to startups and evaluating cash flow/return on equity. Those courses aren’t meant to teach someone how to be an entrepreneur per say, but how to plan and establish a business once you have a workable idea.

No one said being successful requires a 4-yr degree, either. It’s just a good fallback since it has become the de facto standard for most medium to large companies. Mom-n-Pop businesses and smaller sole proprietorships probably won’t care.


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I believe it is 90% fail within 5 years. I am a strong believer that the success of a business is based on its foundation. The foundation is the founders or owners, and they must be smart and know how to run a business. For example, McDonald's sells hamburgers worse than the average person can make, but they succeed because they are smart and use genus real-estate. I am in no way saying I am going to be the right person for the job, but I definitely have the drive and I am actively teaching myself all I can so I can hopefully be better. So far I have read 5 business and investing books, and I am on number 6 right now. I know of and have several mentors who are both small business owners and multimillionaires from owning many businesses.

Those are good ideas by the way.

pigpenracing said:
I just have a high school diploma. I'm not one that can sit in class and study. I make a good living without a College education. Heck I own more airplanes than all my friends that threw away $50-$100,000 on a education they don't use. :)
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Wow! Very nice! I want to be like that.

Jamie Kirk said:
You’re smart with finances or your not. My former VP of sales was a USC MBA graduate. Guy would never understand the bottom line. Also never mattered how much money he made because it was always not enough. Income doubled with me and was more broke than when he started.

When we were looking for a new financial guy a few years ago I told all applicants wanting my business to bring me their financials and portfolios.

You don’t need to go to college to understand how to be financially responsible. And just because you went to college doesn’t mean your financially responsible.
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My focus right now is financial education. I want to avoid the rat race, and I want to avoid bad debt, but I am content with good debt.

School never has taught people how to be financially responsible and literate.

Ravioli said:
Sorry man. In the 1960's most people were fully employable with a high school diploma. By 1990's it was Bachelor's or bust. It ain't moving backwards.

Everyone knows a 'brilliant kid who knows him some computer stuff and can fix my xyz machine every time.' Nobody pays them six figure salaries for that. They just say nice stuff and pat the hapless lad on the head. What they should do is kick the kid in butt and tell them to get some credentials.
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I think it is going the other way. Especially in the technology field. Right now as an employee you are absolutely correct, but most places will take people on for skills rather than a degree. Additionally, with the internet, it has never been easier to become part of the 10% and build a business than it was in the industrial age and agrarian age.

I was offered a $45,000 (up to $85,000) per year entry-level job for a computer science, but I turned it down for this and flying. The guy I know who hires developers says he hardly looks at degrees. When I did my interview at multiple places, they gave me a timed computer test. They then preceded based mostly on that.
 
Finish what you started and work on your business.

It’s all ROI and college isn’t what it used to be

Smart move would have been to get your 2yr in a 2yr RN nurse program at a part time community college
 
People focus too much on the "subject you learn about" in college and whether it is "useful" IMO, and not enough on the far more general skills that go alongside a Bachelors' degree no matter the topic: discipline, time-management, focus, flexibility, writing, math, and generally learning about the world around us and the people in it (yes, that includes "19th Century French Literature" or what have you!). All of those ancillary skills will pay off later in ways you may not predict or even notice. And all the more reason to *not* pick a crappy school that just hands out paper.

Disclaimer: I'm a college professor, so naturally I believe in the value of the service I provide, or I wouldn't be doing this for a living. To me, college was (and still is) like "playtime for nerdy grownups." But even I, a confirmed academic, will be the first to admit that it's not for everybody, and that there are other ways to get those skills. So feel free to ignore me, if you know thyself. Which it sounds like you do! The more you reply to people, it sounds like you think you've already got what you need and just don't want to do it. So don't.

forseth11 said:
I want to start with something I am very knowledgeable on.
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All the more reason to be knowledgeable about as many things as possible, right? ;)

forseth11 said:
What if I got my associates then continued with what I want to do while completing 1-2 classes per semester including the summer semester. It would take a lot longer to complete, but I will end up with both without losing time to work on the other.
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I think this is a great idea. That a Bachelors degree has to get done in 4 years, by someone who does *nothing else* during that time, is an old-fashioned idea that is going away fast. My university has TONS of non-traditional students, gettin' it done in their own sweet time, juggling jobs and kids, and taking 6 or 8 years or however long it takes. It's like flight training: doing it intensive means you can do it in fewer hours. But you can spread it out if that's what your life is like.
 
chemgeek said:
Studies show that those who complete bachelors degrees on average earn almost $1M over a lifetime than those without. Mercenary considerations aside, completing a college degree, especially with, say project-based honors will help develop and hone critical thinking, writing, and oral communication skills that will be important for a success as a future entrepreneur or business leader. Spending time in college in close association with good mentors will also build valuable professional networks of individuals familiar with your skills and integrity. Finishing up has many pros, especially if you control your debt accumulation. But remember the first sentence. And remember that degrees can remove barriers to advancement or recognition. A degree is a credential of a certain level of accomplishment.
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Studies also show that most people work as an employee. I would love to see a study with entrepreneurs only included. Besides, I hate the idea of being capped at like $300,000 per year as an airline pilot. I want a path where I can continue without a cap, not to make more money, but to give more away and to create jobs for others. I just want enough to live comfortably, and then I can use the rest to build an "empire" one day which I would love to employee people and be there for natural disasters and stuff like that.

The only reason why I was going to college was for the connections. However, I have been making so many more in the aviation world which are much more valuable.

I don't think I will do college at all if I have to go into debt. However, I will continue at a very slow rate to avoid debt.

Jamie Kirk said:
I’m not saying don’t go to college, it has benefits. But I’m 36 and have 7 years of schooling and less than 10% of what I learned in business helped me be successful.

I’m not successful because I went to school. I was successful because I worked when others partied. I saved while others spent. I took chances when others didn’t. I made plans when others followed someone else’s plan.

Now connections at college is absolutely something that can set your business up. But I was working full time while going to school so I didn’t socialize.
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Hmm. I get it, I am taking everyone's advice with a grain of salt. Really I am liking point people bring up because it lets me think and reply to them to help make an educated decisions. I still have 2 years to decide.

I have never parties (once, but my friends and I played board games and discussed business ventures and life and education - no drugs, sex, or alcohol). You sound very smart especially with using yourself and time as an investment. I hope to do the same. I have my life planned out to age 30, and I am already making plans for when I pass. Always been a planner..

I find 10x more connections in the aviation world. So many people fly who are professionals in so many amazing fields. As someone who lives at an airport and an instructor, I get to meet a lot of very cool people.
 
James331 said:
Finish what you started and work on your business.

It’s all ROI and college isn’t what it used to be

Smart move would have been to get your 2yr in a 2yr RN nurse program at a part time community college
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Haha, I can't stand the sight of blood... or the thought.

By finish what I started, do you mean college? If so, I don't have time to do both. The only way I can do both is if I take 1-2 classes per semester rather than 3-4.

kath said:
People focus too much on the "subject you learn about" in college and whether it is "useful" IMO, and not enough on the far more general skills that go alongside a Bachelors' degree no matter the topic: discipline, time-management, focus, flexibility, writing, math, and generally learning about the world around us and the people in it (yes, that includes "19th Century French Literature" or what have you!). All of those ancillary skills will pay off later in ways you may not predict or even notice. And all the more reason to *not* pick a crappy school that just hands out paper.

Disclaimer: I'm a college professor, so naturally I believe in the value of the service I provide, or I wouldn't be doing this for a living. To me, college was (and still is) like "playtime for nerdy grownups." But even I, a confirmed academic, will be the first to admit that it's not for everybody, and that there are other ways to get those skills. So feel free to ignore me, if you know thyself. Which it sounds like you do! The more you reply to people, it sounds like you think you've already got what you need and just don't want to do it. So don't.



All the more reason to be knowledgeable about as many things as possible, right? ;)



I think this is a great idea. That a Bachelors degree has to get done in 4 years, by someone who does *nothing else* during that time, is an old-fashioned idea that is going away fast. My university has TONS of non-traditional students, gettin' it done in their own sweet time, juggling jobs and kids, and taking 6 or 8 years or however long it takes. It's like flight training: doing it intensive means you can do it in fewer hours. But you can spread it out if that's what your life is like.
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I feel like I have mastered many of those skills. I almost never procrastinate. I am very flexible with my schedule and obstacles and changes. I use google calendar to plan my every move, and I also make lists and ETAs to keep stuff timely. My mom is an English teacher, and I love to write (I once considered becoming a technical writer). Math... well I am doing computer science, and I am taking Calc 2 right now, so I'd say that is a check. Learning about the world around me isn't an issue until it includes 19th century french literature. xD I learned most of these by being independent young, and going to school online from 8th to 12th grade.

What do you teach by the way? Does it have to do with 19th Century French Literature?

----

I am really liking the drawn out idea a lot the more I think about it. I will sleep on this for awhile.
 
EVERYONE
I changed the poll. There is a new choice someone has brought to my attention.
 
I will share some of my experience with you...

I was, probably like you, someone who was good with computers in high school. I enjoyed working with technology so it just made sense to get a computer science degree. So I went to college and got my BS in computer science. Your school may vary from mine but most of the classes were heavily geared towards coding. We had data structures, database courses, a Unix course, and a few courses on basic hardware level stuff that didn't really leave you knowing how to be an assembly programmer but at least gave you a background so you understood how it worked.

In short, if you already know how to code you can probably skip 2/3 of it. Do you know your way around linux? Can you write shell scripts? Do you understand enough about programming to pick up an unfamiliar language? If you can say yes to all of these things then what are you going to college for? To say you have the degree? The college experience? Might as well major in something else you have interest in and maybe minor in CS just to cover your bases. If you really have paid coding experience that may well be worth more than a degree- a lot of my classmates barely could code. Good employers know that, they want people who know what they're doing more than people with a degree. A lot of them require at least an associates to get in the door, I assume because HR insists but once you get in the door it may not matter. Computer skills are actually pretty universal btw, the specific applications and programming languages change but the basic concepts don't, your education isn't that perishable. At most you'll need to take a couple weeks to a month to learn the new language/app.

I went the traditional route, I got my degree and I took a job in my field that payed the best in an area I was willing to live. Coding. I was one of the better programmers in my college classes... professors even told me as much. I actually really was/am good it. I don't say this to brag but to illustrate a point. One, while I was good at it I really didn't like it that much. I got into computers because I like building stuff- putting systems together and seeing what I can make them do/tinkering/etc. What you're probably going to do for real is some kind of data processing- moving data between a database and some entry/lookup screen. Interesting for a bit but... do it every day from your cubicle without really interacting with anyone for a few years and it becomes torture. Ahh but I'm a good coder so I'll get promoted out right? Nahh, doesn't work that way. If you're a good coder they want to keep your right in that cubicle because you're the only one who can knock out their quick changes in a short period. People who are good communicators get promoted, being skilled at your job just means they want to keep you in that job.

Anyway after about 5 years of stoically sitting in the chair in my cubicle rearranging the fields in the payroll manager's lookup screens, reformatting automated reports, and making the yearly changes in file formats that every state tax agency seemed to rotate constantly I couldn't stand it. Work was a matter of walking in the door when I had to be there and counting the seconds until I could leave. Honestly I'd probably have been fired if I hadn't become so efficient at doing my job... I'd spend hours dicking around because my brain was so tired of doing this I couldn't force myself to pay attention to it until the last minute. Fortunately I could bash out a program change at lighting speed by that point and management never paid attention so it didn't matter.

I got lucky and basically inherited a rental business around that time. Couldn't bail out fast enough. Right now I'm just getting back into IT, basically as an all purpose computer guy for small organizations that need someone but can't afford to hire a full time IT guy. Turns out I didn't hate computers, I just hated working for someone else doing the same exact thing every day. Working for yourself as you own boss is far more rewarding and far more pleasant than working for someone else will ever be, I will never go back. Could I have ever lived on this without my good fortune at the right time? IDK, probably not... at least not as well but I'm just getting rolling here so who knows. Health insurance is also god awfully expensive now if you have to buy it on your own... unless your income is really low and you qualify for subsidies.

I guess the final word is you're going to have to do something to support yourself and you're going to spend most of your waking hours doing it so figure out what you really want not what is safe and seems to pay well and pursue it. Oh and don't go into debt chasing a degree just to have the degree.
 
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