RV-7 down

pmanton

pmanton

Final Approach
PoA Supporter
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Indian Hills Airpark Salome, AZ
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N1431A
I just heard on Fox news that the Buckeye AZ airport manager and another chap lost their lives when their RV-7 went down. RIP
 
I just saw this on another board. This hits hard.

John was a wonderful guy. I was just chatting with him at length two weeks ago at the self-serve pump at KBXK. I often refuel there, and whenever he was there when I taxied in he'd come out with a friendly greeting and carry the fuel hose to me while I stood on the ladder.

It was clear he loved his job with the City of Buckeye and was excited about the airport, and about flying. In that last conversation on June 15 we also spoke of his faith, and of his work with the youth ministry at his church. He made it clear that he identified with the Apostle Paul's comments on life and death as expressed in the Letter to the Philippians.

Though I've lost a friend and the local aviation community has lost an enthusiastic supporter, the last thing he would want is for us to grieve.

Prayers for his family.
 
Pilawt said:
It was clear he loved his job with the City of Buckeye and was excited about the airport, and about flying. In that last conversation on June 15 we also spoke of his faith, and of his work with the youth ministry at his church. He made it clear that he identified with the Apostle Paul's comments on life and death as expressed in the Letter to the Philippians.

Though I've lost a friend and the local aviation community has lost an enthusiastic supporter, the last thing he would want is for us to grieve.

Prayers for his family.
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Sorry for your loss my friend, my condolences and thoughts go out to you and his family. I've always liked a saying I saw on a church sign a few years back. "Death is not a period, just a comma."

Always stuck out to me. :(
 
John McMahon helped me many times at BXK. He always seemed willing to do whatever it took to help with my aviation adventure. I read about this on the ASIAS yesterday and dug around a little unsuccessfully because I felt it might be somebody I knew. I will miss John a lot and BXK will not be the same without him.
 
From the reports of the time and place of the accident, it appears that I was flying just a few miles to the east of it not long before it happened. It was hot, 90F at 2,500' MSL, with light thermal turbulence, but otherwise perfect VFR.
 
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Very sad...very interested to hear what happened
 
Wow.
This is the type of freaky accident BRS parachutes were invented for ...
 
I’m confused. Report says RV-4. Title RV-7.

Did I see that both pilot and co-pilot had alcohol in their system?? I see feathers in the cockpit, were either pilot or co-pilot impacted by birds?
 
Blatham489 said:
I’m confused. Report says RV-4. Title RV-7.

Did I see that both pilot and co-pilot had alcohol in their system?? I see feathers in the cockpit, were either pilot or co-pilot impacted by birds?
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Someone who knows more about human decay than me can confirm, but that sounds to me like alcohol that was probably found from the remains starting to decompose. Or else they'd had some leftover from the night before.

The RV-4 comment in the report was probably a typo since they listed the aircraft type as an RV-7 for the manufacturer.

Sad. I always worry about hitting birds.
 
Blatham489 said:
I’m confused. Report says RV-4. Title RV-7.

Did I see that both pilot and co-pilot had alcohol in their system?? I see feathers in the cockpit, were either pilot or co-pilot impacted by birds?
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The report has a few typos and is hard to decipher in spots. But since the canopy and vertical tail were found a mile away from the rest of the wreckage I'm surmising that the birdstrikes separated those from the aircraft in flight.
 
Blatham489 said:
I’m confused. Report says RV-4. Title RV-7.

Did I see that both pilot and co-pilot had alcohol in their system?? I see feathers in the cockpit, were either pilot or co-pilot impacted by birds?
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The report specifically said “in muscle”. Sadly I presume as a result of impact. But not entirely sure. I love flying, but ughhh ... the randomness of pigeons.
 
Yes, 5500’ AGL or so does seem kinda high for birds, pigeons. Most hang out below 500’, never know.
 
sourdough44 said:
Yes, 5500’ AGL or so does seem kinda high for birds, pigeons. Most hang out below 500’, never know.
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I pulled my Foreflight track log for that day. It was a hot day. Six minutes before this accident happened I had taken off from GYR. I was flying 20 miles east of the accident location at 2,500 MSL, where OAT was 90 deg. F.

According to the report, at 8:15 AM (half an hour before the accident) the METAR at KBXK was 33C/91.4F. It warms up fast that time of day, which is why I was out early. The high temp that day at Buckeye was 109F.

In those conditions do birds tend to fly higher seeking cooler temperatures, like we do?
 
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We all love flying, but we also need to realize that, just like driving, each time we get in we could meet our demise. It's a reality that all of us try to ignore to some extent but incidents like this show that sometimes, it's just your time.
 
I'm missing the inference, does the report suggest the birds hit the occupants and knocked them out, or that birds struck the RV in such a way that it broke up in flight? Or is it that the birds took out the powerplant or controls and they didn't survive the forced landing? I recognize it may be a distinction without difference to the deceased, just trying to understand what the report is actually pointing at.
 
hindsight2020 said:
I'm missing the inference, does the report suggest the birds hit the occupants and knocked them out, or that birds struck the RV in such a way that it broke up in flight? Or is it that the birds took out the powerplant or controls and they didn't survive the forced landing? I recognize it may be a distinction without difference to the deceased, just trying to understand what the report is actually pointing at.
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Yes, I was confused too. I was looking for a paragraph on the actual cause of the accident but I guess this is just the "Factual Report"
 
hindsight2020 said:
I'm missing the inference, does the report suggest the birds hit the occupants and knocked them out, or that birds struck the RV in such a way that it broke up in flight? Or is it that the birds took out the powerplant or controls and they didn't survive the forced landing? I recognize it may be a distinction without difference to the deceased, just trying to understand what the report is actually pointing at.
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You will note that this is a "Factual" report from the NTSB, not a Probable Cause. They didn't infer probable cause because there isn't enough evidence either way. They simply stated the facts. There is no way to know if the birds caused the structural damage, or if the birds incapacitated the pilots which led to the airplane being overstressed in flight.
 
hindsight2020 said:
I'm missing the inference, does the report suggest the birds hit the occupants and knocked them out, or that birds struck the RV in such a way that it broke up in flight? Or is it that the birds took out the powerplant or controls and they didn't survive the forced landing? I recognize it may be a distinction without difference to the deceased, just trying to understand what the report is actually pointing at.
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The vertical stabilizer, rudder and canopy were found a mile away. I doubt an RV7 is going to want to stay in the air nor be very controllable without a VS, rudder or canopy.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Someone who knows more about human decay than me can confirm, but that sounds to me like alcohol that was probably found from the remains starting to decompose. Or else they'd had some leftover from the night before.
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This is one part of NTSB reports that really bugs me. They sometimes do not publish concentrations, and the county autopsy examiner has likely already made a determination if the presence of ethanol and the other things was due to consumption, or not. I get that the point of a factual report is to just get raw information out there and make no conclusions, but they either need to provide more information here (concentrations) or less information.
 
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dell30rb said:
I get that the point of a factual report is to just get raw information out there and make no conclusions, but they either need to provide more information here (concentrations) or less information.
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Tox reports for both occupants (including concentrations) are in the accident docket along with a lot of other detailed information. The factual is a summary, not all the data collected.

Nauga,
in the abstract
 
nauga said:
Tox reports for both occupants (including concentrations) are in the accident docket along with a lot of other detailed information. The factual is a summary, not all the data collected.

Nauga,
in the abstract
Click to expand...

Learn something new every day!
 
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