Request advice on what to do next...

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Voorhees

Filing Flight Plan
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Voorhees
First off, thank you for making this forum available to people like me. I have found so much information useful already. I am 42 years old and brand new to aviation.

I recently retired after just under 23 amazing years in the military. Towards the end, as work slowed down (not by choice) and my kids got older, I started suffering from memory loss, severe pain, anxiety, and suicidal ideations.

I held an executive-level position in a sensitive military field, I was ashamed to get help so this went on for a while. Actually, a long while before it got so bad I eventually started to burn my leave, work even later to make up for my increasing confusion and lost time before finally getting help. I knew in my head I was no longer able to maintain my standard and it was getting worse.

Bottom line: I am on an unapproved antidepressant (Cymbalta). I have been on this since 02/2018. With positive results.

In October 2017, I was diagnosed with MDD severe, complex childhood PTSD, combat-related PTSD, and a pretty substantial volume of injuries I had not worried about in my career due to OPTEMPO; torn ligaments, broken bones, etc. I was pulled out of work and enrolled in the wounded warrior program and placed in an intensive outpatient program. This was extremely difficult for me as work helped me cope.

While in intensive outpatient, I attempted suicide the week of my 40th birthday. It was the same week I had to give a combat scenario timeline. Celebrating my BD I got drunk and had stopped taking my medication a week or so before... My wife found me in the garage at 0100 or 0200. This is documented. Lesson learned.

I have been saving for months to start pilot training. I had asked the question about my mental health many times but heard what I wanted.

Requesting advice, help, direction on how to obtain a medical certification to fly six or fewer people. My wife and I bought a house on a lake in Washington. We live here with our three teenagers. My wife works out here for the Army Corps of Engineers.

I have a lucrative skillset that I can no longer use and flying is something I have dreamed of my entire life. I could possibly be a flight instructor, or give tours; who knows! The possibilities are endless!

When I got to the point of actually needing to get my medical exam complete I found out I am not qualified due to the medications I am taking and possibly other things too.

For me, it's about the freedom to travel. See the world from a different perspective and ultimately give me purpose.

If any of you have been in a similar situation or advice on what I need to do, I would love to hear it. If this isn't possible for me, I rather know sooner than later. Based on what I have read, I am afraid to talk with anybody official.

Thank you all for your time.
 
First of all, I hope you are continuing to see a physician to ameliorate your serious mental health issues.

Your ability to obtain a private pilot certificate may not be possible. If it is, the process will be difficult. There are a couple of supremely competent Aviation Medical Examiners active on this website. They can assist your efforts. Contact one or both to find out how they can help you.

Dr Bruce- http://www.aeromedicaldoc.com/

Dr Lou- lbfjrmd@gmail.com

Best wishes to you.
 
Voorhees said:
When I got to the point of actually needing to get my medical exam complete I found out I am not qualified due to the medications I am taking and possibly other things too.
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No, its the 'other things' and possibly the medication. Dr B or Dr Lou will be along shortly to lend a hand
 
yes, you have many obstacles to tackle. the suicide attempt may not be one that can be overcome though. I do not think obtaining a FAA medical certificate is in the cards for you. Good luck.
 
Voorhees said:
That is heartbreaking. Thank you for your reply.
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I spent many nights loosing sleep after my denial. I’m still trying to find a new avenue in aviation. Life goes on, I’m sure myself and a few others here are permanently grounded. Reach out to me if you need anyone to talk to.
 
Getting a medical will probably be extremely difficult due to some of your history, but I think there’s still a chance you could get a medical. I know of an airline pilot who unsuccessfully attempted suicide with a firearm and eventually got his first class medical back. It’s going to cost a lot of $$$$ though.
 
Reading your story reminds me of my oldest brother. He committed suicide at 42. He had your symptoms, took depression meds and underwent shock therapy. Unfortunately nothing worked.

Personally I think you really just need to concentrate on getting healthy and not worrying about a hobby. And that’s what it is. An expensive hobby that consumes far too much of my paycheck. While it’s fun, it’s not true joy and it’s definitely not about purpose in life. Purpose should be about family or giving of oneself. Find your purpose in life first, plenty of time for hobbies later. Good luck.
 
Thank you for your service. There are other types of aviation that don't require a medical. Balloon, glider and ultralight come to mind. But get healthy first, your family needs you, please take care of yourself, you have a lot of life to live.
 
Voorhees said:
When I got to the point of actually needing to get my medical exam complete I found out I am not qualified due to the medications I am taking and possibly other things too.
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If by this you mean you've already applied for and failed an aviation medical exam, your options are extremely limited (balloons, gliders, or ultralights). If you haven't actually failed a medical exam, you can pursue a Sport Pilot certificate, which limits you to relatively low performance (but fun!) aircraft with no more than two seats. But with the medical history you describe, I suspect it will be extremely difficult and expensive, or impossible, to get a medical certificate.
 
Thank you all for taking the time to post.

Also, I wanted to note, I have not drunk alcohol since that night (two years ago) and I am working very hard to get better. Therapy, medication, etc. This was all very new to me at the time. I was never a big drinker anyway.

In order to get better, I can't be as limited as I am. If you have the issues I do, you know I am talking about. I am a prisoner in my own home.

I went back home to Whitefish for a visit. Huge eye-opener for me. Flying is definitely something I want to do and I always have. I will continue to work at getting better and hope the rules improve.

Thank you all again, this is definitely a community I want to be a part of if accepted.

I tell my kids all the time if you want something bad enough. You have to work for it.

I will look into the light sport as well if there is zero chance of me being able to fulfill this dream.
 
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Velocity173 said:
Reading your story reminds me of my oldest brother. He committed suicide at 42. He had your symptoms, took depression meds and underwent shock therapy. Unfortunately, nothing worked.

Personally I think you really just need to concentrate on getting healthy and not worrying about a hobby. And that’s what it is. An expensive hobby that consumes far too much of my paycheck. While it’s fun, it’s not true joy and it’s definitely not about purpose in life. The purpose should be about family or giving of oneself. Find your purpose in life first, plenty of time for hobbies later. Good luck.
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I am so sorry to hear about your older brother and thank you for taking the time to reply.

For me, it's more than a hobby. It will give me additional freedom. In May, I boarded a plane to San Diego with my wife. I was not at all comfortable, to say it mildly. My wife flew off to Italy for two weeks with her sister and I was stuck in San Diego. I ended up driving 21 hours straight back to Washington. I didn't want to deal with the people at the airport. I would have much rather flown myself home.

My number one focus has always been my family. My wife works full time and my kids are 18, 16, and 14. I could go back to school; for what though. I could spend 200k on a doctorate and not make half of what I could doing what I did in the military. I just don't see the point. I don't want to turn this into a cry fest. Lots of people have obstacles they have to overcome. My medical one is a big one and so is this medical certification.
 
Anon said:
Getting a medical will probably be extremely difficult due to some of your history, but I think there’s still a chance you could get a medical. I know of an airline pilot who unsuccessfully attempted suicide with a firearm and eventually got his first class medical back. It’s going to cost a lot of $$$$ though.
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that was 'back in the day'! ( < #germanwings )
 
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To be honest, even if you (the OP) qualified for a third class medical (I hate to say it, but it doesn't sound like you do) light aircraft really and truly do suck for travel. I use mine for it now and again and boy do I like it, but more often I don't because of scheduling pressures and the crap weather that always seems to accompany my desire to go anywhere. For every story of a great trip I think just about every pilot has two of getting stuck somewhere waiting for weather to get better. I spent most of my cockpit hours droning away within 50 miles of home, and I doubt I'm alone in that.

Light sport is a good way to go, and there's talk of them including more of the legacy fleet in the available aircraft. Depending on where you live that could suffice for the vast majority of flying you plan to do. Light Sport aircraft aren't terribly fast, but they fly.

A couple other things. Like someone else said, health first and always. Flying will wait. More importantly, you aren't your skill set. You aren't the job. Just because your professional skill set no longer has value doesn't mean you don't. And of course, thank you for your service to our great land. I hope you can get yourself straight and have an enjoyable retirement.
 
steingar said:
To be honest, even if you (the OP) qualified for a third class medical (I hate to say it, but it doesn't sound like you do) light aircraft really and truly do suck for travel. I use mine for it now and again and boy do I like it, but more often I don't because of scheduling pressures and the crap weather that always seems to accompany my desire to go anywhere. For every story of a great trip I think just about every pilot has two of getting stuck somewhere waiting for weather to get better. I spent most of my cockpit hours droning away within 50 miles of home, and I doubt I'm alone in that.

Light sport is a good way to go, and there's talk of them including more of the legacy fleet in the available aircraft. Depending on where you live that could suffice for the vast majority of flying you plan to do. Light Sport aircraft aren't terribly fast, but they fly.

A couple other things. Like someone else said, health first and always. Flying will wait. More importantly, you aren't your skill set. You aren't the job. Just because your professional skill set no longer has value doesn't mean you don't. And of course, thank you for your service to our great land. I hope you can get yourself straight and have an enjoyable retirement.
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nicely said!
 
steingar said:
To be honest, even if you (the OP) qualified for a third class medical (I hate to say it, but it doesn't sound like you do) light aircraft really and truly do suck for travel. I use mine for it now and again and boy do I like it, but more often I don't because of scheduling pressures and the crap weather that always seems to accompany my desire to go anywhere. For every story of a great trip I think just about every pilot has two of getting stuck somewhere waiting for weather to get better. I spent most of my cockpit hours droning away within 50 miles of home, and I doubt I'm alone in that.

Light sport is a good way to go, and there's talk of them including more of the legacy fleet in the available aircraft. Depending on where you live that could suffice for the vast majority of flying you plan to do. Light Sport aircraft aren't terribly fast, but they fly.

A couple other things. Like someone else said, health first and always. Flying will wait. More importantly, you aren't your skill set. You aren't the job. Just because your professional skill set no longer has value doesn't mean you don't. And of course, thank you for your service to our great land. I hope you can get yourself straight and have an enjoyable retirement.
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Thank you all. This is great information and I do appreciate the advice and candor.
 
benw571 said:
I spent many nights loosing sleep after my denial. I’m still trying to find a new avenue in aviation. Life goes on, I’m sure myself and a few others here are permanently grounded. Reach out to me if you need anyone to talk to.
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Thank you!
 
Put some clean years behind u, document your new healthy lifestyle. Be active in your community, volunteer for different charitable , join a good church. Get mentally and physically healthy. Write down a plan, never say never...

Consider taking a few flying lessons as you don't need a medical until u solo. If you like it, try getting some type of work at your local airport. Check on becoming an AP mechanic, make some good clean history.

Once u have a few more years of clean history, make contact with Dr. B when u turn 45 and try again.

Then again at 50 and so on.

Buddy, at 42 you haven't even gotten to the fun part of life yet!
 
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Voorhees said:
Thank you all. This is great information and I do appreciate the advice and candor.
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I have nothing to add aviation-wise that somebody else can't say, but I have a tremendous amount of sympathy for you and I wish you the very best in your journey to good health.
 
steingar said:
To be honest, even if you (the OP) qualified for a third class medical (I hate to say it, but it doesn't sound like you do) light aircraft really and truly do suck for travel. I use mine for it now and again and boy do I like it, but more often I don't because of scheduling pressures and the crap weather that always seems to accompany my desire to go anywhere. For every story of a great trip I think just about every pilot has two of getting stuck somewhere waiting for weather to get better. I spent most of my cockpit hours droning away within 50 miles of home, and I doubt I'm alone in that.

Light sport is a good way to go, and there's talk of them including more of the legacy fleet in the available aircraft. Depending on where you live that could suffice for the vast majority of flying you plan to do. Light Sport aircraft aren't terribly fast, but they fly.

A couple other things. Like someone else said, health first and always. Flying will wait. More importantly, you aren't your skill set. You aren't the job. Just because your professional skill set no longer has value doesn't mean you don't. And of course, thank you for your service to our great land. I hope you can get yourself straight and have an enjoyable retirement.
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Most GA planes suck for travel precisely for the same reason - weather. It is not like a 182 will be more comfortable or that much more capable than most of LSAs. Now if you move up to something like a Cirrus or better but even then , if you want to travel , go commercial - to GA is for fun flying and for that LSAs are just about perfect fun planes.
 
Err..if u got the means u can fly a 747 with a 3rd class medical.
 
Warmi said:
Most GA planes suck for travel precisely for the same reason - weather. It is not like a 182 will be more comfortable or that much more capable than most of LSAs. Now if you move up to something like a Cirrus or better but even then, if you want to travel, go commercial - to GA is for fun flying and for that LSAs are just about perfect fun planes.
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:yeahthat:. I made the trip home from Cottonwood, AZ to Santa Rosa, CA (via Lancaster, CA for fuel) in my Zodiac LSA after Jack's photo shoot. I covered 621 nm in 6 1/2 flying hours bucking a 5-10 knot headwind in the Zodiac while sipping 100LL at 5.5 gph.

Even for cross-country travel, LSAs beat the heck out of driving.

One of Jack's photos over Sedona.
3989cr1k_zpschmygwrn.jpg
 
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I would just second the idea of maybe starting in gliders if you are well enough to self certify that you are healthy enough to safely fly them.

They are an excellent way to learn how a set of wings and controls fly in the air. You can do an add-on for power later, medical conditions permitting.

And who knows, you might really come to enjoy soaring

 
PiperW said:
Put some clean years behind u, document your new healthy lifestyle. Be active in your community, volunteer for different charitable, join a good church. Get mentally and physically healthy. Write down a plan, never say never...

Consider taking a few flying lessons as you don't need a medical until u solo. If you like it, try getting some type of work at your local airport. Check on becoming an AP mechanic, make some good clean history.

Once u have a few more years of clean history, make contact with Dr. B when u turn 45 and try again.

Then again at 50 and so on.

Buddy, at 42 you haven't even gotten to the fun part of life yet!
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I chuckled, ty! My friends that are retiring don't appear to be lasting long. We all joke, we hope to make it five years after retiring. Two of us didn't make it that long. One had a heart attack and the other was unknown. So, sometimes I feel like I maybe don't have as much time as I do. Even though my body is broken down, I have always tried to eat healthily and stay fit.

I read your post with my wife. I appreciate you and everybody that has taken the time to respond.
 
Stan Cooper said:
:yeahthat:. I made the trip home from Cottonwood, AZ to Santa Rosa, CA (via Lancaster, CA for fuel) in my Zodiac LSA after Jack's photo shoot. I covered 621 nm in 6 1/2 flying hours bucking a 5-10 knot headwind in the Zodiac while sipping 100LL at 5.5 gph.

Even for cross-country travel, LSAs beat the heck out of driving.

One of Jack's photos over Sedona.
N601KE%20Over%20Sedona%20Airport%20at%20Sunset_zpsp6maep9h.jpg
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I have a huge smile from ear to ear. Thank you for sharing.
 
PeterNSteinmetz said:
I would just second the idea of maybe starting in gliders if you are well enough to self certify that you are healthy enough to safely fly them.

They are an excellent way to learn how a set of wings and controls fly in the air. You can do an add-on for power later, medical conditions permitting.

And who knows, you might really come to enjoy soaring

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You stole my heart with Pink Floyd! My favorite band. Thank you for sharing this incredible video!
 
There is the option of talking your wife into getting her private pilot certificate, you get your sport pilot certificate, and then let your wife act as PIC while you do the hand flying if you want something bigger/faster than a light sport aircraft. Pricier than just you getting a certificate of course, and maybe your wife wouldn't want to, but it would probably be cheaper than jumping through all the FAA hoops with your history.
 
EdFred said:
There is the option of talking your wife into getting her private pilot certificate, you get your sport pilot certificate, and then let your wife act as PIC while you do the hand flying if you want something bigger/faster than a light sport aircraft. Pricier than just you getting a certificate of course, and maybe your wife wouldn't want to, but it would probably be cheaper than jumping through all the FAA hoops with your history.
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Very clever solution. Bravo, EdFred!
 
PeterNSteinmetz said:
@Voorhees Where are you located?
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We are located just outside Spokane Washington.

BT

I have not attempted a medical certification of any kind and do not intend to at this time based on everyone's advice on my situation.

There is zero chance my wife will get her PPL EdFred but I love your thinking outside the box. Thank you all for the amazing advice. I eventually want to try and earn my PPL but not until I have proven I can safely have one. My wife loves all the advice here and I have to show her I am okay to do this as well. We have been together since we were 18. She knows me better than anybody.

Thank you for making me feel good about coming on here and asking the question.
 
Voorhees said:
We are located just outside Spokane Washington.

BT

I have not attempted a medical certification of any kind and do not intend to at this time based on everyone's advice on my situation.
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Voorhees, that means a Sport Pilot license is still available to you and is a pretty decent alternative. While it's legal, whether or not it's wise for you is something to be decided by you, your wife, and your doctors.

If you decide it's safe for you to take up Sport Pilot training, you will learn about 90% of what you'll eventually need for a private pilot license and all the training will apply if you later decide to get a medical and pursue the private ticket. Meanwhile, the Sport certificate will let you fly daytime VFR anywhere in the US and the Bahamas, and let you take a passenger along. The planes are limited in the amount of load they can carry, and if you and your wife decide to travel together you'll have to pack light (similar to a motorcycle trip), but the speed and climb rate are similar to those of other popular light planes like a Cessna 172 or a Piper PA28.

Remember, though - health first. Don't try flying until your doctor assures you that your health is adequate, regardless of legalities.
 
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Half Fast said:
Remember, though - health first. Don't try flying until your doctor assures you that your health is adequate, regardless of legalities.
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Copy all. Thank you for taking the time to reply. This appears to be exactly what I am looking for; when I am ready I am going to follow up with my doctor's; physical and mental. I want to get on approved meds (to possibly help me for PPL in the future) first for a period of time before doing anything.
 
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Half Fast said:
By the way, if you haven't already, make friends with a pilot and get up in a small plane a few times and make sure you'll like it. It's not for everyone.
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Thank you. Yes, I have been up in all kinds of aircraft. I love, love, love the feeling. I actually have a reoccurring dream I have had since I was a kid. I hold my breath and somehow I can fly. I know, I know it's weird. But in my dream, it actually feels like I am actually flying.
 
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Voorhees said:
Thank you. Yes, I have been up in all kinds of aircraft. I love, love, love the feeling. I actually have a reoccurring dream I have had since I was a kid. I hold my breath and somehow I can fly. I know, I know it's weird. But in my dream, it actually feels like I am actually flying.
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Not a bad alternative. Sleeping won’t cost NEARLY as much as a pilot’s license! :D
 
Voorhees said:
Thank you. Yes, I have been up in all kinds of aircraft. I love, love, love the feeling. I actually have a reoccurring dream I have had since I was a kid. I hold my breath and somehow I can fly. I know, I know it's weird. But in my dream, it actually feels like I am actually flying.
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That is an extremely common childhood dream. I've had it, perhaps 30-40% of my friends have, as well.
 
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