Question about being denied Class III

RBBailey said:
Can you explain what the purpose is for me to get my own medical records from the FAA? How will I want to use this information?

Just so you know, the last medical certificate I had was a Class I, which probably expired in about 2001. I've not applied for any other certificate till I went for the Class III two years ago.
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Bruce told you to get them. Presumably, he wants to see what they are basing their decision on compared to what you submitted.
 
RBBailey said:
Can you explain what the purpose is for me to get my own medical records from the FAA? How will I want to use this information?

Just so you know, the last medical certificate I had was a Class I, which probably expired in about 2001. I've not applied for any other certificate till I went for the Class III two years ago.
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This may not be relevant to your situation, but in my case, I got them because I didn't keep a copy of my first few medical applications, and I didn't want to inadvertently fail to report something that I had previously reported. (A person accumulates a LOT of medical history in 70 years!)
 
flyingron said:
Requesting Medical Records
To protect your identity and the release of the correct records, you are required to submit a completed Medical Records Request Form (PDF) authorizing the release of your medical records.
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Check the "certified" box when you request them. The additional cost is negligible and you'll receive a notarized copy that would be used for legal purposes. The FAA refers to it as the "blue ribbon" copy. It's cheap insurance to get the most complete copy you can get your hands on.
 
RBBailey said:
Can you explain what the purpose is for me to get my own medical records from the FAA? How will I want to use this information?
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1. Dr. Chien said to do it.
2. There's potentially more in your medical file than just the documents and applications you have submitted. You need to know what the FAA is looking at when they're evaluating you so you can be proactive and respond appropriately.
 
Can you request your records from them while they are in the process of being reviewed?
 
SoCal 182 Driver said:
Yes...do a consult. Can you just go Basic Med?
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I was able to readily open a dialog with my AME without having the cost or expense of a consult. We conversed though email and text until I had everything needed for my visit. The only thing missing was a 24-hour Holter monitor which my PCP ordered. After the (normal) results came back, I scheduled a visit with the AME and walked out of there with a Third-Class medical certificate. And yes, Basic Med is in my future. As an official geezer, I can appreciate having to complete a CMEC every four years and not have to deal with the full-blown aviation medical.
 
Principal said:
Can you request your records from them while they are in the process of being reviewed?
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The short answer is yes.

The process of applying for a medical and reviewing your medical records officially constitutes an "investigation". You will be provided with a written summary of your rights under the Pilot's Bill of Rights (Public Law 1 12-153) in communications from the FAA. Not only can you, but you are entitled to "A copy of the releasable portions of your airman medical file...upon your written request." which is protected by law.

Here's the written disclosure:

"
PILOT'S BILL OF RIGHTS NOTIFICATION TO DEFERRED APPLICANT

The information you submit on the FAA Form 8500-8 Application for an Airman Medical Certificate and any additional information you provide in connection with your application will be used by the Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration as part of the basis for issuing an airman medical certificate to you under Title 49, United States Code (USC) section 44703(a), if the Administrator finds, after investigation, that you are qualified for, and physically able to perform the duties related to the certificate for which you are applying. Therefore, in accordance with the Pilot's Bill of Rights, Public Law 1 12-153, the Administrator is providing you with the applicable written notifications related to this investigation of your qualifications for an airman medical certificate:

The nature of the Administrator's investigation, which is precipitated by your submission of an application for airman medical certification, is to determine whether you meet the medical standards for airman medical certification under Title 14, Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) pan 67.

Any response to an inquiry by a representative of the Administrator by you in connection with this investigation of your qualifications for an airman medical certificate may be used as evidence against you.

A copy of the releasable portions of your airman medical file is available to you upon your written request addressed to:

Federal Aviation Administration
Aerospace Medical Certification Division
Medical Records Department, AAM-331
P.O. Box 25082
Oklahoma City, OK 73125-9867
"

Note the use of the term releasable. Sensitive information (like psychiactrict records and evaluations) may not be considered releasable to the airman.
 
ThatOtherGuy said:
Note the use of the term releasable. Sensitive information (like psychiactrict records and evaluations) may not be considered releasable to the airman.
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Is the FAA required to identify what documents are being withheld, so the airman can seek them from another source (e.g., the treating professional)?
 
SoCal 182 Driver said:
Is the FAA required to identify what documents are being withheld, so the airman can seek them from another source (e.g., the treating professional)?
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Better question for some of the Sr. AMEs that are more familiar.

I will say that it's not uncommon in mental health to withhold psychiatric records from the patient.

The issue I can think of with the FAA is that psychiatric and neuropsychological evaluations are forensic examinations. The airman pays, but the FAA is really the customer and owns the result. It's similar to candidates for job applications not being entitled to the results of pre-employment drug testing.
 
I could see that with psych stuff. I'm kind of baffled by why my case seems so difficult. It may simply be that I did it wrong, or have forgotten how to deal with the FAA. (...did I tell you about the time I failed my first commercial check ride when the examiner brought his girlfriend along for the flight, and she back-seat piloted the whole time? and how I asked to be rescheduled because it was 2500 foot ceilings and snowing, I had just flown 1 hour IMC to get there, and had to get the plane back home by dark, but they insisted... It was surreal.)

I suppose they could be seeing something in my tests that myself and my own doctors don't see? But if that's the case, and if it is cardiac related, don't they also have some kind of moral obligation to tell me that there could be a life-threatening issue that I'm not aware of?
 
Dry Creek said:
I was able to readily open a dialog with my AME without having the cost or expense of a consult. We conversed though email and text until I had everything needed for my visit. The only thing missing was a 24-hour Holter monitor which my PCP ordered. After the (normal) results came back, I scheduled a visit with the AME and walked out of there with a Third-Class medical certificate. And yes, Basic Med is in my future. As an official geezer, I can appreciate having to complete a CMEC every four years and not have to deal with the full-blown aviation medical.
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I get all that is needed for the CMEC annually. My doctor has no problem tacking it on to my regular physical. Don't forget you have to take the online training course every two years. It was a challenge to me to see how fast I could find the Mayo Clinic easter eggs so I could advance to the next unit.
 
flyingron said:
I get all that is needed for the CMEC annually. My doctor has no problem tacking it on to my regular physical. Don't forget you have to take the online training course every two years. It was a challenge to me to see how fast I could find the Mayo Clinic easter eggs so I could advance to the next unit.
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I don't expect any issues from my PCP either. He was doing my company mandated annual Fire Brigade physicals for about 22 years. I decided it was easier to have him as my PCP too about 5 years into the job. He also does NRC licensed operator exams for my employer, so he's no stranger to paperwork and strange questions. Anus? Yep, he's got one.
 
Well, it's been over a month, and I've not heard anything. I've called five or six times with no luck in getting through, and a search of my info on the FAA site shows "No medical information", that is, no certificate.

....sigh.....

The thing is, I did what they asked for, so are they going to add more requests every time I try for it?
 
Hello all, I just wanted to say thanks for the advice. You all scared me. But you all helped.

I'm happy to report that at the end of June, I suddenly received my Class III from Oklahoma City! At that point I jumped back into reeducating my self on being a GA pilot, sim work, etc... I took two flights with a local CFI, and he signed me off for my private privileges. But more than that, he turned out to be the exact type I was looking for -- he almost immediately hooked me up with several people he knows, and I am already flying a privately owned PA-28-160. Dream. Come. True. It's amazing to be back in the air after 22 years. In some ways, it's like riding a bike, a lot came back quickly. I'm working on making sure I'm well practiced in safety procedures, and although I'm really pretty happy with my landings, I'm hoping to get them to Commercial standards by October.

As far as the medical is concerned, this last spring I said to my wife, I'm going to give it one more try. And although I think it may not have been needed, I thought that maybe it would help this time -- I went to another AME to get another physical exam done in the month before my two years would have been up for my previous BFR (I had done a BFR, then realized that I couldn't fly till I had a medical...). I went to the office and told the doctor right up front that I would not want to go through with this physical exam unless he agreed to advocate for me to Oklahoma City. He was all for it, wrote a letter for me, and sent the paperwork off. This was in February, and I never heard a thing from the FAA. So, I took a chance, and called up my HMO (Kaiser Perm.) with the hope that maybe, just maybe they could do SOMETHING to advocate to me. That first call, I actually talked to a cardiologist, and I was in the office within a week! $20 copay, EKG, full cardio exam, stress test, the works; plus a second cardiologist reviewed my case, and by the end of the day I had a letter from two cardiologists telling the FAA that there was nothing wrong with me.

Every week, I checked my certificate status on the FAA web site.... till late June, I was waiting in the parking lot for my wife to finish shopping, I got bored, took one last look, and there it was: Medical Status: Class III.

So thanks for the help, support, and information. I'm still just insanely excited to be back in the cockpit!
 
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