Private Pilot flight school recommendations in Dever area?

Andy Ericksen

Andy Ericksen

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Andy Ericksen
I'm just getting started on my journey to become a private pilot and I'm looking for recommendations or comments on flight schools in the Denver area. I'm South and a little East of Denver so KAPA is closest to me. I've heard that KAPA is fairly busy, should this factor into my choice of school?

I also considered going with an independent CFI, but I don't own or have access to a plane and from what I understand no flying club will allow an independent CFI to train using 'their' aircraft. Am I off base there? Should I be able to use an independent CFI in a rental aircraft? Would an independent CFI be better than a school?

I feel like I'm at a point of not knowing what I don't know. What questions should I be asking the schools and CFI that I talk to?

What about insurance? What questions should I be asking? What should I be looking for?

Really any tips or pointers would be helpful.

Thanks a bunch!
 
Wonder if @denverpilot will chime in. Haven’t heard from Nate in a while, but he was tuned in pretty good.

Centennial Airport, east of 25 on Arapahoe was student pilot mecca when I lived in COS.

There’s other DEN area folks here.
 
I learned to fly ten years ago on the north side of Denver - primarily Rocky Mountain Metro Airport in Broomfield (KBJC, towered) and also KLMO Longmont untowered, KBJC Boulder untowered, and have flown a little in/out of KEIK Erie untowered.
My perception is KAPA Centennial is super-busy with lots of biz jets. It's the second busiest airport in Colorado.
However it's a whole lot closer to you.
What about Meadowlake KFLY just northeast of Colorado Springs?
 
G-Man said:
What about Meadowlake KFLY just northeast of Colorado Springs?
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Thanks for replying G-Man.

From home, Meadowlake KFLY is about 55 minutes in good traffic, vs 25 minutes to KAPA. Work is about 20 minutes closer to KAPA and farther from KFLY. It's doable though if there's a good reason. Is there a really good flight school at KFLY that you recommend?

KBJC is approx 90 minutes each way and that, to my mind, is too much extra time, stress, and fuel in the commute to do it regularly (2 or 3 times per week) unless there's a REALLY compelling reason to go that far.
 
Might be of no help but how far are you from KCFO? Not familiar with your area myself, but a few years ago a work colleague was getting his private from a school based there. He seemed pleased with his progress and the school.
 
Hi Andy,
I don't know if there are flight schools at KFLY - I just think it's a more mellow airport than KAPA or KCOS (Colorado Springs).
No, I wouldn't say it's worth it to fly from KBJC.
From what I hear, there are a few fine flight schools at KAPA, both Part 141 and Part 61. Sorry I don't have recommendations, but there are some great discussions here on how to choose a flight school and instructor. Short version - spend the time talking with them and find a place and CFI that resonate with you.
Good luck and have fun!
 
KCFO (Spaceport) the Airport Formerly Known as Front Range. Not only is KAPA the 2nd busiest airport in Colorado, it's one of the 5 busiest non-Class B airports in the country (Van Nuys is always #1) I live just north of KAPA, takes me 20 to 90 min to get to KAPA depending on traffic. Never takes more than 30 min to get to CFO. 2 Flight schools, good rentals, tower. Best part? No waiting for 20 min burning Hobbs time (and $$$) while the jets are landing & taking off.

Lots of the spam can KAPA traffic comes up to CFO to practice instrument approaches or T&Gs but that's still 95% less traffic than KAPA. Monitor traffic on FlightAware for a few days. Busiest CFO ever gets is one Saturday a month when there's a Young Eagle rally. Wow! Maybe 7-9 airplanes all total. How will we ever survive?!?

https://flightaware.com/

Step #1 is to visit the flight schools at both KAPA and KCFO. Candidly, the school is irrelevant, you want a CFI you connect with. You're going to be spending lots of time in close quarters with that person.

Most of the material is free on the FAA website:

https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation

Specifically:
Aeronautical Information Manual (the AIM)
*Airplane Flying Handbook (FAA-H-8083-3C)
*Pilot’s Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge (FAA-H-8083-25B) (PHAK)

You'll want a copy of 14 CFR (aka "the FARs"). Can't download all of them but you can buy a book - Chp 61 & 91 are the most important.
 
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tree9er said:
KCFO
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murphey said:
KCFO
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In good traffic KCFO is about 45 minutes from work, 55 minutes from home with tolls.

Serious question - Is the longer drive (plus tolls) worth it compared to waiting 20 minutes for clearance? Can that be calculated?

I suppose I can take discovery flights at each and get a feel for the vibe at each, is that a good idea or would I be wasting money?

I think one of the schools at KAPA (Aspen flying club) also has clubs/schools at both KCFO and KBJC. I wonder if that means I can take flight lessons at any of those locations with just one membership fee...I should probably ask them that question :) Does anyone here have experience with Aspen that you'd be willing to divulge?

Thanks for all the suggestions, this really feels like one of the most supportive communities I've ever seen.
 
Andy Ericksen said:
In good traffic KCFO is about 45 minutes from work, 55 minutes from home with tolls.

Serious question - Is the longer drive (plus tolls) worth it compared to waiting 20 minutes for clearance? Can that be calculated?
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Only you can be the judge of that. The more frequently you train, the more likely you will be to finish relatively quickly. If the drive limits you to training once a week, it’ll draw out the timeline AND you may build resentment thinking about the lost time on the drive.
 
TCABM said:
Only you can be the judge of that.
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That's fair, and a valid point, nobody can decide what's best for me better than me.

I guess a better question would be to ask if anyone has any thoughts about delays at KAPA, is it really 20 minutes every time, is it regularly more than 20 minutes, or less than 20... then it's time to do math... 20 minutes on the ground at ~200/hr is about $3.34 per minute times twenty minutes is roughly $67 OUCH! compare that to an extra 30-40 in gas for the car plus tolls to KCFO approx $6... KCFO might be a cheaper than KAPA by around $30 for a 1 hour flight so the question to myself: is it worth $30 to drive an extra hour?

so I guess I really need to know if the delays I've heard about at KAPA are real and regular.
 
I repeat….monitor Flightaware during mornings to,get a feel for traffic.

I learned at KAPA, return there frequently. But I’m based at KCFO for many reasons.
 
murphey said:
I repeat….monitor Flightaware during mornings to,get a feel for traffic.
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Yessir, I have it pulled up now. I also monitor the radios for KAPA on liveatc .net (or try to... they talk fast)
 
I really enjoyed flying at KAPA. There are a ton of flight schools and the rates seemed very reasonable. If I cannot get my multi training here (due to scheduling and availability) in Chicago I’ll fly to Denver to do the training.

KAPA has a ton of airplanes too. Convenience is key, you want something convenient so you’ll stick with it, so think somewhere you can drive regularly. Flight schools usually have tons of instructors, so you can try a few until you find one that you get on with and understand/communicate well. I would try to find an older more experienced instructor, no offense to fresh CFI’s but really it’s easy to become a CFI with very little real world experience. A more experienced CFI can teach you about icing, mountain waves, inadvertent IMC, etc. All things that do happen to those who fly a LOT. The young CFI’s have no experience in that and just say to avoid it. But truth is weather changes suddenly so you want to know how to handle those situations.

Ask the club you are at about insurance. If you are with their instructor, then my opinion is their insurance covers it as the CFI is the ultimate PIC. If the school is funky about that then reconsider if you want to fly there. Now if you are renting (non supervised solo), then insurance may be needed.

I would consider an independent CFI for endorsements, but for primary training that is difficult as maintenance does happen and an airplane can be down for extended period of time.

You can consider to buy your own airplane and get training in that, but you’d likely need to know someone who is comfortable with you to do that. Again you’ll have the maintenance issue so I would use it in addition to another rental aircraft. Having your own airplane is great for trips, but stay away from those mountains and any weather until you are very comfortable/experienced with that.
 
"no offense to fresh CFI’s"

Other than far too many of them are building time to GTFOOD and fly big iron.

Personal opinion about KAPA schools:

Independence - Cirrus almost exclusively. Do you really want to spend $200+/hr for either of the two Cessnas or over $300/hr for a Cirrus and then a sliding scale (sliding up, of course) for the CFI for at least 40 hrs, probably closer to 60? (60 is the national average for PPL) On the other hand, if you're going to buy a Cirrus, it's the best place. I know 2 of the CFIs (one of which is the owner)

Aspen - School has been there forever, at last count, it's on its 5th or 6th owner (I know current and the previous 2). Lots of airplanes and instructors. See comment at the beginning. Last I knew, no problem with an owner airplane, you're renting the CFI. Aspen's school at CFO and BJC is Western. I know none of the CFIs - which is telling. Turnover is very high.

Metro State University has an Aviation program, and many of the grads (and even before graduating) end up teaching at Aspen or Western for some period of time.

Centennial Flyers - Opened in 2004 and by then, I had moved up to KCFO. I know 3 of the CFIs and can recommend them (contact me off line).

Flights - will not work with student with their own aircraft, must use Flights' airplanes. I know none of the CFIs.

General comment:
Check out the website for each, call a few of the CFIs and chat about their teaching philosophy, their schedule and your's. You can get a lot of info before you show up at one of the schools.
 
One more action which should be your #1 Priority....The Dreaded Medical.

Download a copy of the FAA form 8500 and read it. Pay special attention to question (all parts) of #18. Please note it states "Have You Ever...."

https://www.aviationmedicine.com/wp...PPLICATION-FOR-AIRMAN-MEDICAL-CERTIFICATE.pdf

The actual process is an online form. But if you have any questions/qualms about #18, the best advice is to make an appt with an AME for a CONSULTATION (I can recommend one near KAPA who is excellent - Dr John Harris). At that time they will tell you what additional info/tests/whatever you need before you go in for the real Class 3 medical.
 
murphey said:
One more action which should be your #1 Priority....The Dreaded Medical.

Download a copy of the FAA form 8500 and read it. Pay special attention to question (all parts) of #18. Please note it states "Have You Ever...."

https://www.aviationmedicine.com/wp...PPLICATION-FOR-AIRMAN-MEDICAL-CERTIFICATE.pdf

The actual process is an online form. But if you have any questions/qualms about #18, the best advice is to make an appt with an AME for a CONSULTATION (I can recommend one near KAPA who is excellent - Dr John Harris). At that time they will tell you what additional info/tests/whatever you need before you go in for the real Class 3 medical.
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ugh, the Dreaded Medical... yes I will probably be reaching out to Dr. Harris when the time is right. Right now I'm collecting all the medical records I can find or obtain. I just know I'm going to end up going the SI route. :(
 
Andy Ericksen said:
ugh, the Dreaded Medical... yes I will probably be reaching out to Dr. Harris when the time is right. Right now I'm collecting all the medical records I can find or obtain. I just know I'm going to end up going the SI route. :(
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See Dr Harris, he can review your records and make recommendations as to how to proceed before you go for the Real Class 3.
 
murphey said:
See Dr Harris, he can review your records and make recommendations as to how to proceed before you go for the Real Class 3.
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That's the plan :) consultation first, then submit the official form after
 
I learned to fly through Aspen Flying Club in 2014, to Feb of 2015. I was never, ever, (not ONCE) disappointed, discouraged, upset, nervous, unhappy, or worried about any aspect of my training, insurance, or billing. Great instructor, great syllabus (tailored for ME) and truly great people. I was very happy there, and continued renting aircraft from Aspen after I passed my check ride. I loved Aspen Flying Club. My wife did, too, and they knew her name on sight. I miss it. My laser-etched whisky glass is one of my favorites. (“A drinking club with a flying problem”. Short lifespan in the display cabinet. :))
 
Lachlan said:
I learned to fly through Aspen Flying Club in 2014, to Feb of 2015. I was never, ever, (not ONCE) disappointed, discouraged, upset, nervous, unhappy, or worried about any aspect of my training, insurance, or billing.
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It's nice to get positive feedback on one of the schools I'm looking at. Thank you :)

Did you look at any other schools back then or was Aspen 'love at first sight'?
 
Andy Ericksen said:
It's nice to get positive feedback on one of the schools I'm looking at. Thank you :)

Did you look at any other schools back then or was Aspen 'love at first sight'?
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The world was a different place back then. People trusted their own perceptions, the internet didn’t dictate who would succeed and who would fail based solely upon a viral DimDum video, SpaceBook group, or latest political party warfare. It was a kinder, gentler time in America. And, uh…. Yeah- Aspen was my first and only choice. It seemed great, it was great, and I’m very happy that I chose them. Best of luck to you. I have some absolutely great memories of learning to fly out of KAPA. If you can learn to fly there, you can fly anywhere.
 
Lachlan said:
The world was a different place back then. People trusted their own perceptions, the internet didn’t dictate who would succeed and who would fail based solely upon a viral DimDum video, SpaceBook group, or latest political party warfare. It was a kinder, gentler time in America. And, uh…. Yeah- Aspen was my first and only choice. It seemed great, it was great, and I’m very happy that I chose them. Best of luck to you. I have some absolutely great memories of learning to fly out of KAPA. If you can learn to fly there, you can fly anywhere.
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I sure miss the good ole' days :D

Thank you for the feedback
 
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