Pondering a new Plane Purchase
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steingar
Taxi to Parking
Get the one that costs the most money. Spending other people's money is always fun.
brien23
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Better you suffer with the plane you have than the devil plane you might move into.
Timbeck2
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Aztec Flyer
The ravages of age on airplanes. Almost all of them shrink with time. The Cessna 150s I learned to fly on have become comparative miniatures, almost RC models, during the intervening years.
Mooney's shrink faster than Grummans.
Bonanzas are suitable if you can stretch out in the club seats and issue instructions to your pilot up front.
The Cirrus is made out of shrink proof plastic, but still requires that damned climb up onto the wing.
Cessna 177 or 210.
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jssmith.lh
Pre-Flight
Same here. I sold my Grumman, found a Cherokee six to rent, and am now looking for an aerobatic experimental. Forgot how much fun shopping for a plane was
MuseChaser
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Bonchie
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Bonchie
If space is what you crave, get a 182 and never worry about it again.
Mooney's and Bonanzas are both going to feel as cramped as your Grumman (assuming it's a Tiger).
Or is this really more about speed?
Mooney's and Bonanzas are both going to feel as cramped as your Grumman (assuming it's a Tiger).
Or is this really more about speed?
Morgan3820
Ejection Handle Pulled
Morgan3820
Ejection Handle Pulled
Perhaps admin should add a sticky in buying a plane or a separate section.
I’m going over to WoodNet to see which table saw I should get.
I’m going over to WoodNet to see which table saw I should get.
JPA
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J.P.
I'm currently in an AA-1.
Yeah, I figured I would get grief for asking the question that way, but any time anyone on this forum asks what kind of plane they should buy, the answer is Mooney, Bonanza, or Cirrus. That narrows a field of 8ish down to three. So - assuming I have circumvented that initial step and the field has been narrowed down to these three, which of these three is the best?
4 people, avg trip is ≈ 500nm.
Maint. time not an issue, but parts costs and availability are.
Ravioli
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Unwanted Guest - Perma-ban Pending
PoA answer: Bonanza
<-- his answer: RV10 Baby!
[Do we get extra credit when answers are not among the choices offered?]
<-- his answer: RV10 Baby!
[Do we get extra credit when answers are not among the choices offered?]
Caramon13
Pattern Altitude
4 "normal" sized people or 4 pencils? What's the average weight of these 4 people?
A Mooney will do about 1000 nm on about 400 ish usable weight after fuel, unless you are flying midgets that won't work. You can manipulate the numbers but lets say you get to 600 lbs usable weight, everyone's gotta weight 150 or less.
Bo's have a lot more usable. Cirrus is between a Bo and a Mooney for usable. You can get to around 800 ish in a Bo with full fuel in early 35 models. Cirrus is about 750 ish with full fuel.
chemgeek
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When I was flying my AA-1A, 300 nm was quite a stretch with reserves, less if there was any headwind. It was a plane for two and a shared toothbrush for luggage when traveling. The AA-1 and AA-5 are basically built around the same cockpit box. Roomier than most planes this size in terms of shoulder room, but not exactly spacious.
If you want to carry 4 people and have 500 nm range, you probably need a 6-seat aircraft to have enough useful load. If I were looking and had the money, a Cherokee 6, Lance, or Bonanza would be worth consideration. My mechanic transports overhauled aircraft engines on occasion in the back of his Lance. (Impressive!) It's a very quiet plane compared to my AA-5.
There are lots of other choices, but it all boils down to price, range, useful load, and speed. When you start looking at all the variables, you might be surprised what you wind up with. When I went shopping for my first plane, a VFR time-builder and day-tripper, I was dead set on a PA28-140, and even found a nice one and brought a check to fly it away when the owner had second thoughts. Then I got side-tracked when I found a really nice AA-1A, which was affordable, fast, sporty, and ideal for my short-term mission. That got me hooked on the Grumman line. When I went looking for a Tjger, I found that they had escalated in price well beyond my means, hence winding up with the overlooked and very affordable Traveler, which I still fly. At one point, I just missed a chance to get a great deal on a Beech A23/24, but that got taken away by the tax-man when the owner stiffed the state on use tax for years and got caught. So, you never know...the act of looking seems to turn up interesting options.
JPA
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Piper Lances are actually pretty cool. As are C-210's
My trips are not over water, so I don't need a 500 nm range. I just need a reasonable trip time for a 500 nm trip. I'm also guessing at least one of my passengers would need to ... "void" before reaching the destination, so a mid-trip stop is not a big con.
I like the response about "pencils vs normal size people" -- it assumes I will always fly with the same three passengers. Most times It would be 2 FAA avg adults.
My trips are not over water, so I don't need a 500 nm range. I just need a reasonable trip time for a 500 nm trip. I'm also guessing at least one of my passengers would need to ... "void" before reaching the destination, so a mid-trip stop is not a big con.
I like the response about "pencils vs normal size people" -- it assumes I will always fly with the same three passengers. Most times It would be 2 FAA avg adults.
AA5Bman
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He who ironically no longer flies an AA5B
Ain’t that the truth.
Been there done that, now I think veeeeeeery seriously about the possible pain and suffering involved with trading up.
JCranford
En-Route
Its always about more speed isnt it?
Caramon13
Pattern Altitude
Piper Lances are actually pretty cool. As are C-210's
My trips are not over water, so I don't need a 500 nm range. I just need a reasonable trip time for a 500 nm trip. I'm also guessing at least one of my passengers would need to ... "void" before reaching the destination, so a mid-trip stop is not a big con.
I like the response about "pencils vs normal size people" -- it assumes I will always fly with the same three passengers. Most times It would be 2 FAA avg adults.
2 FAA avg people should have no problem in any of the planes you mentioned. Adding more people almost always involves compromising on fuel since you can't change a person's weight or the usable weight in a plane. It involves some planning too because you don't want your passengers sitting on the ground while you burn off half a tank to avoid being over or out of CG.
All things being equal I'd rather have a Bonanza over either of the other two. They are faster, bit more GPH burn but just classier airplanes imo. Of course if money is no object, Cirrus aircraft work too. Mooney I'd rank last. Mostly because a ton of them come with a prop strike somewhere in their history, but also because of the interior size. Bo's have a wider cabin I believe.
schmookeeg
En-Route
Coming from a Yankee, I imagine any of those three will feel like you're flying a living room around. As a dyed-in-the-wool Beech dude, I'd say the Mooney will be the least shocking to the wallet, and very most bang for the buck.
Hard not to agree with the E-AB Vans RV route though, even though it wasn't on the menu.
As a dyed-in-the-wool Beech dude, I'd say the Mooney will be the least shocking to the wallet, and very most bang for the buck.Hard not to agree with the E-AB Vans RV route though, even though it wasn't on the menu.
MooneyDriver78
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Tom
No one is going 1000nm in a Mooney unless it’s an Acclaim, which can do it under 4 hours. So you can short the fuel a bit. With 5 hours of fuel my J will carry 700lbs, if you want more useable load, Encore approaches 1200lbs, it burns more fuel of course.
Tom
Rgbeard
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rgbeard
In general, a six-seat airplane makes a great 4-pax airplane.
In general, a four-seat airplane makes a great 2-pax, a so-so 3-pax, and a not-so so-so 4-pax.
There's exceptions to all that. But it's a good starting point.
In general, a four-seat airplane makes a great 2-pax, a so-so 3-pax, and a not-so so-so 4-pax.
There's exceptions to all that. But it's a good starting point.
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Snorting his way across the USA
You know there is a poll feature on the board right
1RTK1
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Planes are like tents, when they say a 4 man tent, it really only fits two plus gear...........
PaulS
Touchdown! Greaser!
I would add a Malibu to that list.
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Aztec Flyer
It's the one with the cramped, little cockpit with insufficient passenger space, apparently...
JPA
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J.P.
Coming from a Yankee, I imagine any of those three will feel like you're flying a living room around.
Hard not to agree with the E-AB Vans RV route though, even though it wasn't on the menu.
I like that you are honest about why you like he Barons. i have to say I agree with you on the aesthetics. I've flown Barons, and they feel like I'm moving the Earth around the plane. Vans... Very nice planes, but they are mostly a [truck] load of rivets held in place by thin pieces of metal. Really wonderful planes though, I can't take that away from them.
Now for some of the other posts.
- Yes, I know about the poll feature. I want to read the reasons for the preferences for certain planes.
- Cirrus is easier to get n and out of, but not easier than a C-177 (or even a 182RG), so that parameter is null.
- Grumman AA-1A, Georgia, basic steam gauges (+RMI and Carb temp... woo-hoo)
- Commanders are nice as well, but a little harder to find that Mooneys, Barons, or ... Cirri?
MarkH
Line Up and Wait
Crashnburn
Pattern Altitude
and built like a brick **** house!It's the one with the cramped, little cockpit with insufficient passenger space, apparently...
thomasdr72
Pre-takeoff checklist
Piper Lances are actually pretty cool. As are C-210's
My trips are not over water, so I don't need a 500 nm range. I just need a reasonable trip time for a 500 nm trip. I'm also guessing at least one of my passengers would need to ... "void" before reaching the destination, so a mid-trip stop is not a big con.
I like the response about "pencils vs normal size people" -- it assumes I will always fly with the same three passengers. Most times It would be 2 FAA avg adults.
We bought a C210 a few months ago, and I'm super glad I did... The early 4-seat ones are excellent blends of speed, utility, and interior space. No wonder the 182RG commands such a premium price...
thomasdr72
Pre-takeoff checklist
Technically the Mooney cabin is wider... However, the headroom on the others is larger so the visual interpretation is the others "feel" larger...