Phraseology

[Planet Express Material]

I flew solo to another class D airport. My home airport's controllers tell us to "report" when we reach certain points. This other airport's controller (I had just over-flown and was 6 nm out after declaring I intended to go 10nm) said "Advise turn to approach..." Well, being under a class B shelf, I took that as a strong suggestion to quit frogging around and get back to land. I'm sure he slapped his forehead when I replied, "Wilco. Turning to approach NOW."
Anyone willing to admit similar errors I can avoid in the future?

 

[Larry in TN]

"Advise turn to approach..."

I have no idea what that means.

If a controller uses non-standard phraseology that you don't understand just ask him what it means. It's not your fault if you can't read him mind.

 

[JCranford]

Yeah, I have no idea either. I think I would have asked for clarification or simply told him when I turned back toward the airport.

 

[FlySince9]

If you meant to land there why did you overfly it by six miles and intend to go even out to ten miles... Though his phraseology was a little non-standard, so was your situation. Pilots normally call while "approaching" the airport not overflying it, headed, essentially, out of his airspace... He simply wanted you to call him when you were headed inbound "approaching" his airport again... Until then, he really has no need to talk to you...

 

[jordane93]

I never heard that phrase before.

 

[Timbeck2]

I would have asked. No sense in second guessing what you thought he meant.

 

[frfly172]

Advise when turning inbound.

 

[midlifeflyer]

I flew solo to another class D airport. My home airport's controllers tell us to "report" when we reach certain points. This other airport's controller (I had just over-flown and was 6 nm out after declaring I intended to go 10nm) said "Advise turn to approach..."

I have no idea what the controller meant or what you were doing.

Of course, in addition to the other WAGs, since you were apparently 6 miles out (2 mile out of his airspace) and informing him you were heading even further away, I'd add that telling you to change to the Approach frequency ("tune" instead of "turn") is just as likely a nonstandard instruction as anything else.

As with any instruction you don't understand, standard or not, ask for clarification. It's not only a good idea, it's the rule.

 

[Matthew]

You said you were flying to this other airport, but were you planning to land or just overfly and return home? Or were you just overflying, got 6 miles away, then wanted them to know you were heading out 4 more? Were you transitioning IN their airspace or OVER?

I'm trying to get a better picture.

And no, I don't remember ever hearing that phrase. But as frfly172 mentions, "Advise when turning inbound" is something I have heard before. In those cases I can recall, it's generally when someone is doing some maneuvering inside the class D (pictures, or whatever) and has told tower they'll be puttering around for a while and letting them know when they are ready to come back. Otherwise, you are usually already "inbound" when you call to let them know you want to land.

 

[Planet Express Material]

I would have asked. No sense in second guessing what you thought he meant.

At the time, I was sure (but wrong) he meant turn and come back, but my CFI was monitoring and told me I goofed.

 

[Planet Express Material]

You said you were flying to this other airport, but were you planning to land or just overfly and return home? Or were you just overflying, got 6 miles away, then wanted them to know you were heading out 4 more? Were you transitioning IN their airspace or OVER?

I'm trying to get a better picture.

And no, I don't remember ever hearing that phrase. But as frfly172 mentions, "Advise when turning inbound" is something I have heard before. In those cases I can recall, it's generally when someone is doing some maneuvering inside the class D (pictures, or whatever) and has told tower they'll be puttering around for a while and letting them know when they are ready to come back. Otherwise, you are usually already "inbound" when you call to let them know you want to land.

I had been inbound above their airspace and below the class B shelf. I was "handed over" to the class D tower by the class B approach control. When I contacted the class D tower (while squaking an assigned transponder code), I did indeed tell them my intentions; it was all good. After I was 6 miles out, they said, "Advise...". They took my reaction in stride and I made it in unaware I had misinterpreted their statement.

 

[Planet Express Material]

If you meant to land there why did you overfly it by six miles and intend to go even out to ten miles... Though his phraseology was a little non-standard, so was your situation. Pilots normally call while "approaching" the airport not overflying it, headed, essentially, out of his airspace... He simply wanted you to call him when you were headed inbound "approaching" his airport again... Until then, he really has no need to talk to you...

I had never been there before and wanted get my eyes on it so I could easily spot it and keep my bearings straight.

 

[Planet Express Material]

I have no idea what the controller meant or what you were doing.

Of course, in addition to the other WAGs, since you were apparently 6 miles out (2 mile out of his airspace) and informing him you were heading even further away, I'd add that telling you to change to the Approach frequency ("tune" instead of "turn") is just as likely a nonstandard instruction as anything else.

As with any instruction you don't understand, standard or not, ask for clarification. It's not only a good idea, it's the rule.

You're absolutely right. Just that at the time, I was sure of what he meant. I wanted to see if there are other- possibly common- interpretation errors I can be aware of.

 

[Matthew]

I had been inbound above their airspace and below the class B shelf. I was "handed over" to the class D tower by the class B approach control. When I contacted the class D tower (while squaking an assigned transponder code), I did indeed tell them my intentions; it was all good. After I was 6 miles out, they said, "Advise...". They took my reaction in stride and I made it in unaware I had misinterpreted their statement.

I think I see it now. You were on flight following, got handed over to tower, told them "Hey, I'm going to keep on this heading for a while before I turn around", tower said "advise turn to approach". Yeah, I would have expected something more like, "Advise turning inbound" or something, so there wouldn't be confusion. Or, did they "advise tune to approach" - trying to suggest you get back on with approach (but that phrasing doesn't sound right either)? Next time something like that happens, tell them "student pilot, say again?"

 

[Planet Express Material]

I would have asked. No sense in second guessing what you thought he meant.

Right. My point is that I was certain (although wrong) of what he meant and want to be aware of other possible mistakes I might make.

 

[Planet Express Material]

I think I see it now. You were on flight following, got handed over to tower, told them "Hey, I'm going to keep on this heading for a while before I turn around", tower said "advise turn to approach". Yeah, I would have expected something more like, "Advise turning inbound" or something, so there wouldn't be confusion. Or, did they "advise tune to approach" - trying to suggest you get back on with approach (but that phrasing doesn't sound right either)? Next time something like that happens, tell them "student pilot, say again?"

That was the situation. It's just that my mind automatically processed it as, "We think you should turn around now". There was no uncertainty on my part. I really thought I got it right until I talked to someone later who overheard the transmissions.

 

[Matthew]

That was the situation. It's just that my mind automatically processed it as, "We think you should turn around now". There was no uncertainty on my part. I really thought I got it right until I talked to someone later who overheard the transmissions.

Guess what? This is only one in a lifetime of mistakes! But it's good that you are taking it seriously enough to try to prevent this particular one from happening again.

 

[midlifeflyer]

You're absolutely right. Just that at the time, I was sure of what he meant. I wanted to see if there are other- possibly common- interpretation errors I can be aware of.

Well, the problem is, once you are sure what someone means there's not much reason, perhaps a better word would be "incentive", to ask for clarification. So it's hard to say what other specific interpretation errors can be made. Reducing those kinds of errors is what standard phraseology is all about but even then, the pilot still has to understand what it means.