PA-28 235 Cherokee

SmashTime

Pre-takeoff checklist
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SmashTime
Tell your friends about this deal!

Heres the information on the plane:

Fixed Pitch Prop
1964TT: 4250 (hours will change as it’s actively flown)
STOH:745
SMOH:1728 (2000hr TBO)
Prop:150hrs (Propstrike 08’[hit tow-bar] Professionally repaired,Center line Aviation, no sudden engine stop)

All logs since new
All AD’s complied with
Hangered in North Texas
Useful Load: 1416lbs
Cruise Speed: 131kt
KX155TSO w/GS
KX170B w/KI 209 Indicator
Narco AT50A Transponder w/Mode C
Garmin 196 GPS, hard wired, panel mounted
KMA 20 TSO Audio Panel
IFR Cert Due 2014
Sigtronics 4 place, pilot push to talk
Wheel Pants
84 Gallons
3-light Whelen strobes
Whelen LED Landing/Taxi Light (2013)
Power Flo Exhaust
Davtron Digital temp gauge
Vertical Card Compass Auto Fuel STC
Gap Seal STC AI,VSI,DG,ALT,ELT
New Tires (2013)
New Battery (2013)
New Brakes (2013)
80% New Paint 2013 (hail damaged repaired and painted professionally)
Oil changed every 25 hours (oil analysis shows normal wear)
Interior is 7/10
Exterior is 8.5/10

27,500$

Lots of plane for the money. Priced to sell quick.
 

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Nice looking plane.
Downside is a engine that is run-out according to book/ 70% of TBO.
Age of overhaul is probably more than 12 years.
Avionics though good, are old.
I'm guessing, high 20,000's.
YMMV
Dave
 
Thank you, I have it slightly above your mark based on condition.
 
Have you booked it on vref,seems to be in the low to mid 20k range. High time motor ,old avionics,and damage history. Wish you good luck on a sale.
 
Just post on Barnstormers you're selling a $33,000 Hulk sticker with a free airplane attached to it.
 
Have you booked it on vref,seems to be in the low to mid 20k range. High time motor ,old avionics,and damage history. Wish you good luck on a sale.

The market tells me there are no hightime 235's being sold for mid 20's. I won't be able to get top dollar I understand that but 20-25k for this airplane is a steal and a half, wouldn't be fair on my end at all.

The market tells me hightime cherokee 140's and the like are in the 20-25k range. That's merely my observation though. I'll list it in the low 30's and go from there. This is a lot of airplane, even if listed above vref slightly. We'll see how it goes lol. Spread the word.



32k w/fresh annual.
 
How do you get sales history of other planes or are you just referring to the market as being what people are listing their planes for? I would be curious if there's a way to get transaction history to try and value my plane.
 
Did you look on ASO, barnstormers, trade a plane, controller, and see what the others comps were?

Mi wouldn't worry about those stupid sites, I'd look at comps.

On the plus side the plane looks nice, I'd peel that sticker off though.

On the minus, the engine is long in the tooth, I never like seeing a prop strike unless it includes a new prop and overhaul, even if they said all was OK.

As for the overhaul being over 12 years old, guessing a 135 operator isn't going to be looking for this type of plane anyway so who cares, it's going to be the hours on that engine that will prove the largest hurtle IMO.
 
I'm just looking at what's being listed and for how long they stay for sale. Aso, TAP, controller etc.....

I'll take the sticker off when someone wants it lol.
 
32k w/fresh annual.

I'm not sure you'll get your money back on the annual...people are pricing the motor and the airframe, save the $2k on the annual and lower the price to like 29.9k and it will probably sell faster
 
I'm not sure you'll get your money back on the annual...people are pricing the motor and the airframe, save the $2k on the annual and lower the price to like 29.9k and it will probably sell faster

Agree with this.

If/when I purchase, I'd rather be in charge of the inspection, both Pre-buy and annual. And if the aircraft is in good condition, I don't mind paying for the annual since a good pre-buy is almost/not quite a good annual.

When I see ads saying "with fresh annual", I really wonder if the seller is 1) going to let my mech do the annual inspection and 2) going to pay for any airworthy and AD issues that my mech finds. And do so with minimal fuss.

One item to ask for, Jesse, is a solid buy/sell agreement. Be willing to work with your buyer, but just as you want when your the buyer, make sure the contract includes any "must have" clauses that will make the deal go smooth for your end, and eliminate in advance any frustration that might/can occur .
 
Agree with this.

If/when I purchase, I'd rather be in charge of the inspection, both Pre-buy and annual. And if the aircraft is in good condition, I don't mind paying for the annual since a good pre-buy is almost/not quite a good annual.

When I see ads saying "with fresh annual", I really wonder if the seller is 1) going to let my mech do the annual inspection and 2) going to pay for any airworthy and AD issues that my mech finds. And do so with minimal fuss.

One item to ask for, Jesse, is a solid buy/sell agreement. Be willing to work with your buyer, but just as you want when your the buyer, make sure the contract includes any "must have" clauses that will make the deal go smooth for your end, and eliminate in advance any frustration that might/can occur .



Thanks for the heads up Mike but I'm not sure what you mean, I had no such agreements when I purchased the plane so any help is appreciated.
 
Thanks for the heads up Mike but I'm not sure what you mean, I had no such agreements when I purchased the plane so any help is appreciated.

Call the Pilot Info Center at AOPA and ask them to email you the boiler plate template of their purchase agreement. While not 100% perfect, it's a great starter point.

That you got a decent plane without entering into a purchase contract with your original seller, you did okay and were a bit lucky.

Essentially, you need to render onto paper all the various details how the transaction between you and the buyer will happen. Here, you can detail
  • the steps of the process,
  • The time line (buyer must complete within XX days)
  • Money items, such as deposits, payment, use of escrow,
  • when and how the aircraft will be made available for inspection
  • Who pays for what items discovered in inspection
  • Complete detailed inventory and description (almost down to each scratch and ding, but not quite) of what's being sold
  • What would cause the contract to be voided, and who pays for what if this happens.
  • and more.

In a nutshell, it's a document that helps both parties be very clear on what's being sold/purchased, what condition, how the transaction will occur, and what to when it works out well, and what to do when it goes all wrong.

AOPA can also help with the legal end of things (through their legal service department and member benefit plan), and their partner, Aerospace Reports, is a good company for handling escrow and title registration activities.
 
I will look into that agreement. It looks like a bit of a headache though, my purchase was simple: prebuy, buy and fly away. Lol
 
save the $2k on the annual


For a PA28?!

I wouldn't be in that market for any POS that needed 2k to pass a annual.

That's ether alot of "deferred maintenance" or a AP IA who keeps some KY in his toolbox :goofy:

Here's the AOPA template, Id recommend using it, keeps everyone honest

The following document has been provided as a general guide in preparing an aircraft purchase/sales agreement. This agreement was not designed to address every issue, element, or contingency for these types of transactions. However, it contains some alternative language, in italics, that the parties may consider as they identify their respective needs and objectives for the agreement. Nevertheless, we urge you not to simply copy this agreement and "fill in the blanks." When it comes to the buying and selling of aircraft, there are considerable financial and legal risks for both the buyer and seller. Consequently, it would be worth the additional investment in having a qualified attorney draft the actual agreement.

Aircraft Purchase/Sales Agreement

THIS AGREEMENT, is entered into this _______ day of ________________, _______, by and between ____________________, (the "Buyer"), a(n) __________ (individual(s), corporation, partnership, or LLC) whose principal address is _____________________ __________________________________; and _____________________ (the "Seller"), a(n) _______________ (individual(s), corporation, partnership, or LLC) whose principal address is ______________________________________________________________:

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, in consideration of the premises, the mutual covenants contained herein, and other good and valuable consideration, the sufficiency of which is hereby acknowledged, the parties do hereby agree as follows:

1. Sale of Aircraft. Seller agrees to sell to Buyer and Buyer agrees to purchase from Seller the following Aircraft (the "Aircraft"):

Aircraft Make_______________________________________
Aircraft Model______________________________________
Aircraft Year_______________________
Aircraft Registration Number___________________
Aircraft Serial Number________________________________
Aircraft shall be equipped as follows __________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Seller warrants that Seller holds legal title to the Aircraft and that title will be transferred to Buyer free and clear of any liens, claims, charges, or encumbrances. Upon delivery of the Aircraft and payment of the balance of the purchase price, in accordance with this Agreement, Seller shall execute a bill of sale granting good and marketable title to the Aircraft.

2. Consideration. It is agreed that the price of the Aircraft is ________________ Dollars ($____________) and is due on delivery of the Aircraft. All monies paid in accordance with this Agreement will be made by cash, cashier's check, certified check, wire transfer, or equivalent.

3. Escrow. It is agreed that within ________(_____) business days after execution of this agreement an escrow account will be established with escrow agent [ at Buyer's sole discretion] [ at Seller's sole discretion] [ agreeable to both parties]. All funds, including the deposit, and the following documents pertaining to this transaction, shall be transmitted through the escrow account: (a) Bill of sale for the Aircraft from Seller to Buyer; and (b) Application for Registration of the Aircraft to Buyer. The fees for the escrow service shall be [ paid by the Buyer] [ paid by the Seller] [ split evenly between Buyer and Seller].

4. Deposit. The Buyer shall pay a deposit of _________________Dollars ($__________) in to the escrow account immediately upon the establishment of that account. The deposit is [ non-refundable unless otherwise stipulated in this agreement] [ fully refundable to Buyer except as otherwise stipulated herein]. The deposit shall be credited to the purchase price of the Aircraft.

5. Pre-purchase Inspection. After the signing of this Agreement and the payment of the deposit into escrow, the Buyer shall have the right to perform a pre-purchase inspection of the Aircraft. Such inspection shall be at the Buyer's expense and may be performed by a individual(s) of Buyer's choice, so long as he/she/they hold current Airframe and Powerplant mechanic certificates issued by the Federal Aviation Administration. The inspection shall be performed at ______________ Airport.

Alternate clauses for this section:

[ If the Buyer does not perform or have this inspection performed within ________ (_____) days of the signing of this Agreement, then Buyer shall be deemed to have waived his/her/its right to such inspection].

[ Upon completion of this inspection, Buyer shall have ________ (______) days to notify Seller that he/she/they will not purchase the Aircraft. If Buyer elects not to purchase the Aircraft, the Buyer shall notify Seller in writing of this decision. Upon receipt of such notice, Seller shall return, or have returned, within ________ (______) days, to Buyer all payments made by Buyer, except for the deposit].

[ Upon completion of this inspection, Buyer shall present to the Seller any list of discrepancies compiled. The Seller shall have ________ (______) business days to review the list and to notify the Buyer of Seller's decision: (a) to pay to have the [discrepancies] [discrepancies affecting the airworthiness of the Aircraft] repaired at Seller's expense and to complete the sale; or (b) to decline to pay the costs of repairs and to terminate the Agreement. If Seller declines to pay the cost of repairs, Seller shall refund, or have refunded, the Buyer's deposit and shall reimburse the Buyer for the cost of the pre-purchase inspection].

6. Aircraft Delivery. It is agreed that the Aircraft and its logbooks shall be delivered on ______________(date) at ___________ Airport. Payment in full, as described above, is a condition of delivery. Title and risk of loss or damage to the Aircraft shall pass to Buyer at the time of delivery. The Aircraft will be delivered to Buyer in its present condition, normal wear and tear excepted, with a valid FAA Certificate of Airworthiness.

7. Warranties. Alternative clauses for this section:

[ Except as provided otherwise in this agreement, this Aircraft is sold "as is." There are no warranties, either express or implied with respect to merchantability or fitness applicable to the Aircraft or any equipment applicable thereto including warranties as to the accuracy of the Aircraft's logbooks, made by Seller. Buyer agrees that no warranty has been expressed or implied by Seller and that Buyer has inspected the Aircraft and understands that it is being purchased "as is." Buyer hereby expressly waives any claim for incidental or consequential damages, including damages resulting in personal injury against Seller].

[ Seller warrants that: (a) the Aircraft is in airworthy condition; (b) the Aircraft has a current annual inspection; (c) the Aircraft has a currently effective Standard Category airworthiness certificate issued by the Federal Aviation Administration; (d) all of the Aircraft's logbooks are accurate and current; (e) all applicable Airworthiness Directives have been complied with; (f) _______________________].

8. Seller's Inability to Perform.

(a) If the Aircraft is destroyed or in Seller's opinion damaged beyond repair, or is seized by the United States Government, Seller shall promptly notify Buyer. On receipt of such notification, this Agreement will be terminated and the Seller shall return to Buyer all payments made in accordance with this Agreement, and Seller will be relieved of any obligation to replace or repair the Aircraft.

(b) Seller will not be responsible or deemed to be in default for delays in performance of this Agreement due to causes beyond Seller's control and not caused by Seller's fault or negligence.

9. Buyer's Inability to Perform. If, for any reason, the Buyer is unable to pay the purchase price of the Aircraft, as specified in this Agreement, the Seller shall return all payments to the Buyer except for the deposit.

10. Taxes. The Buyer shall pay any sales or use tax imposed by a state or local government, which results from the sale of the Aircraft.

11. Assignment. This Agreement may not be transferred or assigned without written authorization signed by Seller and Buyer.

12. Notice. All notices and requests required or authorized under this Agreement shall be given in writing by certified mail, return receipt requested. The date on which any such notice is received by the addressee shall be deemed the date of notice.

13. Governing Law. This Agreement is a contract executed under and to be construed under the laws of the State of ____________________________.

14. Attorney Fees. In the event any action is filed in relation to this Agreement, [ the unsuccessful party in the action shall pay to the successful party a reasonable sum for the successful party's attorney's fees] [ each party shall be responsible for his/her/its own attorney's fees].

15. Waiver. Either party's failure to enforce any provision of this Agreement against the other party shall not be construed as a waiver thereof so as to excuse the other party from future performance of that provision or any other provision.

16. Severability. The invalidity of any portion of the Agreement shall not affect the validity of the remaining portions thereof.

17. Paragraph Headings. The headings to the paragraphs to this Agreement are solely for convenience and have no substantive effect on the Agreement nor are they to aid in the interpretation of the Agreement.

18. Entire Agreement. This Agreement constitutes the entire Agreement between the parties. No statements, promises, or inducements made by any party to this Agreement, or any agent or employees of either party, which are not contained in this written contract shall be valid or binding. This Agreement may not be enlarged, modified, or altered except in writing signed by the parties.

IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the parties hereto have executed this Agreement the day and year first above written.

_________________________________
_________________________________
SELLER
BUYER
 
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Yea a 2k annual isn't the norm at all. Expect 1k or so.
 
Want to sell it quick, price it at $18,500, or see what kind of deal you can do swapping for a low-mid time engine.
 
Want to sell it quick, price it at $18,500, or see what kind of deal you can do swapping for a low-mid time engine.

18,500 is not in the cards if the plane has an engine in it. I'll fly it to 2400 smoh if that's all I could get out of it.
 
18,500 is not in the cards if the plane has an engine in it. I'll fly it to 2400 smoh if that's all I could get out of it.

You likely will, that's just how the market is. By now, people are expecting at least a 430 for $21k, in fact, without it, you are looking at bottom feeders or people looking for a really good deal to make into their airplane. You either need an engine or panel mod to sell to an average money buyer.
 
You likely will, that's just how the market is. By now, people are expecting at least a 430 for $21k, in fact, without it, you are looking at bottom feeders or people looking for a really good deal to make into their airplane. You either need an engine or panel mod to sell to an average money buyer.

You may be right but I have no problem keeping it, i only want a faster plane... I don't need it.

30k+- for a 1400lb useful load and sharp looking plane seems more then reasonable. But I might he slightly biased. Lol
 
You may be right but I have no problem keeping it, i only want a faster plane... I don't need it.

30k+- for a 1400lb useful load and sharp looking plane seems more then reasonable. But I might he slightly biased. Lol

Yep, I came to a similar conclusion with my 310. You asked to get it sold quick, that is what it takes to get sold in this market environment. Considering the oilfield could shut down any day now, you may be better off waiting until spring/summer when it tends to be easier to sell a plane.
 
Yep, I came to a similar conclusion with my 310. You asked to get it sold quick, that is what it takes to get sold in this market environment. Considering the oilfield could shut down any day now, you may be better off waiting until spring/summer when it tends to be easier to sell a plane.

I said sold it with a reasonable price in 3 months not sold in 5 minutes at a fire sale price lol.
 
Yep, I came to a similar conclusion with my 310. You asked to get it sold quick, that is what it takes to get sold in this market environment. Considering the oilfield could shut down any day now, you may be better off waiting until spring/summer when it tends to be easier to sell a plane.


I'd say he's priced much more in the ball park of reality with his PA28 compared to your twin, he also has a much more desirable aircraft.
 
For a PA28?!

I wouldn't be in that market for any POS that needed 2k to pass a annual.

That's ether alot of "deferred maintenance" or a AP IA who keeps some KY in his toolbox :goofy:

Here's the AOPA template, Id recommend using it, keeps everyone honest

where do you get your annuals done? the inspection alone on that should be between $1,200-$1,500 plus anything wrong with it...it's probably 20hrs to get through one of those, especially with the bigger motor, even at $60 / hr for your mechanic (and I don't know many $60 / hr mechanics that are still in business)
 
The annual on my CS Prop 235 was $4nnn. It needed a new battery and new brake line fittings.

I have gotten annuals for $1200-$1500.
 
where do you get your annuals done? the inspection alone on that should be between $1,200-$1,500 plus anything wrong with it...it's probably 20hrs to get through one of those, especially with the bigger motor, even at $60 / hr for your mechanic (and I don't know many $60 / hr mechanics that are still in business)

Owner assist in the NE.
 
I think you guys are being a little rough on this one, I don't seem to see any actively flying 235s out there selling for 18-20k. I know when I bought my plane everyone told me I was overpaying becuase it lacked the newest and greatest avionics but somehow it has served me well and I was offered my money back by a local broker that was looking for a plane for a buyer he was representing.

I don't think the market is as distressed on the simple weekend planes that are cheap to maintain, that being said if you have a complex plane that is known to cost you in the shorts more often then not at annual then you may have to all but give it away. I realize his engine is close to timed out but there are a lot of people that will take them well beyond TBO with proper care and one could fly it for years to come before springing for an engine. Yea the avionics are older but let's face it unless your flying hard IFR your IPad or portable gps has better technology then most certified stuff out there but people get all gadget crazed when most the people I know with 430s & 530s fly with a portable 90% of the time but like the ease of the radio frequencies with the garmin.

His plane would serve a lot of people well that might not be trying to keep up with the latest craze but needs some additional useful load to carry a couple buddies and a dog on a short weekend hunting/fishing trip.

Just my 2 cents and I am sure many will disagree but regardless Good Luck on the sale - looks to be a good looking plane.



Side note: I would take any advice Mike gives as a consideration, his advice helped me alot in the purchase on my plane and he is not a person I would disregard as he is not a guy that would ever try and steer your wrong.
 
I'd say he's priced much more in the ball park of reality with his PA28 compared to your twin, he also has a much more desirable aircraft.

Could all be well and true, however all that plane has is a paint job, and that was to fix hail damage. He has a fixed pitch prop attached to a market run out value engine and has nothing in the panel of any value. The way I have come to understand the market, that plane will be valued the same as any run out PA-28 with a smaller market than a Warrior. I would be extremely pleased to be proven wrong and wish him luck, don't get me wrong, just trying to provide a possible reality check.
 
Side note: I would take any advice Mike gives as a consideration, his advice helped me alot in the purchase on my plane and he is not a person I would disregard as he is not a guy that would ever try and steer your wrong.
Thanks for saying that.

(ps. your check is in the mail)
 
Price posted.

27,500$ for quick sale.

5802351686

-Jesse
 
Yes I believe they are. The nose might be longer to fit the big engine though I am not 100% sure.
 
Yes I believe they are. The nose might be longer to fit the big engine though I am not 100% sure.

I only worked on a couple way back, but the way I recall it the nose is the same, the engine mount is stubbier to accommodate the extra engine length with minimum impact on CG as well as sheet metal. Do the wings end up any longer with the outboard tanks?
 
I only worked on a couple way back, but the way I recall it the nose is the same, the engine mount is stubbier to accommodate the extra engine length with minimum impact on CG as well as sheet metal. Do the wings end up any longer with the outboard tanks?



I'm a horrible plane owner, I should know these questions lol...

I dont think they are longer I believe they just sit deeper into the wing.
 
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