Oshkosh - 2019

Mooney Fan said:
I'm starting to watch the calendar like a grade school kid does come mid May. I have been told there is a pretty full roster for us participating in the Cherokee 2 Oshkosh mass arrival on Saturday. I think they are allocated 50 planes.

I'll be the one with the Hershey Bar Wing lol....
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I flew with them once, great group with a really hard core safety culture. You're going to have a really great time. I am so glad to hear about their continued success.
 
steingar said:
I flew with them once, great group with a really hard core safety culture. You're going to have a really great time. I am so glad to hear about their continued success.
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Thx. I had my first formation flying clinic over 3 days last month down in Texas. I am hooked. One of the lead instructors is an old F-4 driver. I was stoked to fly on his wing.
 
Mooney Fan said:
I will be flying in this year with the Cherokees to Oshkosh group. Got an email today saying its the first time in their history registration has gone past 50 A/C.
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I flew in on the first Cherokee mass arrival. It was *cough* an adventure.
As in, I never knew I could apply brakes in the air.
 
mikea said:
I flew in on the first Cherokee mass arrival. It was *cough* an adventure.
As in, I never knew I could apply brakes in the air.
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Ah, it's a Cherokee, right? They all fly exactly the same, regardless of horsepower or weight, because they have the same wing and fuselage, right?

Right? :no:
 
Dave Theisen said:
As I’ve mentioned here before, don’t do what I did. I actually brought plywood, but when I got there I looked around and didn’t see anyone else using it, so I said the heck with it. It took 4 men, giving everything they had, to move that Bonanza a few days later. :)
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So I’ll ask the stupid question...you shut down, run out, put the plywood down then start up taxi on them and shut down again? Or can you just pull the plane on the plywood on the grass? It make it much heavier/harder?
 
Daytonabch04 said:
So I’ll ask the stupid question...you shut down, run out, put the plywood down then start up taxi on them and shut down again? Or can you just pull the plane on the plywood on the grass? It make it much heavier/harder?
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No answers but I’m a bit curious as to the process here too...
 
Daytonabch04 said:
So I’ll ask the stupid question...you shut down, run out, put the plywood down then start up taxi on them and shut down again? Or can you just pull the plane on the plywood on the grass? It make it much heavier/harder?
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You’ll taxi into your row and shut down. Have the boards easily accessible and hop out and plop them down. Then push your plane back into your spot onto the boards. The EAA folks will help you.

Another vote for cutting boards over plywood and the gutter downspouts.
 
Yep, it's not hard to push the plane on the grass when you first get there, but if it's wet and you're there for a week, you can settle into the ruts. I learned that the first time I went to Oshkosh in the 172. It took nearly full power and two ground pounders pushing on the struts to get out of the ruts I'd settled into.

Fortunately, the Navion has big enough tires that this has never been a problem. I can pull the Navion over most sets of chocks without too much effort.
 
baboss said:
You’ll taxi into your row and shut down. Have the boards easily accessible and hop out and plop them down. Then push your plane back into your spot onto the boards. The EAA folks will help you.

Another vote for cutting boards over plywood and the gutter downspouts.
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I find it easier to stop short then pull the plane forward onto the boards -- way easier than trying to push it back.
 
In the event that parking (not camping) is full at OSH, which would be a better divert airport, FDL or ATW?
 
Keep in mind that you may not have a spot that you can taxi forward out of. I was in vintage camping and they put me on an endcap, facing the main drag of pedestrian and shuttle traffic, not to mention a concrete bench between my plane and the pavement. So I had to push the plane backwards and maneuver it through a three-point turn to get facing the right direction for engine start. Bring a tow bar so you can steer your plane through that process if necessary.

Make sure you have your parking boards and tie-down system very handy when you land. They are strict about the rule that you not leave the plane without tying it down. Land, follow the ground personnel signals, get shut down, verbally confirm you are in the right spot to park, then get those boards under the wheels and tie your plane down. Don't go to register at an EAA booth, don't go to a bathroom, don't do anything until the plane is on boards and tied down.

When you leave, same drill in reverse. Get everything ready to go but leave the plane tied down and on the boards. Get a refund for unused camping/parking if you are owed one. Use the bathroom, get a departure briefing, load up the plane, and do your preflight, all before you remove your tie-downs. Find some ground personnel to guide you out of your spot for departure, and only then remove the tie-downs and boards immediately before you either get in the plane to start up and taxi out or get help maneuvering it to face the right direction for engine start.

It's not difficult or all that stressful, but knowing what to expect is really helpful to keep it easy and stress-free.
 
iamtheari said:
Keep in mind that you may not have a spot that you can taxi forward out of. I was in vintage camping and they put me on an endcap, facing the main drag of pedestrian and shuttle traffic, not to mention a concrete bench between my plane and the pavement. So I had to push the plane backwards and maneuver it through a three-point turn to get facing the right direction for engine start. Bring a tow bar so you can steer your plane through that process if necessary.

Make sure you have your parking boards and tie-down system very handy when you land. They are strict about the rule that you not leave the plane without tying it down. Land, follow the ground personnel signals, get shut down, verbally confirm you are in the right spot to park, then get those boards under the wheels and tie your plane down. Don't go to register at an EAA booth, don't go to a bathroom, don't do anything until the plane is on boards and tied down.

When you leave, same drill in reverse. Get everything ready to go but leave the plane tied down and on the boards. Get a refund for unused camping/parking if you are owed one. Use the bathroom, get a departure briefing, load up the plane, and do your preflight, all before you remove your tie-downs. Find some ground personnel to guide you out of your spot for departure, and only then remove the tie-downs and boards immediately before you either get in the plane to start up and taxi out or get help maneuvering it to face the right direction for engine start.

It's not difficult or all that stressful, but knowing what to expect is really helpful to keep it easy and stress-free.
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Generally, you shouldn't be taxing forward out of any camping or parking spot. Per the published camping guidelines engines may not be started at the campsite and aircraft must be pushed out. Not saying it doesn't happen but that's the SOP. Also the departure briefing is a bit of a joke IMO -- all they do is read off the departure pages of the NOTAM to you and it isn't mandatory in any event. In my limited experience pulling your aircraft out into the taxi lane is the universal signal to the marshallers that you want to depart and they come on over, at least in HBC-- can't speak to the other camping areas.
 
I have never found of shortage of willing helpers at Oshkosh to assist with pushing or pulling a plane around for positioning in the camp ground either when arriving or departing. Conversely, I was shocked at Sun N Fun this year to watch plane after plane simply power up and pull out of parking only to completely destroy the campsite behind them :rolleyes:
 
tsts4 said:
Generally, you shouldn't be taxing forward out of any camping or parking spot.
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That's true, but that's not what he was talking about. When you get end-capped in Vintage, you have to turn your airplane 180 degrees before you can do anything. Last couple of years we've gotten creative with stuffing people in places.

That being said, no engine starts without a marshaller and we can always get more people to help. We've pushed bigger things than you. We got a bunch of people to push a trimotor out once.
 
Oshkosh is fun; even though I'm not going.

I was standing in line at McDonald's today; I noticed another fella standing nearby, waiting for his order. He was wearing an Airventure hat.

I asked if he was going this year. BOOM, new friend to chat with to pass the time in the McDonald's line!


That is him! He says the ultralight runways aren't as crazy to land at. He had lots of advice and information. Fun guy to talk with.

He flies a Kolbra; interesting aircraft, I had never heard of it.
 
For those of us who were caught in that epic mess trying to fly into OSH 2018 on the Sunday before the show, let's hope the FAA has briefed their controllers on the FISK arrival procedure for 2019.

For those who are unaware, 2018 was the worst arrival mess we've ever seen. (This year will be my 37th consecutive Oshkosh -- I know what I'm talking about.) The weather had been bad for a few days, and everyone was on the ground, waiting for that VFR window to launch.

When it came, we all launched at once.

The guys at FISK, when presented with too many planes coming up the railroad tracks too close together, panicked.

Instead of taking every third or fourth plane, like they had done every other year, they ordered EVERYONE back into the hold.

So, we would all go back around the lake, as a mob, until released. We would then head back up the railroad tracks -- now with even more planes -- and the controllers would freak out AGAIN and send the whole group back to the hold.

This happened several times.

That's not how you resolve the issue. Every other year, they would let one or two planes through, then send the next three or four back to the hold. That's how you break up a gaggle of planes that are too bunched up.

It just got worse and worse, until -- after 3 hours of holding -- we (and 100 of our closest friends) diverted. It was a mess.

Let's hope this year they follow their own procedures, and everything is back to normal.

We are counting the days!

Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk
 
Jay Honeck said:
For those of us who were caught in that epic mess trying to fly into OSH 2018 on the Sunday before the show, let's hope the FAA has briefed their controllers on the FISK arrival procedure for 2019.

For those who are unaware, 2018 was the worst arrival mess we've ever seen. (This year will be my 37th consecutive Oshkosh -- I know what I'm talking about.) The weather had been bad for a few days, and everyone was on the ground, waiting for that VFR window to launch.

When it came, we all launched at once.

The guys at FISK, when presented with too many planes coming up the railroad tracks too close together, panicked.

Instead of taking every third or fourth plane, like they had done every other year, they ordered EVERYONE back into the hold.

So, we would all go back around the lake, as a mob, until released. We would then head back up the railroad tracks -- now with even more planes -- and the controllers would freak out AGAIN and send the whole group back to the hold.

This happened several times.

That's not how you resolve the issue. Every other year, they would let one or two planes through, then send the next three or four back to the hold. That's how you break up a gaggle of planes that are too bunched up.

It just got worse and worse, until -- after 3 hours of holding -- we (and 100 of our closest friends) diverted. It was a mess.

Let's hope this year they follow their own procedures, and everything is back to normal.

We are counting the days!

Sent from my SM-T380 using Tapatalk
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I got in early on Saturday before the chaos hit! It was a mess.

Counting down myself ... 25 days, 20 hours until the show starts. Roughly 23 until I depart. It's easy for me to countdown. If you are on the ehotline email they send out, they're using one of my photos of the clipped-wing cub at the top!
 
The "Oshkosh Bound" window posters are now online at www.rstengineering.com and click on the OSHKOSH link. Lots of other goodies also. Forum notes will be posted as soon as I get off my @$$ and write them up.

Countdown to Oshkosh '19: 22 Days 21 Hours 38 Min. 07 Sec.

Jim
 

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One of the questions my pilot friends ask me often is: "Why haven't you been at Oshkosh before?" The short answer is there is a competing event every year during that very same week, and I try to answer the question in this new video in more detail - and in a way meaningful to pilots.

 
Martin Pauly said:
One of the questions my pilot friends ask me often is: "Why haven't you been at Oshkosh before?" The short answer is there is a competing event every year during that very same week, and I try to answer the question in this new video in more detail - and in a way meaningful to pilots.

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Dude. Ragbrai? AKA, bikes and beer?

Oshkosh has bikes, beer, AND airplanes and pilots. Your arguments are irrelevant. :p

Glad to hear you've come to your senses. ;)
 
Daytonabch04 said:
So I’ll ask the stupid question...you shut down, run out, put the plywood down then start up taxi on them and shut down again? Or can you just pull the plane on the plywood on the grass? It make it much heavier/harder?
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I parked. Got out, pulled the plane up on the wood. My plane was light as I burned 4 hours of fuel getting there. I have also head some use those things you set under a gutter spout.
 
Isn't it better to push the plane back up on the plywood? Trying to pull heavy plane in soft grass up onto a hard surface makes my back ache just thinking about it.
 
Juliet Hotel said:
Isn't it better to push the plane back up on the plywood? Trying to pull heavy plane in soft grass up onto a hard surface makes my back ache just thinking about it.
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Way easier to pull it forward than push it back—been there done that. The former is generally a solo operation while the latter can take a crew.
 
Skip the plastic gutter downspouts and go with cheap, light, easily storable cutting boards. I got mine at Dollar General. Less bulky than the downspouts and leave you more space and available weight for other things to pack.
 
Sams club has some great cutting boards but you'll want to cut them in half (they are huge). They cut easily with a circular or table saw.
 
I'm scoping out the lay of the land, never been...yet. Where is GAC? Is that the North 40?
 
download the AirVenture 2019 app....the schedule and maps are all there.

I like to choose the events for each day....as the week progresses I have choices of activities and events throughout the week. I'm sure not to miss anything this way. There is soo much to do....and soo many speakers all week.
 
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Per the Airventure website, "large or oversized" backpacks are prohibited. I was planning on wearing my Camelbak, which at best is a medium sized backpack. Will they give me a hard time about it? Photo below on a smaller sized human.

p5pb13631835.jpg
 
Groundpounder said:
Per the Airventure website, "large or oversized" backpacks are prohibited. I was planning on wearing my Camelbak, which at best is a medium sized backpack. Will they give me a hard time about it? Photo below on a smaller sized human.

p5pb13631835.jpg
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You'll be fine with that. The only 2 entry areas where I've seen anyone give a crap (and even then its pretty minimal) is the main entrance and the fly-market entrance across from the Red Barn. Everywhere else I could have been humping the ruck from my airborne days and no one would have batted an eye.
 
tsts4 said:
You'll be fine with that. The only 2 entry areas where I've seen anyone give a crap (and even then its pretty minimal) is the main entrance and the fly-market entrance across from the Red Barn. Everywhere else I could have been humping the ruck from my airborne days and no one would have batted an eye.
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Excellent, thanks!
 
Question about early AM arrivals - about what time does the traffic really start to pick up?

The NOTAM requests slower aircraft to reach Fisk by 700-730. It also says no overtaking, I'm OK with slow flight, but if it just won't work, the NOTAM says to break off and return to Ripon - my initial thought would be to make a right turn out to avoid any traffic over Rush Lake, does that make sense or am I missing something?
 
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Matthew said:
Question about early AM arrivals - about what time does the traffic really start to pick up?

The NOTAM requests slower aircraft to reach Fisk by 700-730. It also says no overtaking, I'm OK with slow flight, but if it just won't work, the NOTAM says to break off and return to Ripon - my initial thought would be to make a right turn out to avoid any traffic over the Rush Lake, dos that make sense or am I missing something?
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Last year, they told everyone between Ripon and Fisk to turn left and start over. I don't remember if there's a preferred direction when you break off on your own instead of at ATC direction.

Slow flight on the Fisk arrival stinks. You have to maintain visual separation from an airplane in front of you at the same altitude. If you are flying just above the stall, it is really hard to keep the plane in front of you in sight with your high deck angle. This happened to me last year the first time I made it past Ripon. I had to lean forward and crane my neck to see the plane I was following over my glare shield, since he was going about 75 knots instead of 90. That lasted until another plane dove in front of me from above, causing ATC to make us both break it off and divert for the night since they were closing the airport.

I think it would be better to just go 90 knots and give extra space to the plane in front of you if it is a slower plane. That works as long as people aren't being absolutely stupid and cutting in line, so you can leave extra space in front without someone jumping in and ruining the entire thing.
 
Matthew said:
Question about early AM arrivals - about what time does the traffic really start to pick up?
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No telling. These are GA aircraft. They don't operate on a set schedule. Folks show up when they do. Sometimes it's not so bad, sometimes nuts. Last year was the worst any of us have ever seen.

Matthew said:
The NOTAM requests slower aircraft to reach Fisk by 700-730. It also says no overtaking, I'm OK with slow flight, but if it just won't work, the NOTAM says to break off and return to Ripon - my initial thought would be to make a right turn out to avoid any traffic over the Rush Lake, dos that make sense or am I missing something?
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If you can't maintain 90 knots there is a higher approach for faster movers. The one problem that always occurs is guys do the approach in airplanes that can't do 90 knots firewalled. If you wind up behind one of those and start gaining, all you can do is peel off to the right, do a lap around one of the lakes and try again. My first Oshkosh I tried to stay behind one and wound up in a cross controlled stall. Frightening, but wound up uneventful. If things look that nuts peel off and land at another airport, there are a bunch nearby. Honestly, I don't have any problems getting in most years, and I'm often alone. Go when it's good for you, be on your A game and be prepared to have a ball.
 
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