OS X Lion

9128cc78-b433-46e4-94e0-6d461accf183.jpg
 
Heh! Yeah, I just had a swig of the koolaid.
 
Not me. But I almost never take the first release. I almost always wait until at least the first update.
 
My older son upgraded today. My younger son went to the Apple Store and played with it - was not impressed enough to upgrade yet. Me? I have my hands full with Linux and Oracle patches for the next few days to even think about it. I upgrade when I have to, not "just because it's there".
 
I'll probably upgrade mine when I have the time. Will post with the results.
 
You need to re-download Xcode after installing Lion.

Launchpad & stateful application support appear to be the beginning of morphing osx into ios.

Mission Control isn't half bad.

There appear to be some nice additions under the hood, most notably, the application sandboxing/privilege separation stuff. I'm hoping TRIM support is fully baked, so I can drop in an SSD.

Auto save = pleasant VMS flashbacks.
Per user screen sharing = pleasant Windows 2000 flashbacks.
Fullscreen apps = pleasant Amiga flashbacks.
Fullscreen Terminal = pleasant Sun flashbacks.
Resize from any corner = pleasant X11 flashbacks.
 
Mouse scrolling is backwards by default to match iOS. So, you're moving the page rather than the scroll bar. It takes some getting used to, but I'm going to give it a shot at least for a while.

Multiple desktops are arranged in a line from left to right, instead of in a box. I didn't like this at first, but the way you multi-touch swipe between desktops makes it pretty cool. You also can't anymore drag windows between desktops, you now have to open Mission Control and move the window there.

Swiping to the left of your first desktop opens the dashboard, much like it would open the search pane in iOS.

AirDrop looks fantastic, but I haven't had a chance to actually try it yet. It lets you wirelessly transfer files to a nearby computer using WiFi without having to be on the same network first.

When you restart, the OS will auto relaunch all your applications. With Mac designed apps, they will restore your state. I'm using Chrome and OpenOffice, so all I get is blank new windows on restart, and at this point I would almost wish it just wouldn't open anything at all. Luckily, I almost never have to reboot, so it's not much of an issue.

On a cosmetic level, there are a few increased font sizes, especially in the Finder. Scroll bars are re-designed to look more like iOS, and buttons are less rounded.
 
My son did the upgrade while I was out flying this week. I kind of wished he'd waited. There have been a few issues. We're unable to get on our server via our VPN. It's gone up about 3 levels in AppleCare so far withou resolution. My QuickBooks locked up when trying to save a document as a .PDF. That never happened before. I chose to switch Mail back to the old look. AirDisplay's video driver won't work on my vintage iMac. I'll just have to see about the other changes.

Oh yeah. I had to "fix" the upside down mouse business.
 
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My daughter (23) upgraded and the whole system went TU. The genius bar folks have decided the HD is toast... what they are calling a coincidence.

My daughter did a complete backup before the upgrade, so no data lost.

-Skip
 
I upgrade my MacBook pro with little to no issues - still need to do my iMac.
 
bluesky74656 said:
Mouse scrolling is backwards by default to match iOS. So, you're moving the page rather than the scroll bar. It takes some getting used to, but I'm going to give it a shot at least for a while.
...
Click to expand...

You can reverse that behavior in System Preferences. (Don't have it yet, but I've been watching all of the review Vidcasts.)

http://macmost.com/lion-gestures.html
http://macmost.com/printable-mac-gestures-guide-for-lion.html

I'll be getting a Macbook Air *real-soon-now* - by next Spring, maybe after the next refresh - and I'll be selling my Macbook Pro.

Sadly, every current Mac I have keeps locking up the UI, I think mostly due to Chrome, but I'm going to have a new one (not the Air) starting now.

The local miracle is that my "I will never buy a Mac (or iPhone). I hate Apple." neighbor is resigned that she's getting one, and it's not because of Lion, but because everybody keeps telling her stuff just works. (Heh. Not for me, but I keep hanging on to elderly hardware.) She bought a new, screaming, HP laptop and found out that ATI hasn't baked the OpenGL drivers yet. We'll visit the Apple store for a Lion presentation and I suspect she'll walk out with a full loaded 27" iMac.

That new 27" Thunderbolt monitor is the wayest of cool, too. You'd have a impossibly packed docking station at the end of one cable. I'd like to see some Apple blog try daisy chaining 6-10 monitors together to see it work - ironically while Lion doesn't support multiple displays too well at present.
 
GeorgeC said:
There appear to be some nice additions under the hood, most notably, the application sandboxing/privilege separation stuff. I'm hoping TRIM support is fully baked, so I can drop in an SSD.
Click to expand...

Bummer:

Code: 
        INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3:

          Capacity: 120.03 GB (120,034,123,776 bytes)
          Model: INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3                     
          Revision: 4PC10302
          Serial Number: CVPR113002YL120LGN  
          Native Command Queuing: Yes
          Queue Depth: 32
          Removable Media: No
          Detachable Drive: No
          BSD Name: disk0
          Medium Type: Solid State
          TRIM Support: No
 
GeorgeC said:
Bummer:

Code: 
        INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3:

          Capacity: 120.03 GB (120,034,123,776 bytes)
          Model: INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3                     
          Revision: 4PC10302
          Serial Number: CVPR113002YL120LGN  
          Native Command Queuing: Yes
          Queue Depth: 32
          Removable Media: No
          Detachable Drive: No
          BSD Name: disk0
          Medium Type: Solid State
          TRIM Support: No
Click to expand...

Is that the SSD that came with the computer?
 
I had to edit a file to turn trim on with my drive. wasn't that hard. plenty of instructions out there.
 
Bob Noel said:
Is that the SSD that came with the computer?
Click to expand...
Nope, third party.
jesse said:
I had to edit a file to turn trim on with my drive. wasn't that hard. plenty of instructions out there.
Click to expand...
Yeah, it's an easy tweak, I was just hoping it would Just Work out of the box.
 
GeorgeC said:
Bummer:

Code: 
        INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3:

          Capacity: 120.03 GB (120,034,123,776 bytes)
          Model: INTEL SSDSA2CW120G3                     
          Revision: 4PC10302
          Serial Number: CVPR113002YL120LGN  
          Native Command Queuing: Yes
          Queue Depth: 32
          Removable Media: No
          Detachable Drive: No
          BSD Name: disk0
          Medium Type: Solid State
          TRIM Support: No
Click to expand...

This with Snow Leopard:

APPLE SSD TS128C:

Capacity: 121.33 GB (121,332,826,112 bytes)
Model: APPLE SSD TS128C
[snip]
Medium Type: Solid State
TRIM Support: Yes
 
Pulled the plug on Lion on the office. Went back to SL. Too many issues for us. Maybe next release.
 
bluesky74656 said:
Multiple desktops are arranged in a line from left to right, instead of in a box. I didn't like this at first, but the way you multi-touch swipe between desktops makes it pretty cool. You also can't anymore drag windows between desktops, you now have to open Mission Control and move the window there.
Click to expand...

Really? Grrr. I don't think I like that. I run four desktops, partially because I can switch from any desktop to any other desktop with a single keystroke and not have to go "through" any of the ones I'm not interested in.

I also don't like the no-dragging thing.

Hopefully it works a bit better than in Snow Leopard. For example (in Snow Leopard), often when switching desktops and the app I was working in on the one I switched from isn't in the one I switched to, the frontmost app in the one I switched to doesn't have a window selected. Maybe there's a reason for that, but I haven't figured it out if there is. Also, I'd like to be able to switch to any app I'm running on any desktop within the desktop I'm working in and create a new window, rather than have it switch to a desktop where that app has a window and then have to drag the new window to the desktop I wanted it in.

Although, I guess if I did that, when I switched to Mail, iTunes, or iPhoto (which I have set to be restricted to desktop #3 only) I'd have to manually switch desktops too. Hmmm. :idea:

Lance F said:
Pulled the plug on Lion on the office. Went back to SL. Too many issues for us. Maybe next release.
Click to expand...

I was going to upgrade, and decided to be a bit more cautious. I'm glad I did.

But, here's what anyone looking to upgrade to Lion should do: Under the Apple menu, choose "About This Mac" and then click the "More Info" button. That'll open up Apple System Profiler. Click on "Applications" on the left and sort by Kind. Anything listed as "Classic" already wasn't running if you had an Intel box I think, and anything listed as "PowerPC" will cease to be supported under Lion. So, make sure you have upgraded/replaced all those software packages prior to the upgrade.
 
So if I interpret this all correctly, Holier than Thou Apple has released a crappy update, similar to Microsoft? Wow!

I already had noticed that my iPad and iPhone keep getting security bug fix updates. So Apple comes down to earth finally.


David
 
flhrci said:
So if I interpret this all correctly, Holier than Thou Apple has released a crappy update, similar to Microsoft? Wow!
Click to expand...

I wouldn't call it "crappy" - They're just cutting the cord on supporting software that hasn't been compiled in the last 6 years (IE, it does not run natively on the Intel hardware that Apple has been selling since early 2006). There are lots of neat new features in Lion - But I need to find the time to download updates for some of my less-used software before I take the plunge.

I would call it a testament to Apple that they supported obsolete software this long, as opposed to Microsoft, who purposely makes things obsolete as often as possible to force you to buy more.

Oh, and let's not forget that the new version of Mac OS X is $29 even though all the server features are included. Compare with Windows 7 which starts at $80 for a "Home Premium Upgrade", goes through $220 for "Ultimate" and on up into four figures for the server versions.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
...But, here's what anyone looking to upgrade to Lion should do: Under the Apple menu, choose "About This Mac" and then click the "More Info" button. That'll open up Apple System Profiler. Click on "Applications" on the left and sort by Kind. Anything listed as "Classic" already wasn't running if you had an Intel box I think, and anything listed as "PowerPC" will cease to be supported under Lion. So, make sure you have upgraded/replaced all those software packages prior to the upgrade.
Click to expand...

OK. Nice to know. You can click on the [Kind] column header and see which are which easily.

I will not give up Bejeweled and Alchemy! NEVER, NEVER, NEVER! :rolleyes:

I think I can live with it. I'll get new versions of the few PowerPC apps that I'd use.
 

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flyingcheesehead said:
...the last 6 years (IE, it does not run natively on the Intel hardware that Apple has been selling since early 2006)...

I would call it a testament to Apple that they supported obsolete software this long, as opposed to Microsoft, who purposely makes things obsolete as often as possible to force you to buy more.
Click to expand...

Excuse me while I fire up StarCraft (3/31/1998) and Unreal Tournament (1999) in 2011 on my Windows 7 machine. :goofy:

flyingcheesehead said:
...Oh, and let's not forget that the new version of Mac OS X is $29 even though all the server features are included. Compare with Windows 7 which starts at $80 for a "Home Premium Upgrade", goes through $220 for "Ultimate" and on up into four figures for the server versions.
Click to expand...

Windows XP in 2001 cost what, ~$150 or came with a PC. 10 years later you can buy an upgrade to Windows Home 7 Premium for $80. Obiously an upgrade from XP to Vista to Win7 would have cost you more. So best case would be an $80 upgrade 10 years later.

I can't talk to the server licensing because I am not a certified Microsoft licensing expert (yes, they do have them, and yes you need it to understand it) so Apple wins there by default! :wink2:

And Kent...now that I have my license and I'll be starting the checkout process in the 182 next month, we need to plan a trip!
 
Reklats said:
I can't talk to the server licensing because I am not a certified Microsoft licensing expert (yes, they do have them, and yes you need it to understand it) so Apple wins there by default! :wink2:
Click to expand...

Oh. My. God. Really? :yikes:

And Kent...now that I have my license and I'll be starting the checkout process in the 182 next month, we need to plan a trip!
Click to expand...

Excellent! E-mail me with suggested schedules/destinations. :)
 
flyingcheesehead said:
I would call it a testament to Apple that they supported obsolete software this long, as opposed to Microsoft, who purposely makes things obsolete as often as possible to force you to buy more.
Click to expand...

We are talking about the same Microsoft that has basically built their entire operating system on the back of an operating system they wrote in the 90s, right?

The same operating system in which I can still drop to a command prompt and run many of the same applications that ran in 1994?

The same operating system that includes a DLL wrapper that will run 16 bit applications on a 32 bit (and possibly 64 bit) operating systems, right?

And the same operating system that has had so much irritating backwards compatibility that forwards compatibility has been a pain in the ass to maintain?
 
Agree - Microsoft has been *WAY* better about maintaining backwards compatibility with super old ass software, unlike Apple.

That said. I wish Microsoft wouldn't be so insistent on doing so. As it's caused a lot of issues over the years.

That said. I've had little to no problems with OSX Lion. The only problem I've had is that my TimeMachine quit working which uses an unofficial unsupported Linux machine running netatalk, so I'm not surprised.
 
flhrci said:
So if I interpret this all correctly, Holier than Thou Apple has released a crappy update, similar to Microsoft? Wow!
Click to expand...

Sometimes you have to clear out deadwood. :)

flhrci said:
I already had noticed that my iPad and iPhone keep getting security bug fix updates. So Apple comes down to earth finally.
Click to expand...

And Microsoft is releasing 22 patches for Win7 on "Patch Tuesday" next week. Big whoop. I'm sure that's only half of the reported ones... judging by my SANS newsletters and forums.

There's not an OS on the planet that isn't under constant security attack now by the people who want to add your CPU to their list of BotNet Zombies. I actually expected *more* Apple vulnerabilities this week, considering that BlackHat is going on, but it's been relatively quiet.

The wireless vulnerability in thousands of insulin pumps where a drive-by hacker could literally kill someone, is far more serious, out of all the stuff I've seen from BlackHat this week. The Siemens 7 vulnerabilities for SCADA and control systems are awfully (pun intended) gruesome, too.

Metasploit is making things a bit too "easy" for the less talented security folks, and making really difficult exploits much simpler too. Quite the tool.

The economy isn't in a good position to have a really security conscious OS pop up yet... and it's going to take a LOT of money. The entire OS industry is hack on top of hack (in the traditional sense of "hack" vs. "crack") right now. It doesn't really matter if the branding on the door is Microsoft or Apple, they're all screwed right now.

Every bug an OS engineer writes makes probably 1000 network security jobs. Maybe that's the only silver lining to this giant storm cloud. ;)
 
denverpilot said:
Every bug an OS engineer writes makes probably 1000 network security jobs.
Click to expand...

You're welcome.

Back on the original topic:

I'm super fried with Apple -- the only reason I have a Mac at all is so that I can compile iOS applications (you cannot compile for iPhones from Windows or Linux).

Naturally, I run rEFIt, and have Linux on my MacBook Pro as well. When trying to upgrade to Lion (so I can get the newest version of XCode), it refuses to install on a drive which contains a Linux partition.

ARRRGHGHHGHRGH! :mad2:

~ Christopher
 
Aw, anyone smart enough to have Linux on the box will have that fixed I'm about an hour. ;)

No biggie at all. Backup/image Linux and remove it, install, put it back. Tricking an installer is child's play.

Why run Linux native on the hardware? Easier to put it in a virtual anyway. Maybe time for some P2V action? :) Got a special reason to run native?
 
denverpilot said:
Aw, anyone smart enough to have Linux on the box will have that fixed I'm about an hour.
Click to expand...

You're 100% right, of course. It's not an impossible task (not even "hard"). I just don't want to do it.

denverpilot said:
Why run Linux native on the hardware? Easier to put it in a virtual anyway. Maybe time for some P2V action? :) Got a special reason to run native?
Click to expand...

In no particular order:

1) Running in a native environment is slightly faster. As it turns out I don't really need that speed -- but in theory it's there if I do need it.
2) I run IRAF a lot, and the prevailing wisdom is that it doesn't play well with virtualization -- although I've never actually tried it to find out.

~ Christopher
 
There is an excellent and INCREDIBLY extensive review (19 pages!!!) at Ars Technica: http://arstechnica.com/apple/reviews/2011/07/mac-os-x-10-7.ars/ Probably a good read for anyone who hasn't upgraded, might upgrade, will upgrade, or has already upgraded. Very interesting so far (I've only made it to page 7).

Also, Apple release 10.7.1 today. So, those who always wait for an update first, it's your turn. ;)

jesse said:
Agree - Microsoft has been *WAY* better about maintaining backwards compatibility with super old ass software, unlike Apple.
That said. I wish Microsoft wouldn't be so insistent on doing so. As it's caused a lot of issues over the years.
Click to expand...

I guess I should call it "transitional compatibility." Apple is VERY good at keeping things compatible with no headaches for 4-5 years, and then they move along. Probably a good thing, or now they'd be trying to support an API that no longer exists (Classic Mac OS, or the transitional Carbon API) and be going backwards through two hardware compatiblity layers (68K->PowerPC->Intel) as well.

I still haven't upgraded because I actually do have some software that's still PowerPC-only - I just haven't had the time to download new versions yet.
 
Thought to myself today, okay -- this Lion thing other than VPN's and DNS is going pretty well, and I'm starting to really like "true full screen" on the applications that do it... so I thought, "Hey, I remember they significantly lowered the price on Lion OSX Server, maybe I should throw it on the old MacBook and play a bit."

Then I went and read the reviews. Wow. What WERE they thinking? Take a nice powerful server and cripple it with a barely-working GUI to replace the GUI that was leaps and bounds ahead of any GUI made for a Unix-like OS's server, ever?

Of course, they lowered the price on that too... what is it, $50 down from $499... or something close to that. Significant order of magnitude price drop, almost as if they're apologizing for the awful quality of the new stuff.

You apparently can load the old tools onto it and get most of the functionality back, but there's some huge gotchas... like the old OSX Server used to be able to act as a Domain Controller for Winderz machines, if you wanted that. The new one with the new Samba code, simply can't. It just got dropped completely. So much for that nice single-signon setup you had if you upgrade without checking out the reviews.

They also sucked out and killed the Quicktime Streaming server with no replacement. So much for that fancy Podcast Creator in the Snow Leopard version... that would automatically run whatever you uploaded through all the proper CODECs for playback at different bitrates and sizes. Crippled it without a streaming server.

I thought Lion was a bit "wacky" but had some neat ideas that move forward the desktop... but Apple really took a leap backward in servers... no more XServe, no more XRAID, crippled the most useful stuff in Lion Server and dumbed it waaaaay down... but you can install the old tools from Snow Leopard server to get *some* of it back...

They also apparently won't let you use a self-signed encryption certificate or create one from the GUI for the VPN anymore. It just gives you a way to upload a paid-for cert from the GUI, as far as I could figure out.

Whisky Tango Foxtrot, Apple? Wow. Trashed a good product. Seems like the place to be and to stay if you want to run their server products is Snow Leopard Server... hmmm.

Most of the above was learned through another exhaustive review at ARS Technica on Server...

Oh, by the way... I will admit after only a week with Lion, I'm COMPLETELY enamored with "Reader" mode in the browser (getting rid of clicking page after page of a website to read an article so they can get their ad placement in... ugh...), and the new Reading Pane for tossing stuff I want to read later into... nice enhancements on Safari. Really nice.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
There is an excellent and INCREDIBLY extensive review (19 pages!!!) at Ars Technica: http://arstechnica.com/apple/reviews/2011/07/mac-os-x-10-7.ars/ Probably a good read for anyone who hasn't upgraded, might upgrade, will upgrade, or has already upgraded. Very interesting so far (I've only made it to page 7).

Also, Apple release 10.7.1 today. So, those who always wait for an update first, it's your turn. ;)
Click to expand...
I upgraded both my computers today, a Macbook Air and an iMac. The most painful part was the download time, about 7 hours for each. The most obvious difference is the reverse scrolling but I am already used to it after only a day. Some of the other gestures are somewhat different too. I didn't have any compatibility problems but I don't run anything too exotic and both computers are less than 6 months old. I think I only had to download a few updates from Apple and I had to download another version of Java or was it Flash, or maybe both. We'll see. I haven't gone through every program yet but it seems to have turned out fine.
 
The reverse scrolling is settable. In mouse stuff, switch off the "natural scrolling" checkbox.

I haven't found Lion all that useful, even though it was only $29. Full-screen applications don't work on dual-monitor setups, and the new system indexer is constantly indexing and eating CPU on the MacBook Pro.

Probably the main reason to upgrade is the new Mail.App. They did a nice job on that.

When disconnected from an additional monitor, the full screen stuff works well.

On wife's machine, she's stuck with one Rosetta App (Quicken) so no upgrade to the iMac yet.

Will probably wipe/reload the old MacBook to stick on the radio shack desk or in the traveling radio box.
 
I want to eventually use iCloud and I want to install another program that requires Lion. Besides, as you say, it's only $29, for two computers. I have no problem with the reverse scrolling. I'm flexible and adapt easily. :)
 
Heh. Yeah, iCloud may be useful. I was already paying for MobileMe so I had the most useful parts.
 
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