Orlando DA-42 taxi fatality

Jeez that’s terrible


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Ed Haywood said:
I assume the roof crumpled? If so, not a ringing endorsement for crashworthiness of the Twin Star.
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To be fair, that's probably an atypical crash profile. You gotta make your tradeoffs to account for the majority.
 
I agree, this is not the typical accident.

Personally I think any aircraft that needs the canopy to be lifted to exit is not a good idea.
 
asicer said:
To be fair, that's probably an atypical crash profile. You gotta make your tradeoffs to account for the majority.
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And I would argue that a fixed gear airplane coming to rest upside down is very typical. With any off-airport landing or runway departure, that is a possible outcome. A quick Google Images search for "plane crash upside down" yields dozens of photos of GA aircraft on their backs. Notably, the high wing aircraft captions usually say "pilot uninjured."

Common enough for low wing aircraft to justify a roll bar or roof cage structure sufficient to protect the occupants and facilitate egress.
 
LesGawlik said:
60+ mile an hour wind gust on takeoff roll.
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Close to daily occurrence here in central Florida this time of year. The gusts, not the attempted takeoff in one. Poor weather knowledge by the pilot not anticipating the gust front that preceeds a thunderstorm. They thought they were going to sneak out before it hit.
 
Ed Haywood said:
And I would argue that a fixed gear airplane coming to rest upside down is very typical. With any off-airport landing or runway departure, that is a possible outcome. A quick Google Images search for "plane crash upside down" yields dozens of photos of GA aircraft on their backs. Notably, the high wing aircraft captions usually say "pilot uninjured."

Common enough for low wing aircraft to justify a roll bar or roof cage structure sufficient to protect the occupants and facilitate egress.
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The PA-38 came with a roll bar
 
Diamond website says they have a roll cage structure. Perhaps some engineering review is warranted?

"Each Diamond aircraft incorporates an integral cabin surrounding composite “roll cage” structure, which is stiff and strong to provide survival space and protection in case of impact."
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To be fair, I haven't seen any photos of the crash, so don't know if the fatality was due to roof collapse or some other factor. But this guy's noggin does seem somewhat exposed:

csm_Safety_Cell_DA42-VI_1e58b31eb5.jpg
 
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Everyone eyeballs these sleek newer aircraft so envious, all I can ever imagine is being trapped in one.
 
It might have been poor wx knowledge on the part of the pilot, but it would have gotten me too. I would not expect a 60+ kt gust. In that wx, I'd be in the hangar.
 
LesGawlik said:
60+ mile an hour wind gust on takeoff roll.
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Is that what they are reporting? Early report I heard was they were waiting it out, before attempting a takeoff.

EDIT: "The plane was holding for takeoff on a taxiway while the weather was unfavorable, according to a spokesperson for the airport."
 
TrueCourse said:
Is that what they are reporting? Early report I heard was they were waiting it out, before attempting a takeoff.

EDIT: "The plane was holding for takeoff on a taxiway while the weather was unfavorable, according to a spokesperson for the airport."
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Imagine just sitting there parked, and getting killed by wind. Crazy.
 
Zeldman said:
I agree, this is not the typical accident.

Personally I think any aircraft that needs the canopy to be lifted to exit is not a good idea.
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You aren’t wrong. Of our club aircraft the Tiger is my favorite. But I’ve always thought that in the event of a forced landing I would want to have the canopy opened and something wedged in there to prevent a situation where it wouldn’t be locked shut. Then I remember pilots forget to bring in flaps in emergency situations. But something like this? Jeez. Truly awful.
 
Ed Haywood said:
And I would argue that a fixed gear airplane coming to rest upside down is very typical. With any off-airport landing or runway departure, that is a possible outcome. .
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In support of my statement I will offer this photo of a DA-42 after an off-airport landing in May. No injuries.

KathrynsReport.jpg
 
It wasn’t that long ago I landed at Goodyear Airport with the Lance.

I had just beat in an approaching microburst, which looked simply like any other rain storm at the time.

Once I got on the ground and turned off the runway to the taxiway I realized I was in trouble. The water was washing across the taxiway at such a rate that I could no longer discern the asphalt from the grass.

at one point the Stall horn went off and my wife asked with great alarm, “what the hell was that?”

My mind was already writing the accident report. But I simply said to myself, not today mother nature, not today. We sat on what I knew was taxiway with power on and the control wheel forward and let the storm pass. It didn’t take very long. But it seemed like forever
 
From the comments on Kathryn's Report:

The CFI who survived had his seat position slightly more backward, so he was protected by the bar, as it was right over his head. The other person had his seat all the way forward and was thus not protected by the bar. The seat position in a roll over is quite important in a DA40 or DA 42 and a few inches difference in the adjustment of the seat can mean the difference between life and death.​
 
DA-40 and DA-42 share much of the fuselage structure. And the rear window in both is an emergency exit in case of the tip up front canopy being blocked. That said, I don’t know why the fatality in this case; crushed structure, popped their restraints loose because of the hold, or some other issue. It’s really impossible to tell from those pictures.
 
Ed Haywood said:
From the comments on Kathryn's Report:

The CFI who survived had his seat position slightly more backward, so he was protected by the bar, as it was right over his head. The other person had his seat all the way forward and was thus not protected by the bar. The seat position in a roll over is quite important in a DA40 or DA 42 and a few inches difference in the adjustment of the seat can mean the difference between life and death.​
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Neither the DA-40 nor the DA-42 have adjustable seats. The pedals move.
 
jsstevens said:
Neither the DA-40 nor the DA-42 have adjustable seats. The pedals move.
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Well I guess that Kathryn's comment is BS then.

Edit: a little browsing on owner's forum indicates reclining front seat backrests are an option on DA-42.
 
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Ed Haywood said:
Well I guess that comment is BS then.

Edit: a little browsing on owner's forum indicates reclining front seat backrests are an option on DA-42.
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That I was not aware of. They weren’t on the one I flew.
 
jsstevens said:
That I was not aware of. They weren’t on the one I flew.
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Gotta pay extra. The European market calls it the platinum package. Which in American English translates to "if you have to ask, you can't afford it."
 
Any idea what the weather conditions and ATIS report was at the time of incident? I never thought a plane would flip over, once waited out high winds in the hangar but once gusts are in the 30s I thought it was manageable enough to taxi. Wasn’t interested in trying with 50+kts gusts.
 
jsstevens said:
DA-40 and DA-42 share much of the fuselage structure. And the rear window in both is an emergency exit in case of the tip up front canopy being blocked. That said, I don’t know why the fatality in this case; crushed structure, popped their restraints loose because of the hold, or some other issue. It’s really impossible to tell from those pictures.
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One apparent difference in photos from the ORL accident relative to others posted on this thread is that the tail structure appears to have been crushed. Not sure how causal that may be, though.
 
mandm said:
Any idea what the weather conditions and ATIS report was at the time of incident? I never thought a plane would flip over, once waited out high winds in the hangar but once gusts are in the 30s I thought it was manageable enough to taxi. Wasn’t interested in trying with 50+kts gusts.
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ATIS supposedly peaked at 50ish. Not at all surprising. People talk about "microbursts" like it is some mysterious freak event. But every thunderstorm has a gust front. The taller the storm, the more violent the gust. Late every afternoon in central FL, I step out of the hangar to cool off in the blast of cold air from passing T cells.

But hard to put this entirely on the pilots. They taxied out, saw a fast moving cell was nearby, and elected to wait it out. Could be they were pointed in the wrong direction, or had incorrect anti-wind inputs? With those long, high lift glider wings, an aileron in the wrong direction might be enough to lift a wing over. Likewise for a tailwind with the elevator up. Seems to me if you weather vaned so nose is directly into the wind, you should be able to handle a gust of nearly any force.

Regardless, an aircraft should be crashworthy enough that a stationary event does not result in a fatality. IMO they just tried to make the airplane a little too sexy.
 
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