Order of Ratings

[jesse]

Right now I have 113 hours, I think I have about 46 hours or so of cross country.

So as soon as I get the $$ saved up getting my instrument is obviously the next step.

Then I am curious is it better to get the multiengine before or after the commerical?

How many hours is this typically? Any idea what the going rate is for rental? Around $200 /hr or so?

...Just got to thinking about that at work today. Really it's no hurry to get any multiengine stuff as I'll never be flying any. I dont' know of a place around here that rents them either.

What's bothering me is I can easily have my instrument around 170 hours or so.. What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

 

[Dave Krall CFII]

Right now I have 113 hours, I think I have about 46 hours or so of cross country.

So as soon as I get the $$ saved up getting my instrument is obviously the next step.

Then I am curious is it better to get the multiengine before or after the commerical?

How many hours is this typically? Any idea what the going rate is for rental? Around $200 /hr or so?

...Just got to thinking about that at work today. Really it's no hurry to get any multiengine stuff as I'll never be flying any. I dont' know of a place around here that rents them either.

What's bothering me is I can easily have my instrument around 170 hours or so.. What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

Get your Seaplane ticket for one thing (5-10 hours)

and any other fun flying you may like.

 

[jdwatson]

I did Instrument, then Commercial. Next will be Multi followed by Seaplane

 

[poadeleted20]

Then I am curious is it better to get the multiengine before or after the commerical?

Depends on your objective. If you're planning to buy and fly your own ME plane, then getting the ME next makes sense. If you're working towards a career, getting the commercial ASEL followed by the CFI-ASE makes more sense.

What's bothering me is I can easily have my instrument around 170 hours or so.. What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

Depends on your goals. Just remember, though, that any additional rating rides you take at the Private level will have to be repeated at the Commercial level. So if you get your AMEL and ASES ratings on your Private while building hours for the Commercial, you'll have to take three different Commercial practical tests -- one for each rating. Yes, the last two will involve less than the initial ride, but who wants to take six practical tests when you can take four and end up with the same result (C-ASMEL-ASES-IA)? Your time would be better spent adding skills that do not require retesting at the Commercial level, like your tailwheel, complex, and HP ATE's. Note that the complex ATE training in particular can be used to meet your Commercial dual training requirements.

 

[gismo]

Jesse AFaIK, the best bang for the buck is Inst, Commercial, AMEL, with CFI-ASEL and CFII right after the commercial if you want to build time by instructing.

If you have low cost access to a twin, then you might consider getting the AMEL before the commercial and get your commercial AMEL and add Commercial-ASEL after that, but if you have to pay the going rate for a multi trainer, I'd save that for last. One other subtle variation would be to get your AMEL before doing the commercial-ASEL which would allow you to log multi time if you come across any opportunities to handle the controls of a twin (like if you fly with me).

If you're looking for something fun (and cheap) go for a glider rating. Even if you only go as far as solo, you will learn a lot of useful things that you can apply to your airplane flying and you will definitely become a better more well rounded pilot. You're close enough to Stanton to train there and unless things have changed, once you join the soaring club, the instruction is free, you can get "free" airplane hours flying tows and the total cost of the glider rating will probably be a small fraction of what you paid to get your PPL ASEL.

How many hours is this typically? Any idea what the going rate is for rental? Around $200 /hr or so?

Last time I looked you could rent a light-light twin for around $150 plus instructor. That was when fuel was more like $2/gal so it's probably higher now. Also I happen to know a CFI who has an Apache that she's using to build multi time in. I'm not sure if she's insured for training in that, but she might be willing to give you your multi rating relatively inexpensively if it could be worked out insurance wise.

...Just got to thinking about that at work today. Really it's no hurry to get any multiengine stuff as I'll never be flying any. I dont' know of a place around here that rents them either.

You will need twin time eventually if you want to work for one of the regional carriers, but unless you have access to one, getting the rating early could be a waste of money since the skills will deteriorate with disuse.

 

[jesse]

Jesse AFaIK, the best bang for the buck is Inst, Commercial, AMEL, with CFI-ASEL and CFII right after the commercial if you want to build time by instructing.

Yeah. That is pretty much what I figured.

If you have low cost access to a twin, then you might consider getting the AMEL before the commercial and get your commercial AMEL and add Commercial-ASEL after that, but if you have to pay the going rate for a multi trainer, I'd save that for last. One other subtle variation would be to get your AMEL before doing the commercial-ASEL which would allow you to log multi time if you come across any opportunities to handle the controls of a twin (like if you fly with me).

I can't even think of a time where I've seen someone with a twin in this area. Either I am blind or there are none. lol.

If you're looking for something fun (and cheap) go for a glider rating. Even if you only go as far as solo, you will learn a lot of useful things that you can apply to your airplane flying and you will definitely become a better more well rounded pilot. You're close enough to Stanton to train there and unless things have changed, once you join the soaring club, the instruction is free, you can get "free" airplane hours flying tows and the total cost of the glider rating will probably be a small fraction of what you paid to get your PPL ASEL.

Yeah the instruction was free. I looked at the information once but I remember the joining fee being pretty hefty which is what turned me off. I don't remember now what it was though.

You will need twin time eventually if you want to work for one of the regional carriers, but unless you have access to one, getting the rating early could be a waste of money since the skills will deteriorate with disuse.

That is pretty much what reminded me of it. I remember my CFI in a mad panic to get his 100 hours of twin time in the week of my checkride.. We were able to negotiate though. I just went with him and asked questions

Also I happen to know a CFI who has an Apache that she's using to build multi time in. I'm not sure if she's insured for training in that, but she might be willing to give you your multi rating relatively inexpensively if it could be worked out insurance wise.

I may be interested.. But like you mentioned the amount that I would actually fly one would be pretty minimal. I'm not sure how safe/proficent I would be after a few years.

Depends on your objective. If you're planning to buy and fly your own ME plane, then getting the ME next makes sense. If you're working towards a career, getting the commercial ASEL followed by the CFI-ASE makes more sense.

Hmm.. Maybe if I sold my car..and took out a loan I could get one of these:

... Airline interview:
"So what do you have for multiengine experiance?"

"Well I have about 1,000 hours in a *cough*kolb flyer*cough*"

"The door is right there. We will call you "


Thanks for all the information everyone.

 

[gismo]

When I was a member, the soaring club cost something like $600 to join, but you got 75% of that back when you quit. There were also monthly dues, but that didn't amount to much.

Here's a link to their membership rates:

http://www.soarmn.com/msc/membership_types.htm

 

[ScottM]

Right now I have 113 hours, I think I have about 46 hours or so of cross country.

So as soon as I get the $$ saved up getting my instrument is obviously the next step.

Then I am curious is it better to get the multiengine before or after the commerical?

How many hours is this typically? Any idea what the going rate is for rental? Around $200 /hr or so?

...Just got to thinking about that at work today. Really it's no hurry to get any multiengine stuff as I'll never be flying any. I dont' know of a place around here that rents them either.

What's bothering me is I can easily have my instrument around 170 hours or so.. What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

I think it depend on the type of lfying you are going to do or your goal. For me it made sense after my private to so my instrument ticket. But that was becasue I do a lot of XC flying and needed the instrument ticket to fly some of them.

I then was going to do my seaplane but becasue of some other issues I ended up doing the commercial instead. I plan on the seaplane this coming summer. I have no reason to do multi as I will not be flying such a plane. I think I would be wasting my money on that rating. YMMV

Get your Seaplane ticket for one thing (5-10 hours)
Then Commercial Seaplane (5-10 Hours)
and any other fun flying you may like.

Dave I have a commercial ticket now and was planning on adding the seaplane. If I just do one of those weekend course will it be a PP-ASES or does it add as a CP-ASES?

 

[Len Lanetti]

What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

During the time between my private and instrument rating and again between instrument rating and commercial license I kept lengthening the distances of my flights. I was always going to new places, gaining real world experience with flights away from home. Flying to what I call "the other side of the sectional" taught me a bunch of stuff, including:

• Keep a RON (remain over night) kit including fresh shirt, shorts and socks in your flight bag if you are flying out of sight of your home airport.
• Fronts can sometimes stall for a few days right at the eastern seaboard.
• Alternate airports should be near places with things to do.
• Large bodies of water nearby make airports easy to find but can cause fog in the morning.
• You can learn alot about weather by watching the Weather Channel for 3 days straight.
• You can never have too many flashlights.
• There is no need to waste energy trying to hand prop an Aztec.
• You can pull a cabin class twin out of a hanger without a tug if you don't mind getting a hernia.
• Some maintenance facilities will bill the FBO where you rented the aircraft, others want cash.
• If you have the money, stay at the nicer hotel.
• American Express...don't leave home without it.
• The time to learn what mountain obscuration really means is not while flying VFR in a West Virginia valley.

Len

 

[Henning]

Right now I have 113 hours, I think I have about 46 hours or so of cross country.

So as soon as I get the $$ saved up getting my instrument is obviously the next step.

Then I am curious is it better to get the multiengine before or after the commerical?

How many hours is this typically? Any idea what the going rate is for rental? Around $200 /hr or so?

...Just got to thinking about that at work today. Really it's no hurry to get any multiengine stuff as I'll never be flying any. I dont' know of a place around here that rents them either.

What's bothering me is I can easily have my instrument around 170 hours or so.. What am I supposed to do with the next 80 hours before I can take my commercial?

There is another consideration, I don't know if it applies to you since I don't know how much tax you pay. Understanding that outside of CFI, you'll need 500 hrs to get a job flying, 1000 for spraying or flying anything for pay IFR. So, how much does not having an instrument rating affect your flying? If you wait and just fly for 250 and get your commercial, then all rating costs in furtherance of your career from that point on are tax deductible. If you do the instrument and multi before the commercial, you can't deduct those.

If you are looking at the CFI route, then get the instrument now and in the time after that, work on all the commercial manuvers from both seats and study for CFI/FOI so you can possibly combine the rides. It'll be a long day, but doable if you can find an agreable DE who is also endorsed for initial CFI rides, heck, maybe the FSDO would even do it. Then get your ME/MEI at a rating mill, then tack on a II and fly. If you are going to college and have Airline aspirations, if you can at all swing it, buy a light twin and have it on the line at the schools program if possible and instruct in it, you might even make enough money to buy you that daily turkey sub, but you should be able to cover the costs of the plane and be able to build multi time on other peoples dime.

If you are planning on the family tradition of Ag flying, don't bother with the instrument rating, you'll never use it, at least not enough to stay safe.

 

[tonycondon]

Jesse,
All above advice is good. My progress was through a part 141 school. I got private, instrument, commercial multi and single. then CFI, CFII, MEI. works out to be the cheapest route. I would highly recommend adding on the glider rating. I did this after MEI. added commercial glider and CFIG. Besides the club in Stanton, there is also Red Wing Soaring in White Bear Lake and Cross Country Soaring. Don Ingraham runs Cross Country soaring and is a top notch instructor and pilot. Also, Bob Wander instructs there. He is quite literally the "Rod Machado" of soaring. He has written all of the training manuals used at many clubs across the country. If you have any questions, feel free to email me.