LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
Open cockpit flyers! What is the experience like vs closed cockpit?
Open cockpit?
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Shepherd
Final Approach
Stick your head out the car window while driving at 80 miles an hour.
It's the same experience, except not as noisy.
Airplanes are noisier.
And more fun.
It's the same experience, except not as noisy.
Airplanes are noisier.
And more fun.
SkyDog58
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Canis Non Grata
Relatively.
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Bro do you even lift
achording to who
I've flown with the canopy open on the Navion. It's noisy but not overly windy in the front seat. The rear seat gets most of the blast.
The only time I flew in a true open cockpit (maxair drifter), I also had a helmet on so it kind of detracted from the wind fieling (that and the drifter doesn't fly very fast). Great view though.
The only time I flew in a true open cockpit (maxair drifter), I also had a helmet on so it kind of detracted from the wind fieling (that and the drifter doesn't fly very fast). Great view though.
SixPapaCharlie
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FormerHangie
En-Route
I flew in one of these recently:
I was wearing a helmet and a headset, it's not particularly noisy that way. The windscreen keeps the wind blast off of your body, if your arms are way out on the control bar then it's breezy on them, plus if you're wearing short sleeves your arms with itch when you get back. Visibility is about 100,000 times better, as is the sensation of actually flying, as opposed to sitting inside of a mechanical device that may be flying, but you can't really tell because you have no sensation of movement.
Try it, you'll like it.
I was wearing a helmet and a headset, it's not particularly noisy that way. The windscreen keeps the wind blast off of your body, if your arms are way out on the control bar then it's breezy on them, plus if you're wearing short sleeves your arms with itch when you get back. Visibility is about 100,000 times better, as is the sensation of actually flying, as opposed to sitting inside of a mechanical device that may be flying, but you can't really tell because you have no sensation of movement.
Try it, you'll like it.
Ken Ibold
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Ken Ibold
It's like a motorcycle. A really high one. The exact experience depends on the type. Dirt bike vs Harley vs Gold Wing ...
LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
It's a somewhat serious question. I love the lines of biplanes and they bring to mind images of anthropomorphized felines flying around in leather helmets, jackets and goggles 
. I've never flown in one but I am amazed at the affordability of things like Acrosports. I'm loving my tailwheel training and I'm thinking I may want to own a t/w. The cost of parts for certified aircraft and the fact that I am mechanically inclined makes the EAB option attractive to me and there are a number of really pretty biplanes available in that vein.
. I've never flown in one but I am amazed at the affordability of things like Acrosports. I'm loving my tailwheel training and I'm thinking I may want to own a t/w. The cost of parts for certified aircraft and the fact that I am mechanically inclined makes the EAB option attractive to me and there are a number of really pretty biplanes available in that vein.
FormerHangie
En-Route
It's a somewhat serious question. I love the lines of biplanes and they bring to mind images of anthropomorphized felines flying around in leather helmets, jackets and goggles
Are you flying for transportation or for fun?
DaleB
Final Approach
I challenge you to find anyone even considering an open cockpit biplane for transportation.
LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
I just started my IR yesterday. If I flew for transportation I’d probably rent, BUT I am wondering the answer to the following question: let’s assume I had a beautiful weekend in fall, like fall break at whatever school I was working at. Could I stand the hour or so flight to one of the air fields out in Missouri wine country to spend a couple of days out there? I’ve done longer trips on my motorcycle (Triumph Thruxton) and I am beat once I reach my destination, but I take the bike with the intent that the journey is part of the trip itself. The destination is just a stopover where I do something fun.
tinerj
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tinerj
I fly with a motorcycle helmet with face plate. It has good speakers, and the microphone is behind the faceplate. That makes my radio calls as clear as they would be in a closed cockpit.
Wind isn't really a factor when dressed properly. Dress like being on a motorcycle in the same weather.
Wind isn't really a factor when dressed properly. Dress like being on a motorcycle in the same weather.
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FormerHangie
En-Route
Could you fly for an hour or two and not feel beaten up? I would think so unless you were going bareheaded, but that's kind of an individual thing. I once rode my motorcycle (Honda Hawk GT, a middleweight standard with add-on plastic windshield) from Chicago to Alberta and then to Atlanta, in something like 16 days, averaging 450 miles per day. The only time I really wanted off the bike was after touring Glacier National Park after which I was half frozen.
There are guys out there who give biplane rides, although it's most likely to be in a Stearman or a Waco which is a much bigger aircraft than you're contemplating. You should get some sort of a feel as to whether this is for you or not. I have heard guys complain about the limited visibility out of a biplane, so I gather it's not for everyone.
@Lowflynjack flies a small bipe, hopefully he can give you the 411 on it.
FormerHangie
En-Route
That's what I was getting at.
Ah, after looking at a Thruxton I can see where @LoLPilot would be tired after not that long of a ride. I would think that any of the biplanes you'd fly would be less fatiguing than a cafe racer style bike.
keen9
Pre-takeoff checklist
Go find out for yourself: http://www.americanwarbird.com/flight-packages/
I've only done the 1/2 hour Waco flight. It was awesome.
I've only done the 1/2 hour Waco flight. It was awesome.
labbadabba
Pattern Altitude
I figured you were calling for help since your propeller stopped working.
Ghery
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Ghery Pettit
The only open cockpit plane I've flown in is a Waco. With the windscreen there really isn't much wind in your face. But the view is tremendous. Too bad I've only been a passenger. The only open cockpit, biplane, radial engine I've been in. As the pilot said the first time, "I fly slower than the helicopters do." Having also taken a helicopter sightseeing ride on Kauai, the Waco is more fun.
wanttaja
En-Route
I've flown open-cockpit airplanes almost exclusively for over thirty years (BFRs in Cessnas/Pipers, ~40 hours' co-ownership of a Stinson).
There's "open cockpit," and there's "open cockpit." You can fly a ultralight-type airplane with all of your body out in the breeze, or a classical open cockpit with your head (and perhaps shoulders) sticking out above the fuselage. I fly the latter.
Why, yes, it IS fun. First time I flew open-cockpit, I literally was laughing as I took off. It is a total blast, and it hasn't abated.
Your comfort is going to depend on several factors.
1. The degree you're enclosed by the aircraft. Note the picture above...I'm mostly out of the wind. This affects how much I need to dress up to fly.
2. Windshield. Without a windshield, you're going to have an 80 MPH wind right in the kisser. With a (decent) windshield, you don't have to wear a motorcycle helmet with a faceshield. With my configuration, the draft in the cockpit is actually fairly light. I originally wore cotton balls for ear plugs, and when one came out, I actually saw it going forward, then up and back.
3. Cabin sealing. With my single-seat airplane, it's easy to close down the openings. With a tandem aircraft, it's almost impossible. I've flown in some tandem aircraft with a huge updraft...quite uncomfortable.
4. Cockpit wear. Unlike a cabin aircraft, you cannot just step from your car to the airplane. Unless the weather is very warm, you'll have to don appropriate attire for warmth. I have a light canvas jacket, a fairly heavy-duty A2 leather jacket, and a fear-no-evil B3 sheepskin coat.
The key point is to isolate bare skin from any draft. I have a leather flying helmet I wear pretty much year around, with silk scarves, ski masks, and gloves as appropriate. When it gets REALLY cold, you need to go all-out. I've flown (comfortably) in 15-degree weather
Some of the material I've got on my web page:
Leather Jackets for the Open-Cockpit Aviator: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/jackets.html
Warmth and general comfort: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/dermal.htm
Scarves: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/scarves.html
Goggles: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/goggles.html
Helmets: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/helmet_options.html
Ron Wanttaja
There's "open cockpit," and there's "open cockpit." You can fly a ultralight-type airplane with all of your body out in the breeze, or a classical open cockpit with your head (and perhaps shoulders) sticking out above the fuselage. I fly the latter.
Why, yes, it IS fun. First time I flew open-cockpit, I literally was laughing as I took off. It is a total blast, and it hasn't abated.
Your comfort is going to depend on several factors.
1. The degree you're enclosed by the aircraft. Note the picture above...I'm mostly out of the wind. This affects how much I need to dress up to fly.
2. Windshield. Without a windshield, you're going to have an 80 MPH wind right in the kisser. With a (decent) windshield, you don't have to wear a motorcycle helmet with a faceshield. With my configuration, the draft in the cockpit is actually fairly light. I originally wore cotton balls for ear plugs, and when one came out, I actually saw it going forward, then up and back.
3. Cabin sealing. With my single-seat airplane, it's easy to close down the openings. With a tandem aircraft, it's almost impossible. I've flown in some tandem aircraft with a huge updraft...quite uncomfortable.
4. Cockpit wear. Unlike a cabin aircraft, you cannot just step from your car to the airplane. Unless the weather is very warm, you'll have to don appropriate attire for warmth. I have a light canvas jacket, a fairly heavy-duty A2 leather jacket, and a fear-no-evil B3 sheepskin coat.
The key point is to isolate bare skin from any draft. I have a leather flying helmet I wear pretty much year around, with silk scarves, ski masks, and gloves as appropriate. When it gets REALLY cold, you need to go all-out. I've flown (comfortably) in 15-degree weather
Some of the material I've got on my web page:
Leather Jackets for the Open-Cockpit Aviator: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/jackets.html
Warmth and general comfort: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/dermal.htm
Scarves: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/scarves.html
Goggles: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/goggles.html
Helmets: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/helmet_options.html
Ron Wanttaja
LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
@FormerHangie and @keen9
I am wanting to go on one of Kevin’s Waco flights! I want to finish my t/w and HiPo first to see if he’d let me fly I’ve airborne so we could put some Waco time in my logbook!
The thing holding me back was that the Waco is a great big plane compared to a Duster, Steen, or Acrosport. So I was worried it would be like taking a ride on a full dress HD as your introduction to motorcycling and then buying a Ninja 250 as your first bike. The experience would be nothing at all alike!
I am wanting to go on one of Kevin’s Waco flights! I want to finish my t/w and HiPo first to see if he’d let me fly I’ve airborne so we could put some Waco time in my logbook!
The thing holding me back was that the Waco is a great big plane compared to a Duster, Steen, or Acrosport. So I was worried it would be like taking a ride on a full dress HD as your introduction to motorcycling and then buying a Ninja 250 as your first bike. The experience would be nothing at all alike!
Lachlan
En-Route
This our neighbor’s Meyers OTW. It’s beyond fun to fly around in, but it’s not that much fun as a xc machine. It’s loud, it’s slow, it’s really windy on the top of your head, and it’s loud and windy. And slow. But more FUN than most fully enclosed cockpit types!!! You haven’t lived til you’ve been inverted in an open cockpit biplane.
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Juliet Hotel
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Juliet Hotel
I used to give sightseeing rides and occasionally tow banners in a Steerman.
The sight seeing riders were fun mostly but got a bit boring after a while. The banners? Those were usually long flights. It was a nice change at first from the Supercubs I usually towed in but it definitely had its downsides. In the summer the sun beats on you and down low it can get hot. No shade to speak of. In the fall and winter? No two ways about it, its cold. Only heat is what drifts back off the engine and that ain't much. And while the Steerman cockpit isn't cramped by any stretch, its a typical biplane so there is no where to put anything. If you can't put it in a pocket or otherwise attach it to yourself, you won't have access to it for the duration of the flight. Water bottle? Food? Forget it. Definitely better suited for staying within 50-100 miles of the home airport IMO.
The sight seeing riders were fun mostly but got a bit boring after a while. The banners? Those were usually long flights. It was a nice change at first from the Supercubs I usually towed in but it definitely had its downsides. In the summer the sun beats on you and down low it can get hot. No shade to speak of. In the fall and winter? No two ways about it, its cold. Only heat is what drifts back off the engine and that ain't much. And while the Steerman cockpit isn't cramped by any stretch, its a typical biplane so there is no where to put anything. If you can't put it in a pocket or otherwise attach it to yourself, you won't have access to it for the duration of the flight. Water bottle? Food? Forget it. Definitely better suited for staying within 50-100 miles of the home airport IMO.
LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
I've flown open-cockpit airplanes almost exclusively for over thirty years (BFRs in Cessnas/Pipers, ~40 hours' co-ownership of a Stinson).
There's "open cockpit," and there's "open cockpit." You can fly a ultralight-type airplane with all of your body out in the breeze, or a classical open cockpit with your head (and perhaps shoulders) sticking out above the fuselage. I fly the latter.
Why, yes, it IS fun. First time I flew open-cockpit, I literally was laughing as I took off. It is a total blast, and it hasn't abated.
Your comfort is going to depend on several factors.
1. The degree you're enclosed by the aircraft. Note the picture above...I'm mostly out of the wind. This affects how much I need to dress up to fly.
2. Windshield. Without a windshield, you're going to have an 80 MPH wind right in the kisser. With a (decent) windshield, you don't have to wear a motorcycle helmet with a faceshield. With my configuration, the draft in the cockpit is actually fairly light. I originally wore cotton balls for ear plugs, and when one came out, I actually saw it going forward, then up and back.
3. Cabin sealing. With my single-seat airplane, it's easy to close down the openings. With a tandem aircraft, it's almost impossible. I've flown in some tandem aircraft with a huge updraft...quite uncomfortable.
4. Cockpit wear. Unlike a cabin aircraft, you cannot just step from your car to the airplane. Unless the weather is very warm, you'll have to don appropriate attire for warmth. I have a light canvas jacket, a fairly heavy-duty A2 leather jacket, and a fear-no-evil B3 sheepskin coat.
The key point is to isolate bare skin from any draft. I have a leather flying helmet I wear pretty much year around, with silk scarves, ski masks, and gloves as appropriate. When it gets REALLY cold, you need to go all-out. I've flown (comfortably) in 15-degree weather
Some of the material I've got on my web page:
Leather Jackets for the Open-Cockpit Aviator: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/jackets.html
Warmth and general comfort: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/dermal.htm
Scarves: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/scarves.html
Goggles: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/goggles.html
Helmets: http://www.bowersflybaby.com/stories/helmet_options.html
Ron Wanttaja
That is so cool. Not gonna lie - one of the things that attracts me to biplanes is the clothing and gear. I’d love to have an excuse to purchase an A-2 and a B-3. I already have a leather helmet, scarf and goggles I bought years ago from Sporty’s for a Halloween costume. Kind of like why I love a cafe bike. Totally an excuse to wear aviator style motorcycle goggles, an open face helmet, mandarin collared leather jacket and leggings popping out of your boots and having be acceptable to do so
deyoung
Line Up and Wait
They had one of these at the SAF fly-in... the guy said you usually cruise about 70mph.
LoLPilot
Line Up and Wait
At some point in time I’m guessing that was a tri Champ?
Fearless Tower
Touchdown! Greaser!
Very good description.
The experience can vary quite a bit between Stearman, Waco, or T6 with the canopy open.
Flying a Stearman is a lot like riding a dirt bike.
A Waco is like a Harley with a full Police style windscreen.
A T6 with canopy open is like driving in a convertible.
Fearless Tower
Touchdown! Greaser!
Basically, how it feels depends highly on the windscreen and airflow around the windscreen. That’s why some biplanes are more brutal and exhausting to fly than others.It's a somewhat serious question. I love the lines of biplanes and they bring to mind images of anthropomorphized felines flying around in leather helmets, jackets and goggles
You do tend to get some wind buffeting on the sides of your head in most types. Some worse than others.
7-8 hours in a single day in a Stearman leaves me feeling similar to when I’d spend all day out in a sailboat and then walk ashore and feel like the ground was moving. If you close your eyes in the shower, you might fall down, kind of thing.
SkyDog58
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Canis Non Grata
Looks like a breezy made from a Piper Tri-Pacer?They had one of these at the SAF fly-in... the guy said you usually cruise about 70mph.
They look cool, but I’d probably lose my lunch flying on one of those.
DaleB
Final Approach
Well, look on the bright side. It's not like you'll be scrubbing it out of the carpet or headliner.
Well I'm trying to be polite by not flying on one, because I don't want anyone to have to scrub it out of their hair!
DaleB
Final Approach
I'm trying to exercise self-preservation by not flying one, because I'm pretty sure I'd crap myself and croak from a heart attack. They look like a lot of fun for people who aren't petrified when the climb a ladder.
Juliet Hotel
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Juliet Hotel
If you want an out in the fresh air type open cockpit experience but you still want to actually go places once in a while, try something like a Supercub. Open the door and window and you've got all fresh air you want just like a biplane. You can look straight down just like in a biplane. And IMO its actually got much better visibility. The biplane is fun and all but if you're trying to look at anything that isn't right below you or right behind you there's a wing or a radial motor or some other chunk of the plane in the way. Plus you can close the doors and turn on the heat when it gets cold.
wanttaja
En-Route
My wife bought me a leather helmet in 1983 as a joke. I'm still wearing it.
It has a "Banana Republic" label; from when they were stocking unusual stuff from around the world rather than just going for trendy. I've worn this over 30 years. Note the color...it's kind of an olive on the sides, but faded to almost white on top. That helmet has seen a lot of sun.
It's my warm weather helmet; note that there's no headset. I've got a set of foam ear buds plugged into the aircraft's radio. The mike boom must have gotten bumped prior to shooting this picture, normally it's at the corner of my mouth. It's a standard headset microphone, with the flex metal tubing from a USB utility light as the boom. In colder weather, I switch to a helmet that takes a conventional headset. It keeps out the drafts better... you can see how this one makes little "scoops" on either side of my head. Not want you want on a cold day.
Goggles are Emgo Roadhawks, $26 on Amazon. Takes a little modification to be able to wear them over glasses, but, hey, $26.
Ron Wanttaja
wanttaja
En-Route
Longest trip I took in one day was about 300 miles (150 miles there and back). It is wearing, in an open-cockpit airplane. When I was partners in a Stinson Station Wagon, I was surprised how I could fly a couple of hours and still feel pretty fresh.
So, no, they're not really suitable for gotta-be-there and gotta-be-ready to party travel. Great if an adventure is your goal, though....
Ron Wanttaja
So, no, they're not really suitable for gotta-be-there and gotta-be-ready to party travel. Great if an adventure is your goal, though....
Ron Wanttaja
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FormerHangie
En-Route
@FormerHangie and @keen9
I am wanting to go on one of Kevin’s Waco flights! I want to finish my t/w and HiPo first to see if he’d let me fly I’ve airborne so we could put some Waco time in my logbook!
The thing holding me back was that the Waco is a great big plane compared to a Duster, Steen, or Acrosport. So I was worried it would be like taking a ride on a full dress HD as your introduction to motorcycling and then buying a Ninja 250 as your first bike. The experience would be nothing at all alike!
You want the small biplane experience, you gotta travel.
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Joey4420
Pre-takeoff checklist
I fly and Ercoupe... best of both worlds, windows open when it is nice and warm. Not to windy, but I do wear a bandanna so not to get a sunburn on my head. If you get cold close the windows or just turn the heat on. I flew from Cincinnati to Oshkosh with the windows down and only put them up after I parked to keep the rain out. Of course if you do get in a little rain you can always close the windows.
Not sure I could go back to a plane that doesn't have serious in flight ventilation.
Not sure I could go back to a plane that doesn't have serious in flight ventilation.