Ohio Governor drops MOAB on his state economy

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Alternately, with some testing coming on line and with the possibility of existing drugs treating the thing, maybe putting the state in time out for a couple of weeks will buy enough time to control it. In general, I think it is better to have and execute a strategy than to just hope for a good outcome.
 
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Two weeks would be great. Some were forecasting months!
 
Ohio, in my opinion (too damn old for it to be humble), is doing an excellent job. Each day at 2pm the Gov and head of Dept of Health have a televised briefing explaining the why's and whuffo's of what they are implementing that day, including taking questions from media until there are no more questions. Dept of Health backs their decisions up with the medical logic behind it. It's interesting to watch, and informative. So far, the logic has worked for me.

Are there gonna be problems...yup. Managing is the key.

Jim
 
Jim Rosenow said:
Ohio, in my opinion (too damn old for it to be humble), is doing an excellent job. Each day at 2pm the Gov and head of Dept of Health have a televised briefing explaining the why's and whuffo's of what they are implementing that day, including taking questions from media until there are no more questions. Dept of Health backs their decisions up with the medical logic behind it. It's interesting to watch, and informative. So far, the logic has worked for me.

Are there gonna be problems...yup. Managing is the key.

Jim
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And maybe basing their decisions on science instead of BS...and directly contradicting the science...like the federal leaders are. Amazing.

...and before anyone screams "political bias", our governor is about as far to the right as one can get and he's doing an excellent job. He consults with the experts and actually heeds their advice instead of thinking that he knows everything and doesn't need to listen. Missouri is being managing with a very well thought out and measured fashion IMO. Of course, Mike DeWine is a republican also...one who listens...
 
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The suggestion that people work from home over a week ago has hurt me. I was supposed to start a new job on March 30th and that is delayed indefinitely. I cannot qualify for unemployment for being between jobs but I get to financially go down the drain. Woohoo! Not!
 
flhrci said:
The suggestion that people work from home over a week ago has hurt me. I was supposed to start a new job on March 30th and that is delayed indefinitely. I cannot qualify for unemployment for being between jobs but I get to financially go down the drain. Woohoo! Not!
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Ok, it’s getting to be impossible to discuss this now without getting political.
Pretty soon this will be a forum for talking about what flying used to be like. Oh, I guess there will always be flight simulators to talk about....
 
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Well, for one, the crisis gives you a good idea about the 2024 field of presidential contenders. 'He who bans the mostest wins!'
 
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Jim Rosenow said:
Ohio, in my opinion (too damn old for it to be humble), is doing an excellent job. Each day at 2pm the Gov and head of Dept of Health have a televised briefing explaining the why's and whuffo's of what they are implementing that day, including taking questions from media until there are no more questions. Dept of Health backs their decisions up with the medical logic behind it. It's interesting to watch, and informative. So far, the logic has worked for me.

Are there gonna be problems...yup. Managing is the key.

Jim
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Yeah, he's surprising more than a few people. The 'shut down' had essentially occurred last week, with various suggestions, this just makes it official.
Seeing how this cootie has spread world-wide in just a few months is amazing. Let's hope some PRK spies take it home with them.
 
It's going to hurt a lot of hourly workers in the food and retail industry. But the list of essential businesses is still pretty large. I see Home Depot and Lowe's having increased sales with all the projects that will be done at home the next few weeks. I know I will be there a few times getting things I need.
 
Salty said:
Ok, it’s getting to be impossible to discuss this now without getting political.
Pretty soon this will be a forum for talking about what flying used to be like. Oh, I guess there will always be flight simulators to talk about....
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Not political here. Its just the way things are. The flying club I used to fly out of shut down last week because they weren't sure what else to do to keep every one safe.
 
flhrci said:
Not political here. Its just the way things are. The flying club I used to fly out of shut down last week because they weren't sure what else to do to keep every one safe.
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My original response to you was pretty political. I had to delete it.
 
flhrci said:
The suggestion that people work from home over a week ago has hurt me. I was supposed to start a new job on March 30th and that is delayed indefinitely. I cannot qualify for unemployment for being between jobs but I get to financially go down the drain. Woohoo! Not!
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Aside from the actual victims of the disease, I think Those who are affected economically are the ones who are the real victims. And I know you’ve been looking long and hard for a job. All I can do is hope that this is a brief interruption for you.
I still haven’t decided which is worse, the disease or the cure.
 
dtuuri said:
Amy Acton (should be "Action") is on top of this! Read the Directive and note the chronology on the final pages: https://coronavirus.ohio.gov/static/DirectorsOrderStayAtHome.pdf
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Edgamacation is not on the list of critical infrastructure. Ain't like kids gotta be learned to spell.

My classes are 100% on line for the rest of the semester (some of the lab stuff the students can do at home) but management still wants me to show up and sit in my office...
Michigan public schools are closed, but on-line classrooms don't "count" for the required days of public school. I would suggest that this is a stupid policy - particularly under the circumstances, but that would be getting political. Dunno what the policies are in other states.
 
Doctor Birx at today's briefing that said on the ENTIRE PLANET there has been one death of a child under 15 due to COVID-19.
 
flhrci said:
The suggestion that people work from home over a week ago has hurt me. I was supposed to start a new job on March 30th and that is delayed indefinitely. I cannot qualify for unemployment for being between jobs but I get to financially go down the drain. Woohoo! Not!
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The Indian survived because they followed the buffalo. Maybe consider delivering pizzas or some sort of food. Maybe even on a cash-only basis. 20 years ago I’d clear $200 on a Friday evening. That’s probably like $350+ in today’s money.
 
Jim Rosenow said:
Ohio, in my opinion (too damn old for it to be humble), is doing an excellent job. Each day at 2pm the Gov and head of Dept of Health have a televised briefing explaining the why's and whuffo's of what they are implementing that day, including taking questions from media until there are no more questions. Dept of Health backs their decisions up with the medical logic behind it. It's interesting to watch, and informative. So far, the logic has worked for me.

Are there gonna be problems...yup. Managing is the key.

Jim
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Cumo has been doing the same thing at noon for a while now. And he comes off very well with it.

Tim
 
YooperMooney said:
The Indian survived because they followed the buffalo. Maybe consider delivering pizzas or some sort of food. Maybe even on a cash-only basis. 20 years ago I’d clear $200 on a Friday evening. That’s probably like $350+ in today’s money.
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Under consideration.
 
JB1842 said:
It's going to hurt a lot of hourly workers in the food and retail industry. But the list of essential businesses is still pretty large. I see Home Depot and Lowe's having increased sales with all the projects that will be done at home the next few weeks. I know I will be there a few times getting things I need.
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The Home Depots around here have reduced hours from 7:00 AM-10:00 PM to 8:30 AM-6:00 PM.
 
I'm starting to come around to @Datadriver and @Morgan3820 's way of thinking. The CDC says that thus far deaths from the regular flu season have been 23,000-59,000 [1]. So, the corona deaths so far have been only 1-2% of the number already dead from regular flue yet we're destroying our economy, destroying wealth, putting thousands out of work, and it will likely take the better part of a decade to recover. Does it really make sense to sacrifice so much for so little?

[1] https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm
 
Bill Jennings said:
I'm starting to come around to @Datadriver and @Morgan3820 's way of thinking. The CDC says that thus far deaths from the regular flu season have been 23,000-59,000 [1]. So, the corona deaths so far have been only 1-2% of the number already dead from regular flue yet we're destroying our economy, destroying wealth, putting thousands out of work, and it will likely take the better part of a decade to recover. Does it really make sense to sacrifice so much for so little?

[1] https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm
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While this is true, absolute numbers of deaths are a misleading indicator. The number of people diagnosed with the flu are way, way above the number diagnosed with coronavirus. The fraction of cases that turn out fatal is much lower with the flu, less than 0.1% vs. 2-3% for the new virus. If as many people came down with clinically significant cases of coronavirus as do with influenza, all indications are that the number of deaths would soar as well.

Taking the high end of the CDC's annual influenza case rate - 45 million - since the new virus is extremely contagious, and multiplying by even 2% gives 900,000 deaths. At 3% it goes to 1.2 million. If the health system becomes overwhelmed as in Italy and it jumps to 8%, we're talking 3.6 million deaths.

I'm not saying that it's right to destroy our economy over this, but I can understand why it's being done. The real crime here is that we could have been better prepared - by having the machinery in place to quickly ramp up production of testing kits - but instead we chose to sit fat, happy, and stupid when we knew that something like this was bound to happen sooner or later.
 
azure said:
I'm not saying that it's right to destroy our economy over this, but I can understand why it's being done. The real crime here is that we could have been better prepared - by having the machinery in place to quickly ramp up production of testing kits - but instead we chose to sit fat, happy, and stupid when we knew that something like this was bound to happen sooner or later.
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True, we could have been much better prepared, but OTOH CEO's and management have to report to the stockholders and/or owners, and nobody likes to see large sums of money tied up in someday supplies (some of them perishable) that may never be used. Maybe the government should have a strategic reserve of med supplies? Don't know the answer.

But, as the virus is mainly deadly to the 60 and above group (which I'm precariously close to), maybe it would be better for just those people to shelter in place[1] and allow the economy to chug on. As it is, even though kids are out of school and families are sheltering in place, most grandparents I know are avoiding all contact with their kids and grand kids.

In the end, let those in the high risk groups manage their risk as they see fit, and let the rest move on and keep the economy moving.

[1] I don't see it as a real hardship for one already retired to choose to hole up and shelter. It IS a real hardship for young working families to loose their income, homes, and way of life because they HAVE to shelter.
 
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Imagine a cancer patient.

Doctor: Our patient has cancer, so we are going to increase the chemo 10 times above the recommended average.

Nurse: But Doctor, if we do that, we'll kill the patient!

Doctor: Probably, but we'll for sure kill the cancer!
 
Bill Jennings said:
[1] I don't see it as a real hardship for one already retired to choose to hole up and shelter. It IS a real hardship for young working families to loose their income, homes, and way of life because they HAVE to shelter.
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The operative word there is "choose". Sure, they can choose to and be advised to make that choice. But in a public health emergency you need to be able to ORDER people to comply, and you can't force only those 60 and older to shelter in place. So it wouldn't work.

And besides, sheltering in place would not be enough to protect them - we would need to set up dedicated facilities with strict quarantine procedures, otherwise those people (I'm one of them!) would almost certainly be exposed by the rest of the population who would be circulating the virus, and getting sick with it.

And just because, statistically, those 60 and up are at higher risk, doesn't mean the disease can't be very serious and even lethal to those under 60... even MUCH under 60. There are increasing reports of people in their 30s and 40s being hospitalized with serious cases of the infection.

This is a true public health emergency and there are only two ways to deal with it effectively:

1. Isolate everyone (or the overwhelming majority of those) infected.

2. Isolate everyone, period.

To make option 1 work, you need to know who is infected. Stupid us, we don't have the tools to find out. So we're left with option 2.

BTW the issue isn't someday supplies... before the virus was identified, the testing kits didn't exist. But we didn't have the machinery in place to crank out the kits that were needed. I'm not sure of the exact reasons, but I'm sure it didn't help that we (I can't be more specific without violating the TOS) disbanded the federal office charged with pandemic preparedness.

Certain other countries were able to produce the needed kits and avoid shutting down their economies - S. Korea is the most notable example. That we couldn't do it, with the strongest economy and best medical technology in the world, is to our lasting shame.
 
azure said:
This is a true public health emergency and there are only two ways to deal with it effectively:

1. Isolate everyone (or the overwhelming majority of those) infected.

2. Isolate everyone, period.

To make option 1 work, you need to know who is infected. Stupid us, we don't have the tools to find out. So we're left with option 2.
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I get it, but the cost is high, probably the bottom 1/3 of working families will be economically decimated almost immediately, and the 2nd 1/3 won't be far behind. Very few families have any sort of rainy day fund.

Certain other countries were able to produce the needed kits and avoid shutting down their economies - S. Korea is the most notable example. That we couldn't do it, with the strongest economy and best medical technology in the world, is to our lasting shame.
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Not just kits, but ventilators. We won't have enough, but those are expensive to stockpile for a rainy day. As for kits and such, we can't produce them because the street rewards those who outsource to reduce cost.
 
Bill Jennings said:
I get it, but the cost is high, probably the bottom 1/3 of working families will be economically decimated almost immediately, and the 2nd 1/3 won't be far behind. Very few families have any sort of rainy day fund.
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I know... that's why I said it is to our lasting shame. :(

Not just kits, but ventilators. We won't have enough, but those are expensive to stockpile for a rainy day. As for kits and such, we can't produce them because the street rewards those who outsource to reduce cost.
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Good point about ventilators, very true. Of course, the fact of needing so many is directly related to our inability to nip this thing in the bud. I'm not sure of the reason why we can't produce them - do you have a reference for that?
 
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