Newbie question Re: Electronic Checklist and/or Training Apps

LAWYER2

LAWYER2

Filing Flight Plan
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LAWYER2
Hi all,
Newbie student pilot (roughly 15hrs) and flying enthusiast with a couple best practices questions. (yes I searched before posting, lol)


In short, it's been getting harder to quickly see, read and reference the laminated checklist (as my eyes age) and I'm wondering how others may have overcame this? Are there E-checklist folks are using or just a PDF on an iPad that can be pinched and expanded as needed?

Lastly, any consensus on the best app (paid or free) for studying, chair-flying etc?
 
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The ForeFlight app has you covered for an e-Checklist, and much much (ok, I could put 100 "muches" here) more.
 
"Kick the tires and light the fires" ... nah don't do it that way! :)
 
Familiarity with your airplane, procedures, and checklists can overcome a lot of that.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Make your own from the original checklist. Font size of your choosing. Eliminate silly stuff like “start engine”. Have your CFI review it.
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This. But I would say start with the expanded preflight narrative in the AFM and condense it down based on your personal habits and preferences. I am not a big fan of generic comprehensive checklists that go on for multiple pages.
 
sarangan said:
This. But I would say start with the expanded preflight narrative in the AFM and condense it down based on your personal habits and preferences. I am not a big fan of generic comprehensive checklists that go on for multiple pages.
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My homebrew checklist is multiple pages, but the pages are selected strategically. All the preflight stuff, for example, is back-to-back on a page. Turn it and you have everything from engine start through run-up. Turn that and you have everything for flight, from take-off to landing.

Done that way, I can use large fonts. I don't need to see preflight items when I'm preparing for descent and landing, so there's no need to have those things on that page.
 
+1 to what @Half Fast and @455 Bravo Uniform said. I do the same thing. And encourage my students to do it as well.

Eventually with repetition, it’s easy to have a natural flow developed that is then backed up with a checklist.
 
while i was training I created my own checklists that included both the POH items and things I wanted to do. I put them on 4x8 cards, had them laminated and then punched a hole in an upper corner and placed the pages in one of those round key rings. i also did not use an EFB during training as I valued learning the "old fashioned way" first. post check ride I experimented with FF but found it to be distracting. but that's me.
 
The problem isn't the checklist--it's your eyes.

Reading glasses, bifocals, or stick-ons. Whatever is most appropriate for you. Eventually, you'll need some sort of correction to see the panel. Might as well bite the bullet now.
 
Paper never runs out of batteries or quits working when too hot in the sun, but it could fly out the window! I’d make a larger font laminated checklist to backup your digital one.
 
Domenick said:
The problem isn't the checklist--it's your eyes.

Reading glasses, bifocals, or stick-ons. Whatever is most appropriate for you. Eventually, you'll need some sort of correction to see the panel. Might as well bite the bullet now.
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I used the stick-on's for near vision correction until my far vision started to crap out. I now have trifocals- the panel is in focus and checklists are in focus as well. If your far vision is still good try the stick-ons available through stores on Amazon. They actually work really well.
 
AggieMike88 said:
+1 to what @Half Fast and @455 Bravo Uniform said. I do the same thing. And encourage my students to do it as well.

Eventually with repetition, it’s easy to have a natural flow developed that is then backed up with a checklist.
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+1 again. I'd even suggest adding plane specific things such as "nav lights - on" if your ads-b is the light.
 
Pi1otguy said:
I'd even suggest adding plane specific things such as "nav lights - on" if your ads-b is the light.
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+1. Odds are your airplane isn’t configured the way the original checklist is designed. Whatever you do, electronic or paper, this is a good time to incorporate the checklist changes from the Supplements (the above example should be in your ADS-B Supplement.)
 
Make your own checklist with a larger font, use red to highlight more important procedures. Laminate it .your good to go.
 
Not going to go to the trouble to find it again, but I researched this a few years ago and found a study done by (or sponsored by) DoD that recommended Arial font and minimum 14 pt for cockpit checklists, so that's what I converted to and works well for me. Normally I use +1.25 readers for reading printed material, but can read my 14 pt Arial checklist without readers. YMMV.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Make your own from the original checklist. Font size of your choosing. Eliminate silly stuff like “start engine”. Have your CFI review it.
Click to expand...
This.

I have been doing this since my earliest days as a student pilot (30+ years ago). The best checklist in the world is the one that you will use. For most of us, that means easy and efficient.

I a crazy about aviation gadgetry (there are currently 5 EFB apps on my tablet and 4-4 on my phone). And I absolutely LOVE the idea of electronic checklists. But I don't use them. I just find it so much easier to grab the paper off the glareshield, hold it up where I can still keep my head up where it belongs and take a few seconds to run through it than tap and scroll to an electronic checklist which expects an item by item response from me. I have eChecklists, but they are a backup for my paper ones dropping on the floor. OTOH, that's just personal preference; I've seen people use their eChecklists like it was an art from.
 
midlifeflyer said:
I a crazy about aviation gadgetry (there are currently 5 EFB apps on my tablet and 4-4 on my phone). And I absolutely LOVE the idea of electronic checklists. But I don't use them. I just find it so much easier to grab the paper off the glareshield, hold it up where I can still keep my head up where it belongs and take a few seconds to run through it than tap and scroll to an electronic checklist which expects an item by item response from me. I have eChecklists, but they are a backup for my paper ones dropping on the floor. OTOH, that's just personal preference; I've seen people use their eChecklists like it was an art from.
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If you have space on the panel to Velcro an iPad Mini or something, that might make electronic checklists more useful as well…I’ve used electronic checklists on the MFD of a jet, which is a wonderful option at night. But I wouldn’t consider using one on my iPad on my lap or on the yoke. I know, I’m weird. :dunno:
 
MauleSkinner said:
If you have space on the panel to Velcro an iPad Mini or something, that might make electronic checklists more useful as well…I’ve used electronic checklists on the MFD of a jet, which is a wonderful option at night. But I wouldn’t consider using one on my iPad on my lap or on the yoke. I know, I’m weird. :dunno:
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I have a friend that has checklist on his iPad and it works well for him. My iFly 740b has a sketch pad feature that I considered putting my checklist on it but it doesn't have a keyboard function and I don't know that I could read my own handwriting ... :oops:
 
MauleSkinner said:
If you have space on the panel to Velcro an iPad Mini or something, that might make electronic checklists more useful as well…I’ve used electronic checklists on the MFD of a jet, which is a wonderful option at night. But I wouldn’t consider using one on my iPad on my lap or on the yoke. I know, I’m weird. :dunno:
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Not sure about that for me. I've been in a few airplanes with checklists integrated into the panel (I even wrote one for a Sportcruiser Dynon panel). Going to it and having to physically(or even verbally) check off the items is still till far less efficient for me than lifting up a piece of paper (not written in challenge response format) and simple reading. I'm done with my checklist in about the same time it would take me to get to an electronic one.
 
Daleandee said:
I have a friend that has checklist on his iPad and it works well for him. My iFly 740b has a sketch pad feature that I considered putting my checklist on it but it doesn't have a keyboard function and I don't know that I could read my own handwriting ... :oops:
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You can also store and access PDFs on your 740b, so that might be an option. I’ve uploaded airport diagrams that way, but not checklists.
 
Half Fast said:
You can also store and access PDFs on your 740b, so that might be an option. I’ve uploaded airport diagrams that way, but not checklists.
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Haven't been down that road ... but I might. Thanks!
 
Mira Check will interface to your BT headset and read the check list to you. And you respond by saying Check, it checks off that item and reads the next.

No looking required.
 
Pinecone said:
Mira Check will interface to your BT headset and read the check list to you. And you respond by saying Check, it checks off that item and reads the next.

No looking required.
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Oh my. Can't decide if that is a very clever or very ironic name, given the application. Same marketing company that gave Latin America the Chevy Nova?
 
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If you are an Android user, Avare allows you to create checklists and even build custom W&B sheets. Oh, and it's free. I have a Samsung tablet dedicated to just aviation use. I have PDF copies of all of my references (i.e. PHAK, AFH, FAR/AIM) as well as the sectionals for my region, and the South-Central Chart Supplement (formerly AFD). I've got other stuff on there too, like sectional close-up pictures taken of the instrument panel and a PDF copy of the POH and the W&B sheet. Oh, and copies of required documentation such as Student Pilot Certificate, scanned copies of my CMEC and BM Course Completion Certificate, DL, picture page of my PP and a copy of my insurance binder/policy.

At the flight school I am currently enrolled in, they have a paper copy of the checklist you can download. You can print it larger, and it's in a tri-fold configuration. I also like being able to physically check-off steps and write down the fuel levels and oil level. Of course, I also use an old-fashioned knee board.

All of our reference materials and procedures at work are being upgraded to Arial 11 font. I prefer 12 or larger myself, but the admin reviewers all make us stick to the template when updating or writing procedures.
 
Dry Creek said:
If you are an Android user, Avare allows you to create checklists and even build custom W&B sheets. Oh, and it's free. I have a Samsung tablet dedicated to just aviation use. I have PDF copies of all of my references (i.e. PHAK, AFH, FAR/AIM) as well as the sectionals for my region, and the South-Central Chart Supplement (formerly AFD). I've got other stuff on there too, like sectional close-up pictures taken of the instrument panel and a PDF copy of the POH and the W&B sheet. Oh, and copies of required documentation such as Student Pilot Certificate, scanned copies of my CMEC and BM Course Completion Certificate, DL, picture page of my PP and a copy of my insurance binder/policy.
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Just so you know, except for the free part :rolleyes:, you are describing just about every EFB out there.
 
Well.... seeing as you are a lawyer, I will help you anyhow :)

In addition to written and digital checklists..be able to check the major items using CIGARS, GUMP, or something similar...these are the big ticket items that might keep you alive and well.
 
Doug Reid said:
Well.... seeing as you are a lawyer, I will help you anyhow :)

In addition to written and digital checklists..be able to check the major items using CIGARS, GUMP, or something similar...these are the big ticket items that might keep you alive and well.
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Well, seeing as I hate and almost never use mnemonics, that's not much help. :D I prefer checklists.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Well, seeing as I hate and almost never use mnemonics, that's not much help. :D I prefer checklists.
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Your loss. And if you fly a retract, we may be reading about your gear up landing and some point.

Or, do you pull out and check it at 100 feet AGL on landing?????? That is where a last quick GUMPS can catch things.
 
Pinecone said:
Your loss. And if you fly a retract, we may be reading about your gear up landing and some point.

Or, do you pull out and check it at 100 feet AGL on landing?????? That is where a last quick GUMPS can catch things.
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Of course I fly retracts. For the past 30 years. teach in them too. If you think treating a mnemonic that refers to the gear as an "undercarriage" as though it were the Gospel is the one and only way to double, triple, and quadruple check the gear for landing, I think the loss may be yours.
 
midlifeflyer said:
...that refers to the gear as an "undercarriage"...
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GUMPS is the only time I ever see landing gear referred to as "undercarriage." Whatever official is in charge of mnemonics needs to do a much better job. Probably the same person who came up with V for "enviornment" in PAVE....
 
Gear down
Undercarriage (gear down)
Make sure gear is down
Put the gear down
Secure the gear down


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Half Fast said:
GUMPS is the only time I ever see landing gear referred to as "undercarriage." Whatever official is in charge of mnemonics needs to do a much better job. Probably the same person who came up with V for "enviornment" in PAVE....
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It's to be expected. The biggest problem with many mnemonics is that the mnemonic often becomes more important that what it represents. GUMP is one of the more useful ones but, far more important, it's reached quasi-religious significance so you are a sinner if you don't use it, even in a Cessna 152. Don't DARE change the first G to "gear!"
 
I think mnemonics should be appropriate to the situation…for example
LAND-
Lower the gear
Assess fuel settings
‘N set them appropriately
Decrease prop pitch

of course, all emergencies would be “OH ****”, so that confuses things. ;)
 
MauleSkinner said:
I think mnemonics should be appropriate to the situation…for example
LAND-
Lower the gear
Assess fuel settings
‘N set them appropriately
Decrease prop pitch

of course, all emergencies would be “OH ****”, so that confuses things. ;)
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I fly a fixed gear, fixed prop plane, so very little in that applies to me, and it omits portions of my flow.

My pre-descent & landing flow is fuel pump on, select fullest tank, mixture rich, landing light on. It moves left to right, down and up, like the letter V, with my controls arrangement. I just do it as a physical flow, no goofy silly mixed-up mnemonic, then glance at my checklist to confirm.
 
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