(NA - sort of) Your at your local airport and witness a fellow pilot kick a dog on a leash

Lndwarrior

Lndwarrior

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Gary
Not a gentle kick, and it's his own beautiful dog on a short leash.

Do you say something?

Or do you think its none of your business?
 
If I saw it happen more than once I'd probably try to get it recorded then call the police about animal abuse, and let him sort it out with the cops.
No point in me talking to them. Abusive/power-trip types aren't prone to changing their ways based off stern-words from a stranger.
 
Without more context, it’s hard to say. I won’t rule out administering a swift kick myself.
 
Just kicked the dog out of the blue for no reason, or are you leaving something out?
 
“Hey, is everything ok?”

Not to excuse it, just not sure what you would say. I’m not sure that it is illegal from a police perspective?
 
squincher said:
Just kicked the dog out of the blue for no reason, or are you leaving something out?
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The dog lunged towards a slowly passing vehicle on the runway access/taxiway, as many untrained dogs will do. Airport with houses and private taxiways.
 
Lndwarrior said:
Not a gentle kick, and it's his own beautiful dog on a short leash.

Do you say something?

Or do you think its none of your business?
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Hmm .... Not saying a word in advance, I would back hand him, and not a gentle one the way he kicked his dog, then ask him of he wanted another one!
 
Lndwarrior said:
The dog lunged towards a slowly passing vehicle on the runway access/taxiway, as many untrained dogs will do. Airport with houses and private taxiways.
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Untrained dogs are largely due to the owner. Should be kicking themselves. My sister and her English Golden are a prime example. Doesn't know recall...."but he knows middle and is smiley". Yeah but he doesn't know heel, doesn't listen, will just run into the back of your knees in the house. She calls me to take my dog when she wants to go for a run. I don't tolerate disobedience. I don't tolerate pulling on a leash. But I don't correct that with violence. My trainer worked at sea world for 12 years. They apply early childhood psychology and positive reinforcement. Take a snapshot of the behavior at the exact moment they do what you want. 5 seconds later, it's too late. It's hard work and consistency. I taught her all the obedience including "whoa" (stop now and don't move), he taught proper point and backing. Now I have a dog that jumps to heel, hunts like her hair is on fire, will recall to a tone on her collar 800 yards away, will open the door to let herself back inside and gives hugs on command... I need that last one.
 
squincher said:
The dog received an immediate correction for potentially fatal behavior. I'd file that way back under mind my own business.
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Not how you do it. Stiff tug. Stern heel. Treat at heel. Praise. Always and immediately. Have those treats in a holster ready to go.

You think the dog is gonna behave by getting kicked? Or a tug on the neck and given a treat when reminded what they should be doing.

Some dogs are can take firm correction. Others hear the tone in your voice when you're frustrated after they don't come back and won't come within 20 feet of you because they don't want to get kicked. Dogs aren't stupid. People are.
 
Racerx said:
Not how you do it. Stiff tug. Stern heel. Treat at heel. Praise. Always and immediately. Have those treats in a holster ready to go.

You think the dog is gonna behave by getting kicked? Or a tug on the neck and given a treat when reminded what they should be doing.

Some dogs are can take firm correction. Others hear the tone in your voice when you're frustrated after they don't come back and won't come within 20 feet of you because they don't want to get kicked. Dogs aren't stupid. People are.
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I've trained 14 bird dogs of my own over the years and absolutely love doing it. With this particular behavior, the dog could end up dead before you can give him enough treats to avoid the danger. Same reason snake proofing isn't done with treats. This isn't whoa-ing or holding steady to wing and shot. I've had a couple of stupid dogs over the years, and couple more that were just hardheaded. All good bird dogs, but the same approach won't work with all of them. Perhaps this guy knows his dog better than any of us and has good handle on what he needs.
 
I've met a few humans that could use a good kick in the rear ...
 
Reminds me of something one of the Supreme Court justices said during a case whose audio was being broadcast:

"Even a dog knows the difference between being stumbled over and being kicked."
 
Lndwarrior said:
The dog lunged towards a slowly passing vehicle on the runway access/taxiway, as many untrained dogs will do. Airport with houses and private taxiways.
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I’ve been around animals my entire life, and I haven’t ever kicked one.

I just recently taught my !!Cat!! to walk on a leash and it did not involve any kicking or abuse whatsoever. Sounds like the guy is just a horses behind.
 
I’ve trained in the ringsports for nearly 20 years. We produce most of the dogs that law enforcement and the military use as our castoffs - knpv, French and mondo ring, nbvk……I’ve taken bites after bites after bites….

We don’t kick dogs. Ever.

We motivate them, raise their drive, agitate them, etc.

If you want to watch professional dog kicking, check out that idiot dog trainer Cesar Milan…



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
squincher said:
I've trained 14 bird dogs of my own over the years and absolutely love doing it. With this particular behavior, the dog could end up dead before you can give him enough treats to avoid the danger. Same reason snake proofing isn't done with treats. This isn't whoa-ing or holding steady to wing and shot. I've had a couple of stupid dogs over the years, and couple more that were just hardheaded. All good bird dogs, but the same approach won't work with all of them. Perhaps this guy knows his dog better than any of us and has good handle on what he needs.
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If a dog lunges so hard on a short leash it's a danger to itself and others the owner needs to re-evaluate whether that dog is ready for more stimulation.
 
A hard kick is probably never called for unless in case of a dog attack. But using your legs to aid in some correction seems fine. For example, my dog trainer that also trains K9s and service dogs instructed me to knee our bully in the chest when they jump on you for petting. I've seen that trainer also use slaps on the snout and pulling that flap of skin between the hip and torso. My dog came to us well trained and a verbal no is almost always sufficient. Use your judgement. Nothing hard or excessive. Just to get their attention. My dog was bite trained and the trainer was training her to keep the bite even while being distracted with grabbing and slaps to the head. I pull that bite pillow out and she absolutely loves it.
Without having witnessed the particular event myself it's hard to make a judgement. But follow your instinct, if you think the guy is kicking really hard frequently abusing the dog then I would say something. If he seems like he panicked to save his dog in the moment and the dog is fine, I think I can forgive that.
 
I would have said something to him, WTH?
Most dogs are just like their owners if they were raised from a pup.
You get what you put into them.
 
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farangutan said:
A hard kick is probably never called for unless in case of a dog attack. But using your legs to aid in some correction seems fine. For example, my dog trainer that also trains K9s and service dogs instructed me to knee our bully in the chest when they jump on you for petting. I've seen that trainer also use slaps on the snout and pulling that flap of skin between the hip and torso. My dog came to us well trained and a verbal no is almost always sufficient. Use your judgement. Nothing hard or excessive. Just to get their attention. My dog was bite trained and the trainer was training her to keep the bite even while being distracted with grabbing and slaps to the head. I pull that bite pillow out and she absolutely loves it.
Without having witnessed the particular event myself it's hard to make a judgement. But follow your instinct, if you think the guy is kicking really hard frequently abusing the dog then I would say something. If he seems like he panicked to save his dog in the moment and the dog is fine, I think I can forgive that.
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Kneeing a jumping dog in the chest is a little different than a kick. That's my space and their action has an immediate response, and its defensive. Not a kick 5 seconds later. Too much time has elapsed.

My trainer also told me about pinching that skin flap if she won't give. "You can make an alligator let go"
 
When I was a kid our dog used to chase cars on the road so one day we drove down the road and dumped a bucket of water on him.

Didn't work.
 
Silvaire said:
When I was a kid our dog used to chase cars on the road so one day we drove down the road and dumped a bucket of water on him.

Didn't work.
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I had a car chaser for 12 years until he got ran over by a fire truck as it went by our home with lights and sirens blaring. Definitely the dogs fault, the firemen's came back after the call to apologize.
 
Speaking of car chasers.

I had a girlfriend with a dog who would run out the door and around the yard like crazy. She was terrified it would get hit by a car. Any time I didn’t stop the dog, she would be angry and yell for the dog. I can hear her now , “Marley!! Marley!!! Come here!!! Marley!!!!’ She’d scold both of us after the incidents. After all, I opened the door when I visited.

I mentally dismissed the risk.

One day he ran out and started with the zoomies, ran into the street just as a car was driving by. We stood there horrified sure we were to watch the dog’s death. Literally ran into the front tire as it drove past and laid stunned on the pavement while I ran over to pick it up.

That was the end of the escapes, never did it again.
 
I'm shocked by the level of self righteous indignation on display here...

...considering the vast numbers of dead horsebeaters at POA

:deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse:
 
In Ohio it is iligal to harm an animal. Its called Goddard's Law. Depending on who and what they did its a different penalty from misdemeanor to a felony
 
My brother lived in the sticks for a while and used to travel a lot for business. They got a German Shepherd for protection that was I believe what they call it Schutzen trained... a real high level of protection training for when he was away because they figured the 911 was not going to be there in time should they need it. Hard to believe for a dog named Biscuit...

As an example when I would stay there, we had to leave the bedroom doors open at night because the dog would do rounds every hour or so, that is come up to the bed, sniff, and make sure you were there... if not it would bark to alert.. the dog was capable of some other cool stuff... like if I moved too fast towards my SIL it would immediately get between us... all she had to say was one word and I would have been toast. I am pretty sure she was tempted a few times :cool:

Anyway... I was talking to my brother about the dog and the training... from what he knows everything was positive reinforcement - or as he put it, they are working dogs, and this is what they love to do, the punishment would be taking it away. He also noted there was a lot of evaluation before they accepted the dog into the program.

Getting back to the OP, yeah I would say something.. but what information you're giving us here does not paint the whole scenario... do you have anything to add?
 

Justin M said:
Speaking of car chasers.

I had a girlfriend with a dog who would run out the door and around the yard like crazy. She was terrified it would get hit by a car. Any time I didn’t stop the dog, she would be angry and yell for the dog. I can hear her now , “Marley!! Marley!!! Come here!!! Marley!!!!’ She’d scold both of us after the incidents. After all, I opened the door when I visited.

I mentally dismissed the risk.

One day he ran out and started with the zoomies, ran into the street just as a car was driving by. We stood there horrified sure we were to watch the dog’s death. Literally ran into the front tire as it drove past and laid stunned on the pavement while I ran over to pick it up.

That was the end of the escapes, never did it again.
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Yup close calls with a little pain will definitely train a dog to be more streetwise.
But as the years go by they start to forget and start to respect the road less. Beware...
 
Walboy said:
I'm shocked by the level of self righteous indignation on display here...

...considering the vast numbers of dead horsebeaters at POA

:deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse:
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If the dog had already been dead I don't think as many of us would have been up-in-arms. Might have questioned why he was dragging a dead dog on a short leash and kicking it though . . . ;)
 
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