[NA]Modifying a new laptop[NA]

[Let'sgoflying!]

I am looking at standard laptops (not ultrathin, not 2-in-2, not gaming) and like most of the features on a few but they often come up short in some areas and I was wondering what the limits are on
-changing from a 128gb SSD to a 1TB (I see them from $100 to $10,000)
-upping the ram from 2.5 to 8gb
-changing out to a faster cpu

Ie how feasible or reasonable is it to buy a brand new Dell Inspiron and immediately swap out any of these three?
Yes it is cheaper to buy off the shelf what they offer but what would it take to do some of this, or is it even possible? Thinking physical compatibilities, possibly software limitations but I have no idea.
(Not really interested in building my own, although I know some of you can and recommend it; thanks)

 

[weilke]

If you order it through their website, you can specify all those things. Not sure you would save anything by swapping out components after you get the unit. Order it with the 'Pro' version of Win10, the separate boot media and the 'bloatware delete' option.

 

[RJM62]

I am looking at standard laptops (not ultrathin, not 2-in-2, not gaming) and like most of the features on a few but they often come up short in some areas and I was wondering what the limits are on
-changing from a 180gb SSD to a 1TB
-upping the ram from 2.5 to 8
-changing out to a faster cpu

Ie how feasible or reasonable is it to buy a brand new Dell Inspiron and immediately swap out any of these three?
Yes it is cheaper to buy off the shelf what they offer but what would it take to do some of this, or is it even possible? Thinking physical compatibilities, possibly software limitations but I have no idea.
(Not really interested in building my own, although I know some of you can and recommend it; thanks)

First of all, with laptops, nothing is universally true. Upgrades vary in their degree of difficulty from easy to impossible depending on the laptop's design. Dells are usually easier than most to work on, but there are exceptions.

That being said:

-changing from a 180gb SSD to a 1TB

It depends. If it's the sole drive on the system, then usually easy. Just clone the one to the other using either software and an external drive housing, or a drive replicator. The latter method may involve resizing the partition after cloning depending on the replicator. Not all of them do resizing.

If the SSD is the system drive and everything else is parked on a HDD (or if it's a hybrid drive set up that way), then it can be trickier. It's still not rocket surgery, mind you; but it requires more planning and a bit more work.

In the most common case in laptops (a hybrid drive), and preserving the factory partitioning scheme, the system partition would be cloned first and resized as needed, and then the data partition would be cloned into the remaining space. Most good cloning software will let you configure all this prior to starting the actual copy. The software that comes with the new drive, maybe not so much.

The other option, if you don't want to preserve the partitioning, would be to activate the machine with MS, download all the device-specific drivers and software from the manufacturer and save them to external storage, download the corresponding Windows version directly from Microsoft and let their media creator "burn" it to a bootable USB drive, remove the factory drive, install the new drive, and install Windows to it using the installer you downloaded from MS. In most cases it should activate without the Product Key because MS will "remember" the already-activated machine (but have the Product Key ready just in case).

The reasons for using the download from MS are that it will use the entire disk by default, it's likely to be more up-to-date, and it will contain less crapware. The manufacturer's restore media will probably assume the original partitioning scheme. But not always. If the first disk in the media is a standard Windows disk, then you can try that first if you want. (I still prefer the fresh download to minimize post-install updates.)

This is also safer than cloning because the factory drive is untouched, so it eliminates the possibility of user errors hosing the factory drive.

-upping the ram from 2.5 to 8

Usually easy. Just buy the right RAM and stay within the laptop's limits. Physically getting to the RAM may or may not be easy, depending on the laptop. On Dells it tends to be easy.

I always recommend using all identical sticks of RAM (same manufacturer, capacity, speed, etc.). This is not technically necessary, but I've found it further minimizes the already-slim chances of conflicts due to subtle differences between the sticks.

-changing out to a faster cpu

Ranges from very difficult to impossible, will usually void the warranty, has a high degree of possibility of damage to the system, may complicate Windows activation, and is almost never cost-effective. If nothing else, the laptop you buy should be configured with the processor you want from the factory.

Rich

EDIT: All of the above assumes that the drive is a standard SATA laptop drive. I've heard of a few cases where the SSD is integral with the mobo and can't be removed, but I have no idea if Dell has ever built any that way. I kind of doubt it.

If it's an M.2 drive, it can still be upgraded, but the procedure would be a bit different except in the case of a new full install (which would be identical to the SATA procedure).

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

Thanks guys

 

[wsuffa]

And all bets are off if it's an Apple.

 

[Kenny Phillips]

Buy it with the CPU you need, period. Add as much RAM as it will hold; that will be your biggest gain, period. Keep your data on the spinning drive, your programs on the SSD, don't bother to enlarge it unless you need more space.
What you don't want is to have as spares an SSD, some RAM, and a CPU that you may or many not use in the future.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

don't bother to enlarge it unless you need more space

Got the
-consider cpu fixed
-swap out ram as desired
-if hybrid, programs on ssd (was thinking one drive though; all SSD)
Are you saying not to upgrade the drive? Many are very very small; want to avoid an EHD.

 

[Skyrys62]

I agree with @RJM62 about Dell being easiest (from my experience).
I've also heard from HP rep., that if you mess with anything in their system you void the warranty. I can't verify, but I'm not buying their products anyway much.

Also agree to buy it like you want it regarding CPU/Memory...and probably SSD (size). Everything is under one warranty that way. The one exception is if you can get a MUCH better deal on the drive (or possibly) memory upgrade by doing it yourself. I rarely see enough difference in memory savings to worry too much about it, but the SSD drives seem to vary widely in price from pre-installed vs. adding later.
Plus with adding later, you get to keep the original drive for cloning, or anything else you dream up. (skeet shooting if it's 5400rpm)

 

[RJM62]

I agree with @RJM62 about Dell being easiest (from my experience).
I've also heard from HP rep., that if you mess with anything in their system you void the warranty. I can't verify, but I'm not buying their products anyway much.

Also agree to buy it like you want it regarding CPU/Memory...and probably SSD (size). Everything is under one warranty that way. The one exception is if you can get a MUCH better deal on the drive (or possibly) memory upgrade by doing it yourself. I rarely see enough difference in memory savings to worry too much about it, but the SSD drives seem to vary widely in price from pre-installed vs. adding later.
Plus with adding later, you get to keep the original drive for cloning, or anything else you dream up. (skeet shooting if it's 5400rpm)

One exception to my usual frugality is that I tend to buy laptops based on what I think I'll need five years from now. It's easier, and in the long run usually cheaper, to buy well-equipped laptops from the get-go.

Rich

 

[Skyrys62]

It's easier, and in the long run usually cheaper, to buy well-equipped laptops from the get-go.

Yep... plus you don't have to listen to as much complaining because it's slow. From either the wife, kids, or co-workers. (or yourself inventing new 4 letter words)

Sort of like airplanes...don't take long before you want more speed

 

[Spring Ford]

Check carefully the Max Ram. I am not up to date on current stuff but a few years ago low end laptops often had a Max RAM of 4G.

4G + 64bit windows is a bit of a disaster.

 

[jesse]

Way too much wild guessing in here.

- you will not realistically be able to change the CPU
- you will not be able to upgrade the RAM on some laptops as it will be soldered on the motherboard.
- you will not be able to upgrade the hard drive on some laptops as it will be soldered into the motherboard.

Download the manual for whatever laptop you are considering to verify what can be upgraded. There are no universal rules. Look at the actual documentation from the manufacturer and use that to guide your purchase.

My advice? Buy the damn laptop with what you need. Your time is better spent doing vet stuff and you’re talking minimal savings while exposing yourself to more risk. Even upgrading the memory is inviting stability problems. The OEM puts a lot of testing into their component choices.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

There are no universal rules.

thanks Jesse

 

[gkainz]

... There are no universal rules. ...

I think this is a universal rule.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

It seems like, in the past, replacing one or more of the three items was not a difficult task - hence my fantasy of modifying existing laptop offerings to get what I want.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

I have about settled on this one. Feel free to point out things you think I might not like.
I have a Latitude e6330 right now and want to replace it.
I've had it so long I need something very similar!

My must-have specs include
Win10 home or pro (for server access)
13.5" screen
backlit keyboard
1TB drive

my questions include:
-8gb RAM (what is the difference betweeen 1x8gb and 2x4gb? No $ difference.
-Screen resolution 1366 x 768 is what I use now, they offer 1920 x 1080 so I cannot see a reason to get the higher res; I chose the most basic display (-$126)
-WWAN capable not selected not sure what it is, or if I would need.
-Mobile broadband card not selected - is this to connect to the net when not in wifi range? (not needed)
-zero security/antivirus options selected - I think my BitDefender is adequate
-I have no idea what Intel WiFi 6 AX200 2x2 .11ax 160MHz is so did not select that

https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/sho...00/spd/latitude-13-5300-laptop/CTO03L530013US
it says $1309 but when you select the options I have above it comes to $1691
(the options selections are not saveable so I can only give a link to the basic selection)

 

[deonb]

I would not recommend going with Dell if you want to mod it. (In general I wouldn't go with Dell after they sent me 4 faulty/misconfigured laptops in a row...).

My current laptop is a Sager (https://www.sagernotebook.com) - and that thing is a dream to mod. Easier than a desktop even. I ordered it with 128gb HDD and immediately swapped it out with 12 TB's worth of SSD's (2x SATA 4TB, 2xNVME 2TB). All for cheaper than a 1 TB Apple laptop.

If you're looking at the Dell 5300, the Sager NP3145 is pretty similar in size and specs. Except it starts at $899 instead of $1309. Try it out:
https://www.sagernotebook.com/customize.php?productid=1556

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

I would not recommend going with Dell if you want to mod it.

Right- I gleaned that from other respondents above and planned to buy off-the-shelf.
Any thoughts on the linked offering?
Thanks

 

[weilke]

Win10 home or pro (for server access)

Pro

13.5" screen

Why would anyone ever want to have a larger screen. If I wanted to lug around a desktop, I would lug around a desktop.

backlit keyboard

Yes. Also select 'coffee proof' if that is an option.
(try to get your fingers on the different keyboard options, some are spongy rather than clicky and are really a pain to get used to).

1TB drive

SSD I assume ?

my questions include:
-8gb RAM (what is the difference betweeen 1x8gb and 2x4gb? No $ difference.

1 8GB gives you the option to stick in another 8GB when windows 11 comes out which will require 15GB minimum.

-Screen resolution 1366 x 768 is what I use now, they offer 1920 x 1080 so I cannot see a reason to get the higher res; I chose the most basic display (-$126)

Does the basic version have the same luminosity ? You can always dial the resolution down, you can't dial up the luminosity.

-WWAN capable not selected not sure what it is, or if I would need.

A cellular data chipset to put your laptop on a wireless 4G network like a cellphone.

-zero security/antivirus options selected - I think my BitDefender is adequate

Yes, install your own.

-I have no idea what Intel WiFi 6 AX200 2x2 .11ax 160MHz is so did not select that

Superfragilicious wifi adapter that only matters if you also have a .11ax network to log into. Supports some connection modes that are not 'published' yet and may be available on some proprietary equipment.

 

[John221us]

On Win 10, Home cannot join a domain (server), while Pro can. There is an easy upgrade path if you end up with Home, though.

 

[RJM62]

I have about settled on this one. Feel free to point out things you think I might not like.
I have a Latitude e6330 right now and want to replace it.
I've had it so long I need something very similar!

My must-have specs include
Win10 home or pro (for server access)
13.5" screen
backlit keyboard
1TB drive

my questions include:
-8gb RAM (what is the difference betweeen 1x8gb and 2x4gb? No $ difference.
-Screen resolution 1366 x 768 is what I use now, they offer 1920 x 1080 so I cannot see a reason to get the higher res; I chose the most basic display (-$126)
-WWAN capable not selected not sure what it is, or if I would need.
-Mobile broadband card not selected - is this to connect to the net when not in wifi range? (not needed)
-zero security/antivirus options selected - I think my BitDefender is adequate
-I have no idea what Intel WiFi 6 AX200 2x2 .11ax 160MHz is so did not select that

https://www.dell.com/en-us/work/sho...00/spd/latitude-13-5300-laptop/CTO03L530013US
it says $1309 but when you select the options I have above it comes to $1691
(the options selections are not saveable so I can only give a link to the basic selection)

That machine looks to me like it doesn't have the option for a SATA drive. That's fine if price is no object because m.2 drives are much faster, anyway. They're not bound by the legacy ATAPI standards that SATA was built to be compatible with. But they're also much more expensive. That 1TB m.2 drive will cost you + $460.01 over base. A 1TB SATA drive can be had from Micro Center for about $80.00 - $100.00. But if the laptop has no place to mount it, that's not an option.

Personally, I would go with Win10 Pro, use the 1TB m.2 SSD, and up the RAM to 16GB. But as I said in an earlier post, laptops are one of the few thing I don't skimp on. If you're looking to save coin, finding a laptop that can use a SATA SSD for data storage (you would use the m.2 for the OS and programs) will be a more economical choice with only minimal reduction in the subjective experience unless you regularly work with huge files.

Rich

 

[asicer]

That machine looks to me like it doesn't have the option for a SATA drive. That's fine if price is no object because m.2 drives are much faster, anyway. They're not bound by the legacy ATAPI standards that SATA was built to be compatible with.

m.2 is SATA. It's also NVME, which is what you are probably thinking of. m.2 is just a form factor that specified both SATA and PCIe (which in turn carries AHCI and NVME).

 

[deonb]

m.2 is SATA. It's also NVME, which is what you are probably thinking of. m.2 is just a form factor that specified both SATA and PCIe (which in turn carries AHCI and NVME).

Close. M.2 could be SATA. M.2 is just a connector format that supports multiple busses - one of which can be SATA.

But any of the busses can be left out by the manufacturer and SATA is commonly left out especially on the shorter M.2 slots (like the USB ones generally used for WiFi module).

On the flipside you also get some M.2 slots that only supports SATA.

M.2 is basically meant for people who don’t find the various USB3/4/Thunderbolt formats to be confusing enough...

 

[deonb]

Right- I gleaned that from other respondents above and planned to buy off-the-shelf.
Any thoughts on the linked offering?
Thanks

My link (Sager), or your link (Dell)?

 

[asicer]

M.2 is basically meant for people who don’t find the various USB3/4/Thunderbolt formats to be confusing enough...

Oh, I dunno. USB sets a pretty high bar for confusion. In front of me right now sits 9 different USB ports, each with different combinations of USB-C, USB-A, microUSB, USB2.0, USB3.0, USB3.2, USB BC, USB PD, Thunderbolt and DP over USB-C. And that's before getting into the PD profiles.

 

[RJM62]

m.2 is SATA. It's also NVME, which is what you are probably thinking of. m.2 is just a form factor that specified both SATA and PCIe (which in turn carries AHCI and NVME).

Perhaps I should have clarified that I meant m.2 NVMe versus 2.5-inch SATA; but the OP makes no claim of being a tech maven, so I think my answer was sufficiently confusing in context.

Rich

 

[RJM62]

On a more general note, you'll almost certainly get a better deal on a laptop about a week or two into September than you will now, especially in brick-and-mortar stores.

Rich

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

My link (Sager), or your link (Dell)?

Mine.

 

[RJM62]

What exactly do you need the machine to do, Dave?

Rich

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

Connect remotely to my work server
Very basic accounting/document production ie LibreOffice, Adobe
Internet (email, chrome browser)
keyboard lighting for the night-owl side
small for portability
No high level graphics or gaming
This e6330 has been so awesome I'd go for another (with larger harddrive) in a second.
I know I could do this cheaper but less expensive is not my goal, there are certain things I have grown to love and need.

@RJM62

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

On Win 10, Home cannot join a domain (server), while Pro can. There is an easy upgrade path if you end up with Home, though.

My IT guy says I can remote in to work on the server desktop, but I cannot "log onto a domain".
So, I am not fully savvy with the terms but he says I can do what I need.
So far he has not misled me.

 

[RJM62]

Connect remotely to my work server
Very basic accounting/document production ie LibreOffice, Adobe
Internet (email, chrome browser)
keyboard lighting for the night-owl side
small for portability
No high level graphics or gaming
This e6330 has been so awesome I'd go for another (with larger harddrive) in a second.
I know I could do this cheaper but less expensive is not my goal, there are certain things I have grown to love and need.

@RJM62

If you have a real computer store (Micro Center or Fry's come to mind) within a reasonable distance, you might be better off making an in-person visit and asking for guidance. I have limited experience with Fry's, but I've always found Micro Center's sales staff to be very customer-centric. I've sent many people there who walked out happy and remained happy with their purchases. Their salespeople may upsell (laptop cases and the like), but they tend not to oversell (sell you more machine than you need). At least that's been my experience.

The illuminated keyboard shifts the CG a little bit toward laptops designed for gamers, which typically will also include faster processors, more RAM, usually an SSD of generous size (some games use immense amounts of storage for scenery and the like), and better GPU's. However, because they're still stock configurations for that target market, it doesn't necessarily increase the cost over a "custom-built" machine.

In reality, very few Dell machines are custom-built, by the way. They've just become very good at anticipating every possible combination of configuration options and having those "custom" machines on hand. There's certainly nothing wrong with that. But they still tend to be more expensive than comparable machines sitting on a shelf in Micro Center waiting to be taken home (especially during the first or second week of September).

Rich

 

[SCCutler]

Dave lives in Sparrow Fart, Texas (so to speak).

But, his plane is so fast, he can fly to Dallas for tacos.

 

[weilke]

My IT guy says I can remote in to work on the server desktop, but I cannot "log onto a domain".
So, I am not fully savvy with the terms but he says I can do what I need.
So far he has not misled me.

With RDS (remote desktop, MS terminal services client), your server runs the software and just 'projects' a screen to your computer which only acts as a terminal. If you joined the computer to the domain, your computer has direct access to all your resources like printers, storage etc. and you could run your office software directly on it. The advantage of using a terminal server is that if you get disconnected during a remote session, that session continues to exist on the server and you just reconnect when you want to finish up. So for remote workers, it is often more stable rather than having them connect directly into the network and run the software local on their machine (there are of course times it has to be done that way, some software just doesn't work right through a terminal server).

 

[weilke]

Dave lives in Sparrow Fart, Texas (so to speak).

But, his plane is so fast, he can fly to Dallas for tacos.

He lives where they refer to Sparrow Fart as 'the city'.

 

[RJM62]

Dave lives in Sparrow Fart, Texas (so to speak).

But, his plane is so fast, he can fly to Dallas for tacos.

I live a two-and-a-half-hour drive from the nearest Micro Center, assuming no traffic. I still look for excuses to go there. The most recent one I used was that I had to get back the ten cents I'd paid for deposits on two cans of Bawls (a carbonated energy drink that they sell). I actually wrote a five-star review about the deposit because it gave me an excuse to go back to Micro Center, but they haven't published it -- yet.

They also never published the one where I suggested that I might look into hitching a ride on a helicopter to avoid the traffic in Yonkers, their store being on the top level of the mall. But they couldn't do anything about the Twitter post where I suggested that they give a particular employee a raise for being especially helpful, even above and beyond the usual excellent service.

The salespeople at Micro Center get commissions, so it's in their interest to sell. But if the product is returned for reasons other than being defective, it reflects poorly on them (and they also lose the commission). That tension results in their being unusually attentive to customers' needs and recommending the right products. Everyone I've ever sent there has been pleased with their purchase and the assistance they received.

They also stock literally anything remotely related to computers. When I was doing repairs, I went to the Westbury store for all kinds of obscure parts. They always had them in stock. I literally never walked out of the place with whatever thing I needed.

I don't like recommending specific computers to people because if they hate the computer, they blame it on me. But I've never had anyone complain about my sending them to Micro Center.

Rich

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

With RDS (remote desktop, MS terminal services client), your server runs the software and just 'projects' a screen to your computer which only acts as a terminal. If you joined the computer to the domain, your computer has direct access to all your resources like printers, storage etc. and you could run your office software directly on it. The advantage of using a terminal server is that if you get disconnected during a remote session, that session continues to exist on the server and you just reconnect when you want to finish up. So for remote workers, it is often more stable rather than having them connect directly into the network and run the software local on their machine (there are of course times it has to be done that way, some software just doesn't work right through a terminal server).

That sounds exactly what I have with my current "server access but no domain access" (when I lose the connection, I can get right back on and the desktop, all my work is still there untouched, also I can print things on the office computer - just did from 1500mi away in fact).
Moot. The laptop Im getting has Pro anyway.

 

[SCCutler]

I live a two-and-a-half-hour drive from the nearest Micro Center, assuming no traffic. I still look for excuses to go there. The most recent one I used was that I had to get back the ten cents I'd paid for deposits on two cans of Bawls (a carbonated energy drink that they sell). I actually wrote a five-star review about the deposit because it gave me an excuse to go back to Micro Center, but they haven't published it -- yet.

They also never published the one where I suggested that I might look into hitching a ride on a helicopter to avoid the traffic in Yonkers, their store being on the top level of the mall. But they couldn't do anything about the Twitter post where I suggested that they give a particular employee a raise for being especially helpful, even above and beyond the usual excellent service.

The salespeople at Micro Center get commissions, so it's in their interest to sell. But if the product is returned for reasons other than being defective, it reflects poorly on them (and they also lose the commission). That tension results in their being unusually attentive to customers' needs and recommending the right products. Everyone I've ever sent there has been pleased with their purchase and the assistance they received.

They also stock literally anything remotely related to computers. When I was doing repairs, I went to the Westbury store for all kinds of obscure parts. They always had them in stock. I literally never walked out of the place with whatever thing I needed.

I don't like recommending specific computers to people because if they hate the computer, they blame it on me. But I've never had anyone complain about my sending them to Micro Center.

Rich

I like Micro Center just fine. Mine is around four minutes from my office, and I buy all my office computers there. We are all RDP, as well, so the robust array of refurbs they stock work great for us. As you observe, the service is always top-notch.

For time savings, I always pre-buy on line, so I can bypass the interminable line of non-bathing tech geeks. We apparently buy enough to be on their "good customer" list, because every time I do that, they summon a manager to thank me for my business and ask me if there's anything they can do to improve the experience.

 

[RJM62]

I like Micro Center just fine. Mine is around four minutes from my office, and I buy all my office computers there. We are all RDP, as well, so the robust array of refurbs they stock work great for us. As you observe, the service is always top-notch.

For time savings, I always pre-buy on line, so I can bypass the interminable line of non-bathing tech geeks. We apparently buy enough to be on their "good customer" list, because every time I do that, they summon a manager to thank me for my business and ask me if there's anything they can do to improve the experience.

I used to be on that list when I lived Downstate. Now, not so much. I think it has to do with frequency of purchases as much as dollar value because even if I only bought some inexpensive item, Tom would come out to greet me. But I shopped there several times a week. I think they take that into consideration. It's a nice touch.

Their online pre-buy with pickup works out great for me because it guarantees that they'll have the thing I want waiting for me before I make the trip; but because they don't actually ring it up until I pick up the order, if I decide I want some other thing instead of the thing I ordered, it's an easy switch. There's no return because there was never any purchase. They just modify the order and ring it up.

The other thing I like is that I'm never the smartest guy in the store at Micro Center. If I'm smarter than the salesman, then what's the point? I may as well go to Walmart and deal with a nose-picking teenager. Micro Center hires genuine geeks who give good advice. Salespeople who know their products are worth every penny they earn.

Rich

 

[weilke]

That sounds exactly what I have with my current "server access but no domain access" (when I lose the connection, I can get right back on and the desktop, all my work is still there untouched, also I can print things on the office computer - just did from 1500mi away in fact).
Moot. The laptop Im getting has Pro anyway.

Based on Spikes recommendation, I have actually moved the in-office staff onto the terminal server. Just makes it easier to administer and as people float from room to room, their desktop just follows them (also bypasses a licensing bottleneck). Initially, I had some complaints, because you know, 'change is evil'. I just told them that a smooth talking texas aircraft mechanic made me do it....