[NA] Battery Longevity

wanttaja

wanttaja

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Ron Wanttaja
This is actually about a small truck, but the logic and information probably holds for aircraft.

I have an old small pickup truck that I keep in the hangar for times when I need to carry a sheet of plywood or a dirty or smelly load. It doesn't get used much...maybe 100 miles a year or so, if that. I should just sell it, but there are times that an old, crappy, beat-up pickup is worth it.

As you might expect, sitting so much is hard on the battery. I replaced the battery a couple of years back after finding it had discharged so low it wouldn't crank the engine. Thought I was being smart when I disconnected the battery completely so the truck couldn't stuck it down while it sat.

And, of course, when I went to use it yesterday, it wouldn't crank the engine enough to start it, even after having a battery charger on it for a couple of hours. I think one of the cells reversed; it was measuring about 11.5 volt after charging. I'm guessing it got sulfated, sitting there idle for so long.

So...getting ready to go out and buy a new battery for it. Basic question is: would I be better off with a different battery chemistry? (e.g., should I try to rig up an Odyssey dry cell in it). Is there a type of battery I can just disconnect, then charge it ~8 months later with good result?

If I go lead-acid again, I'm planning on hooking up a battery minder to it, even though the airport frowns on leaving stuff powered-up when no one is there.

Ron Wanttaja
 
I use the battery tenderizer on my infrequently used stuff. Had one in the municipal hangar for ages without anybody complaining. Yes, it is against the code to charge the battery in the aircraft/vehicle, but I don't call these maintainers "chargers."
 
another vote for a trickle charger...
 
Depending on how old it also might not hurt to install a battery disconnect or just unhook it to stop any slow drains.
 
Odyssey full charge shelf life in room temperature is 2 years. Pretty handy. I believe the top guys that put Odyssey on the map started their own brand "Northstar" and those are supposed to be top notch.
 
I keep the Archer plugged into a maintainer.
 
I should point out that sulfonation isn't usually a problem unless you allow the battery to spend time discharged below 75%. Even a simple battery tenderizer that will maintain a decent charge will work.

The cheapest-ass (24 month car battery will hold up like that for a long time. I've got one on my generator which typically cranks the thing once a week. The only time I really killed the battery was when the float charger died.
 
wanttaja said:
If I go lead-acid again, I'm planning on hooking up a battery minder to it,
Click to expand...
FWIW: keep it simple and cheap, stick with a plain lead acid. Any battery will self-discharge over time sitting unused. If you plan to leave the new battery connected along with the use of a battery minder, check to make sure you have no parasitic drain from the trucks electrical system. Even with a charger installed the constant drain/charge cycles will reduce its useful life. Or simply disconnect the cables from the truck. Another trick is to check that the battery minder is maintaining a full charge. All in all theres no reason you cant get 5-7+ years out of a lead acid if you follow the basics, whether in a truck or aircraft.
 
+1 for KISS principle. A good 'ole traditional cheap auto battery + a battery tender and a promise to drive it 30 minutes or so once or twice a month. If nothing else, you'll burn the crap off the oil, charge the battery and maybe make that trip to the dump you keep putting off.
 
Another vote for battery tender. We use them on everything that that doesn't get started for weeks at a time. We have them on the boat, jet ski, motorcycles, muscle cars, tractors, etc. Batteries last for 6-7 years on average for us.
 
My dad used to go through tractor batteries every couple years when letting them sit through the winter in the garage, until I sold him on battery tenders.
 
Battery maintainer.

20 bucks or so at Tractor Supply.

Works great. Hook it up and leave it. That is until you drive the truck. Doesn't boil over the battery.
 
wanttaja said:
This is actually about a small truck, but the logic and information probably holds for aircraft.

I have an old small pickup truck that I keep in the hangar for times when I need to carry a sheet of plywood or a dirty or smelly load. It doesn't get used much...maybe 100 miles a year or so, if that. I should just sell it, but there are times that an old, crappy, beat-up pickup is worth it.

As you might expect, sitting so much is hard on the battery. I replaced the battery a couple of years back after finding it had discharged so low it wouldn't crank the engine. Thought I was being smart when I disconnected the battery completely so the truck couldn't stuck it down while it sat.

And, of course, when I went to use it yesterday, it wouldn't crank the engine enough to start it, even after having a battery charger on it for a couple of hours. I think one of the cells reversed; it was measuring about 11.5 volt after charging. I'm guessing it got sulfated, sitting there idle for so long.

So...getting ready to go out and buy a new battery for it. Basic question is: would I be better off with a different battery chemistry? (e.g., should I try to rig up an Odyssey dry cell in it). Is there a type of battery I can just disconnect, then charge it ~8 months later with good result?

If I go lead-acid again, I'm planning on hooking up a battery minder to it, even though the airport frowns on leaving stuff powered-up when no one is there.

Ron Wanttaja
Click to expand...
I happen to think you would be better off getting rid of the pickup and buying a utility trailer. I have one I bought about 40 years ago (from a guy who built them in his back yard). Steel frame,
plywood sides and bed. I finally replaced the wood a few years ago, and the tires last year. Other than that, no maintenance, registration or insurance (and no battery required)! I use it for all
sorts of things, like hauling appliances, motorcycles, trash etc. It lives in the yard, and my gardener fills it up with yard debris - which I then haul to the dump. Made a self-unloading adapter
with some old tire chains, some 2 X 4s and a nylon strap - so getting rid of the load is a snap. It has 3/4 ton axles, but I have carried over a ton no problem. Can't beat it.

Dave
 
Stewartb said:
Odyssey full charge shelf life in room temperature is 2 years. Pretty handy.
Click to expand...

I use an Odyssey battery in my aircraft and replace it every two to three years because my plane is electrically dependent. One battery I took out after replacing it (it still checked good) was put in my storage shed. Nearly two years later I went to get it to put in my lawn tractor but thinking it would be discharged. Nope ... fired it right up. I'm very pleased with the service I have gotten form Odyssey batteries. They cost a bit more but they are worth is IMHO. "

"Buy the best and cry once."

Edit: I have an Odyssey approved battery tender for my Odyssey PC-680 ... but I have never needed to use it.
 
An AGM (aka sealed lead acid) will last longer than a traditional car battery in the situation you described, assuming your alternator does not overcharge it (AGMs float charge at 13.7 vs wet cells at 14.2)

But a cheap car battery on a $20 battery tender/trickle charger will last longer for cheaper. If you have a “smart” battery charger, it likely has a tender/maintained setting already, or if you have an older charger with a float or trickle setting it could be used.

If I thought you might own a plane with an electrical system, I would just suggest you pigtail to your plane’s battery maintainer when you are flying to top off your truck occasionally, but I doubt your fly baby needs that.
 
flyingron said:
National Electrical Code. It's been that way for decades.
Click to expand...
I guess auto mechanics did not get the word on that. They typically charge batteries in the vehicle, and often near electrical machinery and combustion heaters. Oh, the humanity!
 
My spare hangar car has an AGM battery and a battery maintainer. If I dont use it for two weeks or so, I try to drive it for a few miles to keep the tires from getting rumbly.
 
flyingron said:
National Electrical Code. It's been that way for decades.
Click to expand...

So is it against the National Electrical Code to charge the battery of an electric vehicle, in your garage? Or does that apply only to a certain type of battery?
 
I have quite a few engines to feed.

Truck like the OP
Car that sits
Boat
Harley
Mowers x 3
Tractor
PA46
Several Freightliner Tractors

I am another voice in a sea of voices recommending a trickle charger...

The last boat battery lasted 10 years. The Harley battery 8 or 9 years. The John Deere tractor...8ish years.

Not too shabby...now if I could get the PA 46 batteries to last three years, I'd brag. :D:D
 
NoHeat said:
So is it against the National Electrical Code to charge the battery of an electric vehicle, in your garage? Or does that apply only to a certain type of battery?
Click to expand...
It's batteries installed in aircraft in hangars.
 
Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll probably go with a cheap lead-acid battery and a trickle charger. May tuck the battery out of sight with the charger on it, so I don't have to run extension cords obviously through the hangar. Drive the truck so rarely that re-installing the battery is no big thing.

Ron Wanttaja
 
Ron,

I kept our Ranger p/u after I retired from consultant work just in case I needed to haul something or have a replacement vehicle for our two SUV's. I used a trickle charge/maintainer at all times, same as the plane. Battery never gave me a problem. We eventually sold the p/u, deciding it wasn't worth the hassle of moving it around when I wanted to fly. I do miss that little buggy.
 
flyingron said:
I use the battery tenderizer on my infrequently used stuff. Had one in the municipal hangar for ages without anybody complaining. Yes, it is against the code to charge the battery in the aircraft/vehicle, but I don't call these maintainers "chargers."
Click to expand...

Going to spiral the thread, but how does NEC handle the people with the giant lithium battery fire bombs from the EV car makers in their suburban garages?

I rarely see anyone add fire break/fire stop between the house structure and the garage when they hang a high current true charger on the garage wall.

Our place had a code mandate of even a steel fire door between house and garage when the then owners in the 80s bolted a three car garage on one end of the house, and all cable and other connections fire stopped similar to commercial construction... but I never see it here on newer construction.

So just a curious boy here once you said it’s in the NEC not to “charge” things.

Of course there’s 14 “sealed” lead acids sitting in mine on “maintainers” right now and been there as long as we have lived here. LOL.

It’s really the only way to deal with lead acid self-discharge. Some of those batteries are pushing two decades old and show zero sign of capacity or current draw loss. A number of them came out of a data center that had a mandatory replacement cycle, even though the batteries were just fine.

A couple of the original 20 were abused by both my dad and myself over the years and were not kept on “maintainers” properly when not in use. They died. Usually a single cell died and wouldn’t take a charge and became resistive and even the fancy de-sulfating chargers wouldn’t rescue them.
 
Maybe this one will last a long time...



787-Long-12V-200AH-WPL200-Battery.jpg
 
flyingron said:
It's batteries installed in aircraft in hangars.
Click to expand...

I’m still trying to understand your point, when you wrote “Yes, it is against the code to charge the battery in the aircraft/vehicle”

Are you now saying that the national electric code specifically prohibits charging batteries within aircraft parked in a hangar, but it does not prohibit charging car batteries in a vehicle parked in a garage?
 
It's exactly what I'm saying.
 
I love my battery tenders.
I have one for each motorcycle, one for each car, and one for the (class 3) Lincoln Welder. When the power goes out, I use the welder as a generator. It's 220 volts, 14KW and will run the entire house.
 
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