N. Las Vegas Mid-air

t3chiman said:
Agree that voice commands have an immediacy that text messages can't match.
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So you have a system using both.

Text for "routine" things, voice for immediate things.

Text for Clearance Delivery and Taxi Route. Frequency remains clear for radio calls of issues.

Modern military fighters do this. They actually send digital text messages in short burst versus radio calls.
 
Pinecone said:
So you have a system using both.

Text for "routine" things, voice for immediate things.

Text for Clearance Delivery and Taxi Route. Frequency remains clear for radio calls of issues.

Modern military fighters do this. They actually send digital text messages in short burst versus radio calls.
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I was wondering when TDL was going to he brought up. Things didn’t really start to change until symbology made it to the hud/helmet since that put digital situational awareness in the pilot’s line of sight in a portion of flight that was primarily a heads up/visual look out environment.

IMHO, until we get to a similar level of technology, it’s not the safest thing in the world to he splitting your time heads down then visually looking out trying to acquire traffic in the terminal environment.

Watching Bryan with a Y do this in his Oshkosh video was interesting. And that was with two people in the cockpit visually looking for traffic while using ADSB as an SA builder.
 
Looking at the ground track of the Piper, I'm wondering if they were over the field when cleared for 30L, and if the fact that when looking to the ends of 30L/30R when over the field, they can seem reversed, and if that may have played into their error...? (If I'm making sense...in other words, from in the plane, your right is 30L, and your left is 30R...I made a drawing to illustrate)

RL.jpg
 
Pinecone said:
You can't just name the FAA. You cannot sue the US Gov unless they allow you to do so.
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The FAA has been sued numerous times for controller negligence.
 
Country Flier said:
Looking at the ground track of the Piper, I'm wondering if they were over the field when cleared for 30L, and if the fact that when looking to the ends of 30L/30R when over the field, they can seem reversed, and if that may have played into their error...? (If I'm making sense...in other words, from in the plane, your right is 30L, and your left is 30R...I made a drawing to illustrate)

View attachment 109283
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Well, 5 out of 4 pilots can be dilsexic, but if you were turning towards the runway, you'd have to be a bit not paying attention if you didn't check the windsock, look at the runway IDs, and honestly, this would have been a place to be spotting aircraft that might be on final, and trying to build your mental picture. If anything, that makes it seem like a worse accident.
 
Do you need permission to sue the government? No, but you must comply with the provisions of the Federal Tort Claims Act. In 1946, Congress passed the Federal Tort Claims Act which allows plaintiffs injured by the negligent acts of federal employees to file claims against the United States for damages.Jul 21, 2022
upload_2022-8-1_9-35-54.png
https://nationaltriallaw.com › sue-the...
If you are injured by the U.S. government, can you sue?
 
RyanShort1 said:
Well, 5 out of 4 pilots can be dilsexic, but if you were turning towards the runway, you'd have to be a bit not paying attention if you didn't check the windsock, look at the runway IDs, and honestly, this would have been a place to be spotting aircraft that might be on final, and trying to build your mental picture. If anything, that makes it seem like a worse accident.
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5 out of 4 can be dyslexic. Lol. Good one.
 
TCABM said:
I was wondering when TDL was going to he brought up. Things didn’t really start to change until symbology made it to the hud/helmet since that put digital situational awareness in the pilot’s line of sight in a portion of flight that was primarily a heads up/visual look out environment.

IMHO, until we get to a similar level of technology, it’s not the safest thing in the world to he splitting your time heads down then visually looking out trying to acquire traffic in the terminal environment.

Watching Bryan with a Y do this in his Oshkosh video was interesting. And that was with two people in the cockpit visually looking for traffic while using ADSB as an SA builder.
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The one downside is loss of situation awareness of hearing instructions to other aircraft and going, HEY THAT IS NOT GOOD.

But it would be a nice backup to the voice. N12345 Climb and maintain 9000, with a text message to the GPS or glass panel saying the same thing.

But for taxi clearance and clearance delivery, I can see it at a busy airport. And Foreflight already has the automated clearance delivery.
 
Velocity173 said:
Oh you can bet there will be a lawsuit in this case. Doesn’t even matter that there’s no prescribed separation involved. “Exercise reasonable care in providing air traffic control services.”

https://www.motleyrice.com/article/moncks-corner-mid-air-collision-lawsuit
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There was actually a lawsuit that was decided just a few months ago over the Florida midair back in 2018. That one happened outside of the Class D but they still attempted to sue the FAA. They were not successful in that one.
 
Don't be this guy.... not sure if this was posted here, but as the Jet prop was coming in some guy recognized the couple and tried to start a casual conversation on tower frequency. I've had this happen on a busy CTAF frequency but never heard more than a "Hi so and so" then "Hi" on tower or ATC. I don't think it affected this flight, but still a dumb thing to do.

From the article:
"
‘Uncalled-for communication’

In a phone interview Wednesday, McSpadden said publicly available recordings between an air traffic controller and Scanlon in the Piper show that as the plane was approaching the airport, Scanlon tells the controller about the Piper’s descent for preparation to land when a person, presumably another pilot, briefly jumps in on the air traffic control channel conversation.


The unidentified man attempts to start a casual conversation with Scanlon as the Piper approaches the airfield.

“North Las Vegas Tower N97cx descending out of 7,000 feet for landing on 30L, and uh, now we’re set to cross mid-field,” Scanlon is heard telling the air traffic controller when the man’s voice interjects.

“Hello, Carol,” the man says.


“Hi!” Scanlon responds.

“Where you going? Where you coming from?” the man asks Scanlon.

McSpadden said the unidentified man heard in the recording is likely another pilot in the area. Such an interjection, McSpadden said, was ill-advised.

“Every pilot who heard that cringed,” McSpadden said. “It’s uncalled for communication. It is unprofessional. And, it may even be problematic from a rules standpoint.

“There are two things wrong with it. You just don’t engage in any type of extraneous chatter like that on a formal frequency like a tower frequency. You don’t distract a pilot when they are coming in to land in the most critical phase of flight. … It was out of line, it was out of place, and at the very least it was a distraction.”"




Pilot in deadly NLV airport crash likely flew toward wrong runway | Las Vegas Review-Journal (reviewjournal.com)
 
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