MMSD vs. MMSL?

dans2992

dans2992

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Dans2992
I am planning a trip down to Cabo in July. MMSD is closer to my final destination, but I've heard good things about MMSL. MMSL is only a 1/2 hour drive according to google anyhow.

Any suggestions on which would be better? I am in a Piper Comanche and plan to fly non-stop from the US, so this will be my AOE. I will have 4 other people with me.

--Dan
 
Have been to both. Where are you staying? We just went into MMSL last week and it was an AWESOME experience. Lots and lots of help, great price, and they don't even accept tips so the service is top notch. Really great place.

If you're staying in San Jose Del Cabo, MMSD is closer. Otherwise MMSL is closer to downtown Cabo San Lucas.
 
We're staying in San Jose, but MMSL has gotten such good reviews, I'm thinking we'll probably go there.

Is the "handler" service worth it?
 
The nice thing about MMSL is that you don't need a handler. The FBO takes care of it all for you. The service was truly outstanding when I was there.
 
Ahh, ok. I thought they charged an extra $100 for that.

Good to know.

Dan
 
Can anyone comment on this with info? I e-mailed MMSL, they said they want to charge me $360 USD for a single Mooney for one night, which includes a $4.29 landing fee, a $2 embarking/disembarking fee, a $13.42 parking fee, a $31.59 "boarding passenger" fee and a $138.82 (WTF) "handling" fee, and then they want to charge me another $170.75 in "immigration" fees even though I'm already clearing customs in Ensenada. That does not seem like "quite reasonable" fees... And yes, I verified this was USD and not pesos.

Help!
 
frcabot said:
Can anyone comment on this with info? I e-mailed MMSL, they said they want to charge me $360 USD for a single Mooney for one night, which includes a $4.29 landing fee, a $2 embarking/disembarking fee, a $13.42 parking fee, a $31.59 "boarding passenger" fee and a $138.82 (WTF) "handling" fee, and then they want to charge me another $170.75 in "immigration" fees even though I'm already clearing customs in Ensenada. That does not seem like "quite reasonable" fees... And yes, I verified this was USD and not pesos.

Help!
Click to expand...

Do you speak Spanish? If not you're screwed for a discount. You may or may not be able to negotiate it these days. I just paid the Mexican government and Port of Ensenada $790 to let the ship discharge a yacht, and get it cleared in, and my outbound clearance. (Did that price include your outbound? That may be the 'handling fee'). It used to be you could throw a $20 on the counter in Cabo and everything was handled, but those days are gone from what I saw over New Years. It is now very 'Americanized' in how things operate.
 
Henning said:
Do you speak Spanish? If not you're screwed for a discount. You may or may not be able to negotiate it these days. I just paid the Mexican government and Port of Ensenada $790 to let the ship discharge a yacht, and get it cleared in, and my outbound clearance. (Did that price include your outbound? That may be the 'handling fee'). It used to be you could throw a $20 on the counter in Cabo and everything was handled, but those days are gone from what I saw over New Years. It is now very 'Americanized' in how things operate.
Click to expand...

What's odd is I've seen other posts online about how "reasonable" the fees at MMSL are. So I must be getting taken advantage of or something. Here's the e-mail exchange I had with the government FBO:



On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 7:37 PM, Operaciones <xxx@acsl.com.mx> wrote:

Hello,

Yes, the quote is in USD. We are charging you
$188 pesos per day for parking.
$60 pesos of landing

Because it is an international fee,bording and handling is a bit higher.

If you would stay for a week or more we can make you a discount on parking.

Best,

Luis A Romo
MMSL FBO
Cabo San Lucas International Airport
Tel +52(624)124-55-00
Fax +52(624)124-55-50

#1 Mexican FBO in the 2014 Pilots’ Choice Awards
#1 Mexican FBO in the 2014 Pro Pilot PRASE Survey




De: xxx [mailto:xxx@gmail.com]
Enviado el: martes, 3 de febrero de 2015 19:45

Para: Operaciones
Asunto: Re: Question re fees and 100LL prices


Hello,

This is in US dollars? $360 USD seems high for a single engine four seat plane? Your website shows the following fees http://www.acsl.com.mx/fees.html:
-Landing 60 pesos minimum
-Boarding 12.20 pesos
-Parking 75 peso minimum
-Airport Use Fee 240.00 pesos per passenger

For a total of about 387 pesos or $26 USD? So how does $26 USD turn into $360 USD?

Also please keep in mind that we are clearing customs in Ensenada (MMES) and will be proceeding to Puerto Vallarta MMPR after departing, so they are both domestic.

Are you sure that the figures you provided are correct?



On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 6:38 PM, Operaciones <xxx@acsl.com.mx> wrote:
Hello Mr. xxx,

Attached you will find the quote that you requested us,

It covers a 24 hours parking, 1 PAX, all airport and authorities fees.

Hope to see you in Cabo San Lucas soon, have a great evening,

Please if you have any other question don’t hesitate to ask us,

Best,



Luis A Romo
MMSL FBO
Cabo San Lucas International Airport
Tel +52(624)124-55-00
Fax +52(624)124-55-50
#1 Mexican FBO in the 2014 Pilots’ Choice Awards
#1 Mexican FBO in the 2014 Pro Pilot PRASE Survey
 
You have a miscommunication or someone trying to shaft you, you are going to pay $26 USD. The stuff said Pesos (in Mexico $ stands for Peso, it has two vertical lines for US Dollars.)

Edit: is there fuel in the $360USD quote?
 
No fuel. Pretty sure they're trying to shaft me. I'm not sure where the miscommunication could be as I was pretty clear.
 
frcabot said:
No fuel. Pretty sure they're trying to shaft me. I'm not sure where the miscommunication could be as I was pretty clear.
Click to expand...


Must be Mistake.

One note. The airport fees are always low. The fbo can charge whatever they want for their services.

If you don't want the fbo service, and have cleared customs.
Just park at the ga ramp.
Give gas ring or gave and they will pump gas.

Enjoy
 
The fees when I went to MMSL seemed higher than what I thought they'd be. On the other hand, the FBO took care of _everything_. Literally, I handed them our passports, they asked me a few questions to fill out the flight plan and we were out of there.

The following year, I went to La Paz. There still seemed to be an "excessive" amount of fees, however I had to go from window to window, playing charades (I don't speak Spanish), coming up with various amounts of pesos and completing seemingly endless paperwork. It took quite a while and was complicated, as was chasing down the fuel truck.

So, you pay more at MMSL, but you will get better service. They even took a picture of the plane touching down and presented me with a large print of it as I was leaving. (Not that I wanted to pay for that, mind you).

Have you tried getting a quote from MMSD?


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dans2992 said:
The fees when I went to MMSL seemed higher than what I thought they'd be. On the other hand, the FBO took care of _everything_. Literally, I handed them our passports, they asked me a few questions to fill out the flight plan and we were out of there.

The following year, I went to La Paz. There still seemed to be an "excessive" amount of fees, however I had to go from window to window, playing charades (I don't speak Spanish), coming up with various amounts of pesos and completing seemingly endless paperwork. It took quite a while and was complicated, as was chasing down the fuel truck.

So, you pay more at MMSL, but you will get better service. They even took a picture of the plane touching down and presented me with a large print of it as I was leaving. (Not that I wanted to pay for that, mind you).

Have you tried getting a quote from MMSD?


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Click to expand...
What were the fees like and when were you there?
 
Also at MMSL there is a "no tips" policy and they provided a prop-lock.


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dans2992 said:
Also at MMSL there is a "no tips" policy and they provided a prop-lock.


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Click to expand...
That's all fine and well but I'm still not paying $360. The fbo and landing fee combined at sfo is 200 and that airport is 30 times the size.
 
frcabot said:
What were the fees like and when were you there?
Click to expand...


I'm trying to find them in my email. When I added everything up at the end, I think it is similar to what you were quoted. We had 5 people, and thus more immigration fees.

How many are in your party?


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2, but again why would I be paying immigration fees if my port of entry is Ensenada?
 
frcabot said:
That's all fine and well but I'm still not paying $360. The fbo and landing fee combined at sfo is 200 and that airport is 30 times the size.
Click to expand...


Hey, I'm not saying it's a great deal or anything. Just giving the facts.... ;)

This is Mexico. Having been to only one other airport in Mexico, the MMSL fees are high, but not radically more than my other (limited) Mexico experience.


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frcabot said:
2, but again why would I be paying immigration fees if my port of entry is Ensenada?
Click to expand...


Agreed, it does not seem right. Why are you entering in Endenada anyway? Why not just use MMSL as your airport of entry.


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Because Oakland to MMSL is an 8 hour flight and I have a 5 hr tank? And I don't particularly feel like flying 8 hours in a single go. Whereas MMES is about the halfway point so seems like a good place for a stop plus it's pretty.
 
frcabot said:
Because Oakland to MMSL is an 8 hour flight and I have a 5 hr tank? And I don't particularly feel like flying 8 hours in a single go. Whereas MMES is about the halfway point so seems like a good place for a stop plus it's pretty.
Click to expand...

Brown Field in San Diego, if you use that for fuel and inbound, your life will be simpler.
 
frcabot said:
What were the fees like and when were you there?
Click to expand...


I just PM'ed you the quote I got. Seems on par with what they're telling you, except I used MMSL as my airport of arrival and my airport of departure from Mexico.


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Henning said:
Brown Field in San Diego, if you use that for fuel and inbound, your life will be simpler.
Click to expand...


That's what I'd do. Keep the number of landings in Mexico to a minimum for simplicity.


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dans2992 said:
That's what I'd do. Keep the number of landings in Mexico to a minimum for simplicity.


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Click to expand...

I really want to stop in Ensenada though, I've never been and it's supposed to be quite nice. I know fuel at Brown Field is quite cheap so maybe on the way back we'll make that our stop. After Cabo the goal is to go to Puerto Vallarta via Mazatlan (yes, the 178nm water crossing makes me nervous). And I'd have to stop somewhere else on the way back anyways since MMPR to KSDM is out of my range -- probably Hermosillo.
 
As reference , if no fbo is involved, and no immigration
You do not need to close a flight plan. It is done automatically when you arrive.
When you leave you need to go to SENEAM office to file the flight plan, then with the flight plan go to the Operations office which usually is nearby, and pay the landing, overnight and take off fees, they will stamp the flight plan, then go to Comandancia to "send" the plan and get the last rubber stamp



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frcabot said:
I really want to stop in Ensenada though, I've never been and it's supposed to be quite nice. I know fuel at Brown Field is quite cheap so maybe on the way back we'll make that our stop. After Cabo the goal is to go to Puerto Vallarta via Mazatlan (yes, the 178nm water crossing makes me nervous). And I'd have to stop somewhere else on the way back anyways since MMPR to KSDM is out of my range -- probably Hermosillo.
Click to expand...

Then you will get the immigration receipt there, present it in Cabo and they won't hit you that again.
 
agidi said:
As reference , if no fbo is involved, and no immigration
You do not need to close a flight plan. It is done automatically when you arrive.
When you leave you need to go to SENEAM office to file the flight plan, then with the flight plan go to the Operations office which usually is nearby, and pay the landing, overnight and take off fees, they will stamp the flight plan, then go to Comandancia to "send" the plan and get the last rubber stamp



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Click to expand...

Thanks. That confirms what I've read through various sources like AOPA and my Mexico guide. So I wonder if these fees are just for the FBO and if it's possible to bypass the FBO altogether then in MMSL? Why should I have to pay for a $150 USD "handling" fee?
 
Was it $150? My "handling" fee was $80. I believe MMSL is technically a privately owned airport, so you may need to go elsewhere to avoid the fees.

Are you looking for good beach spots?


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I fuel at MMTC, there are two fbo which I don't use, one is really really chic, gets very high end traffic thus it is quite costly.
But you can skip the fbo.
I'll try to reach a buddy of mine that flies frequently to cabos and ask him. I'll try to report back here. ;)


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dans2992 said:
Was it $150? My "handling" fee was $80. I believe MMSL is technically a privately owned airport, so you may need to go elsewhere to avoid the fees.

Are you looking for good beach spots?


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Click to expand...
Yep, $139 or so. It's in my initial post in this thread.
 
agidi said:
I fuel at MMTC, there are two fbo which I don't use, one is really really chic, gets very high end traffic thus it is quite costly.
But you can skip the fbo.
I'll try to reach a buddy of mine that flies frequently to cabos and ask him. I'll try to report back here. ;)


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Click to expand...
Thanks, would really really appreciate it. If I can skip the fbo and avoid the handling and boarding fees and all that nonsense, that would make all the difference. Unfortunately MMTC is quite a bit out of our flight plan.
 
I fly to mexico all the time. the only government requirements are an entry permit for the aircraft (one time 700 pesos) or you can get a multi entry permit (similar to the cbp decal) that lasts for a year for the same amount. there's some paper work requirement, the usual stuff; insurance, registration, airworthiness, etc. other than this the airport/fbo may charge a parking fee on a tiedown/hangar. I have never seen "handling fees". we are used to fly in all the time i was friends with the ramp guy and he would usually tow, clean, top off the airplane and take care of the paper work for 200 pesos. i would just park in the ramp and not get charged at all except after a while they would expect me to get some gas. the main difference in flying in mexico from flying in the usa is that you ALWAYS have to file a flight plan.
 
cirrusmx said:
I fly to mexico all the time. the only government requirements are an entry permit for the aircraft (one time 700 pesos) or you can get a multi entry permit (similar to the cbp decal) that lasts for a year for the same amount. there's some paper work requirement, the usual stuff; insurance, registration, airworthiness, etc. other than this the airport/fbo may charge a parking fee on a tiedown/hangar. I have never seen "handling fees". we are used to fly in all the time i was friends with the ramp guy and he would usually tow, clean, top off the airplane and take care of the paper work for 200 pesos. i would just park in the ramp and not get charged at all except after a while they would expect me to get some gas. the main difference in flying in mexico from flying in the usa is that you ALWAYS have to file a flight plan.
Click to expand...
Have you flown into MMSL specifically? If so do you have a contact I can confirm the charges with? I agree that the handling fee seems super sketch and unnecessary.
 
LOL, I just got a quote back from "Manny Aviation Services" Mexico for MMSL: total is $815.31 US Dollars... ROFL. A $261.37 "coordination, representation & arrangements" fee, a $71 "access to plataform [sic]" fee, a $202 "handling supervision" fee, a $22 "communications fee"... I kid you not.

Mexican economy must really be hurting, eh?
 
frcabot said:
LOL, I just got a quote back from "Manny Aviation Services" Mexico for MMSL: total is $815.31 US Dollars... ROFL. A $261.37 "coordination, representation & arrangements" fee, a $71 "access to plataform [sic]" fee, a $202 "handling supervision" fee, a $22 "communications fee"... I kid you not.

Mexican economy must really be hurting, eh?
Click to expand...

Yeah, Tourism is the mainstay of all the coastal economies, they have nothing else. If you don't like the numbers you're seeing, you'd **** yourself if you saw how much wealth I redistribute into local coastal economies.:rofl:
 
frcabot said:
LOL, I just got a quote back from "Manny Aviation Services" Mexico for MMSL: total is $815.31 US Dollars... ROFL. A $261.37 "coordination, representation & arrangements" fee, a $71 "access to plataform [sic]" fee, a $202 "handling supervision" fee, a $22 "communications fee"... I kid you not.



Mexican economy must really be hurting, eh?
Click to expand...


Guess I won't be going back there any more!
 
cirrusmx said:
I fly to mexico all the time. the only government requirements are an entry permit for the aircraft (one time 700 pesos) or you can get a multi entry permit (similar to the cbp decal) that lasts for a year for the same amount. there's some paper work requirement, the usual stuff; insurance, registration, airworthiness, etc. other than this the airport/fbo may charge a parking fee on a tiedown/hangar. I have never seen "handling fees". we are used to fly in all the time i was friends with the ramp guy and he would usually tow, clean, top off the airplane and take care of the paper work for 200 pesos. i would just park in the ramp and not get charged at all except after a while they would expect me to get some gas. the main difference in flying in mexico from flying in the usa is that you ALWAYS have to file a flight plan.
Click to expand...


There is also a "per person" charge for arrival and departure, isn't there?
 
dans2992 said:
There is also a "per person" charge for arrival and departure, isn't there?
Click to expand...

From whom? Government of FBO? I think I paid the government $27peso in and out for me. I don't know if he was referring to a multi entry permit for the plane, the people, or both.
 
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