Just got a new plane, Cherokee from a Cessna, what to expect?

tawood

tawood

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Tim
Hello all,
Recently sold my Cessna 150, and bought a Cherokee 140, as I needed 3 seats instead of 2. I'm wondering how the Cherokee will handle as compared to the Cessna...I keep reading how a Cherokee is almost "too easy" (which is exactly how I felt about the Cessna, if there is such a thing).
Although many years ago now, in the past I've also owned a 172, Tomahawk, and a Taylorcraft....I'm wondering if the Cherokee will be most like the Tomahawk (which to me was the easiest flying aircraft I've ever been in), being that they are both low wing pipers.
Thanks!
 
tawood said:
Hello all,
Recently sold my Cessna 150, and bought a Cherokee 140, as I needed 3 seats instead of 2. I'm wondering how the Cherokee will handle as compared to the Cessna...I keep reading how a Cherokee is almost "too easy" (which is exactly how I felt about the Cessna, if there is such a thing).
Although many years ago now, in the past I've also owned a 172, Tomahawk, and a Taylorcraft....I'm wondering if the Cherokee will be most like the Tomahawk (which to me was the easiest flying aircraft I've ever been in).
Thanks!
Click to expand...

When I transitioned from the C172/C162 to a Cherokee it was "mostly" a non-event. I did find that the first few landings took some getting used to due to the approach site picture being lower and the power requirements being a lot higher then a Cessna. Pull power in a Cessna and you can float down half the runway. Pull power in a Cherokee, throw a brick out the window and follow the brick to the field. Yes..they sink fast.

I flew a Cessna 150 last night and I had to get used to the massive flare (compared to the Cherokee).

Handling in the air the Cherokee is very benign, and yes..it WILL spoil you on landings once you get used to it. You will need to carry some power on approach and when you pull power be prepared for the nose to drop as they are pretty nose-heavy. Other than that the only thing that MAY get you is when you enter ground effect, do NOT overflare. There have been a number of accidents where overflare will cause a float out of ground effect and a hard landing on the mains.

You don't need much flare at all in the Cherokee and it will be a LOT more responsive to overcontrol in ground effect then Cessnas.

Grats on the purchase and..pictures please!!
 
The Cherokee to Skyhawks are almost interchangeable, I've cut people loose after a 30min flight, just learn what button is where, your sight picture and the flaps and you're fine.

The hardest thing to learn is how to get into it without stepping on the seat cushions.

Oh yeah, congrats on the new plane!
 
Depends what wing you have - if you have the "hershey bar" wing, it will sink a lot faster power off than you may be used to. Some of them are a little nose heavy, but with the 140 I don't think you'll have that issue. That's about it...oh you have to switch tanks, there's no "both" on the fuel selector.
 
You'll also need to unlearn using carb heat on every descent.
 
Your going to enjoy the extra seat,not enough difference,to worry about. Enjoy
 
Cherokee 140 is a good, safe, comfortable, (relatively) inexpensive airplane to own. If cabin load is light, that 50-gallon fuel capacity can take you a long way and help offset the rather pokey speed. You also have the option of cramming one or two lightweight, compliant passengers in the back for a short trip with reduced fuel load.

You've owned a Tomahawk, so you know the drill on the fuel selector and aux pump. The Cherokee doesn't have the PA-38's great visibility, but it's still very good. You'll probably find the Cherokee somewhat smoother, quieter and more stable, and has an overall more substantial feeling. The PA-38 was designed to have a sharper, more distinct stall than the Cherokee, which it replaced as the front-line basic trainer at Piper Flite Centers. That's because many Piper instructors in the 1970s (I was one of them) felt the Cherokee's stall was too benign and it therefore was not as effective as a trainer. But that's not at all a bad thing for a family cruiser.

Congrats, and you owe us pictures. :)

gms5002 said:
Depends what wing you have - if you have the "hershey bar" wing, it will sink a lot faster power off than you may be used to.
Click to expand...
All Cherokee 140s had the "Hershey-bar" wing and short fuselage. And yes, the Cherokee 140 does seem to sink faster with power off than does a Tomahawk or C-150. But since the airspeed is higher, the actual glide angle is not that different.
 
You will love the Cherokee, they can actually climb with 2 people on-board. :D
Also, you really need to change your avatar, that's not what a 140 nose looks like. ;)
And congratulations on your acquisition!!
 
BigBadLou said:
You will love the Cherokee, they can actually climb with 2 people on-board. :D
Also, you really need to change your avatar, that's not what a 140 nose looks like. ;)
And congratulations on your acquisition!!
Click to expand...

Depends on the Cherokee. A 180 or 6, sure. A 140? Well....
 
Pilawt said:
...You've owned a Tomahawk, so you know the drill on the fuel selector and aux pump...
Click to expand...

Good info...except doesn't the Tomahawk have a "both" setting? It was a long time ago, but I don't ever remember switching back and forth...

I changed my avatar...

Only thing I don't like, and it is a VERY small complaint, is that they painted over the "Cherokee 140" badge on the hood.

I'll try a pic:

upload_2016-3-31_13-52-40.png
 
tawood said:
Good info...except doesn't the Tomahawk have a "both" setting? It was a long time ago, but I don't ever remember switching back and forth...

I changed my avatar...

Only thing I don't like, and it is a VERY small complaint, is that they painted over the "Cherokee 140" badge on the hood.

I'll try a pic:

View attachment 44828
Click to expand...

Good looking bird. Enjoy!
 
Looks great!

Just remember not to walk up to the left side of the plane to get in your seat! o_O:D:D
 
JustinD said:
Looks great!

Just remember not to walk up to the left side of the plane to get in your seat! o_O:D:D
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He can try climbing through the little pilot port. Might be funny.
 
Got the plane home yesterday with no problems...handling differences between this and my last plane, a Cessna 150, are negligible...only differences are very minor: slightly faster speeds all the way around (which I like and never found the plane getting ahead of me), and then the switching of the tanks. I did find it a bit surprising as to how much of an effect an unbalanced fuel tanks situation has on the plane...you can definitely feel it!
Tim

upload_2016-4-6_10-46-49.png
 
Congrats on the new plane! Yes, you will want to swap tanks every 30 minutes to keep your plane in balance. I have a Electronics International CGR-30P engine monitor in my Cherokee. It has a fuel swap annunciator that alarms every 5 gallons of fuel burn. If you don't have an engine monitor just get in the habit of swapping on the hour and half-hour on your cross country flights.
 
Yes, it does have an electronic fuel monitor with alarms, etc, so I'll do that, thanks!
 
Of the planes you mention, you probably actually learned how to fly when you had the Taylorcraft. The rest of the planes you mention are all slightly different flavors of the same thing. Boring. A Taylorcraft is a pretty good teaching tool I would imagine. But they soon get boring too (I imagine), simply because it's so slow. I don't like slow planes, but I'm just picky in my old age.

I actually first learned to fly (sufficient to get a license anyway) in that very plane you've just bought, a Cherokee 140. It was a new design at that time (1962). Much to my instructor's dismay, I bounced around the airport trying out the other training planes, a C-150 and a Piper Colt. I remember how much more comfortable and quiet the 140 seemed compared to the others. I really liked it. I never really learned to fly though until I owned a taildragger.

The one you just bought looks (although don't think that's the factory paint design as I recall, could be wrong) just like it came out of the factory. Nice find!
 
You won't miss having to lift the wing to look for traffic before turning.
 
MikeS said:
The one you just bought looks (although don't think that's the factory paint design as I recall, could be wrong) just like it came out of the factory.
Click to expand...
Close. The original paint scheme for the Cherokee 140 was like this from its introduction in 1964 until the 140B came out in late '68:

pa-28-140_1964.jpg
 
Wikipedia says the type certificate was issued 1960 so there could have been Cherokee 140's at Merrill Field in 1962, but I went back into records and it was 1965 I learned to fly, not '62. I've been thinking it was '62 for some reason, for a long time.

In the process of looking, I went looking for my flight instructor, Nancy Howard. The internet is so amazing. I found her.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=57872723
 
MikeS said:
Wikipedia says the type certificate was issued 1960 so there could have been Cherokee 140's at Merrill Field in 1962
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There might have been Cherokees in 1962, but they weren't Cherokee 140s.

The first PA-28 to be certified and go to market was the four-seat PA-28-160 in mid 1961, followed a few months later by the PA-28-150. Despite somewhat lower performance, the -150 proved more popular because it could use less-expensive 80-octane fuel. The PA-28-180 came along in late 1962, and the -235 at the end of 1963.

Piper had planned a new two-seat, low-wing trainer (PA-29 Papoose) to replace the Colt, but its plastic-composite construction was not ready for prime time (or even direct sunlight, as it turned out), and it was scrubbed. To get a trainer to market as quickly as possible, Piper took the rear seats out of a PA-28-150, moved the rear bulkhead forward by one station and eliminated the baggage door, and put a cruise prop on it which limited power to 140 hp, and voila, the PA-28-140 "Cherokee 140" was introduced in early 1964. MGW was initially limited to 1,950 lb., which seemed plenty for a two-seater.

upload_2016-4-7_15-51-56.png

Within a year, though, Piper added optional snap-in rear seats (the "2+2 Cruiser" option package), repitched the prop so it was equivalent to the PA-28-150, and raised the MGW to 2,150 lb., also equivalent to the Cherokee 150.

upload_2016-4-7_15-52-35.png

The Cherokee 140 and Cherokee 150 were built side-by-side until 1967. Beginning in 1964, though, the Cherokee 150, 160 and 180 had the restyled fiberglass cowl that made them easily distinguishable from the -140.

upload_2016-4-7_15-58-24.png
 
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Thanks for having all that on hand. Good stuff.
 
That's a pretty plane! Hopefully she gets a lot of flight time out of you!
 
I had a 1964 Cherokee 140. 1964 was the first year the 140 was produced, as mentioned above. It was my first airplane and I loved it. I bought the plane in late 1992 and took it all over creation. Based in Houston, I flew it to Los Angeles, The Bahamas, and even Leadville, Colorado (the highest elevation airport in the US, I think). Sold the 140 in 1995 and bought my Arrow which I am still flying today. Welcome to the Cherokee family. They are great airplanes!!
 
Switching tanks.. 1st switch at 30 minutes then I wait and switch at hour intervals. Sure the tanks even out at 30 min after you first switch but why switch at even, just let the opposite side get ahead by 30 minutes.
 
HotRock said:
Switching tanks.. 1st switch at 30 minutes then I wait and switch at hour intervals. Sure the tanks even out at 30 min after you first switch but why switch at even, just let the opposite side get ahead by 30 minutes.
Click to expand...

Maybe because I wasn't used to it, or maybe because I was flying alone, but I found 30 minutes too long, and things felt really unbalanced after 20 minutes.
 
I have a slightly non-scientific tank switch reminder. My girl friend always asks "is it time to switch tanks?" Usually I reply "I just did", or "yeah, 5 minutes ago" but it's reassuring she knows to ask :) She's a PPL student and spends most of her time on BOTH, if you know what I mean.

I use the 01-30 min RIGHT tank, 31-60 min LEFT tank method
 
rolivi said:
I have a slightly non-scientific tank switch reminder. My girl friend always asks "is it time to switch tanks?" Usually I reply "I just did", or "yeah, 5 minutes ago" but it's reassuring she knows to ask :) She's a PPL student and spends most of her time on BOTH, if you know what I mean.

I use the 01-30 min RIGHT tank, 31-60 min LEFT tank method
Click to expand...

30 mins is too often for me for both tanks. Also, taking longer trips doing that every 30 minutes got a bit annoying.

My process was as per the POH, doing it too much doesn't do much for you:

From the POH:
In order to keep the airplane in best lateral trim during cruising flight, the fuel should be used alternately from each tank.. It is recommended that one tank be used for one hour after take-off, then the other tank be used for two hours, then return to the first tank for one hour. Each tank will then contain approximately 1/2 hour of fuel if tanks were full (24 gallons usable each tank) at take-off. Do not run tanks completely dry in flight.

Obviously if you have smaller fuel tanks, do it more often of course. I got used to the 50 in my 180.
 
Caramon13 said:
30 mins is too often for me for both tanks. Also, taking longer trips doing that every 30 minutes got a bit annoying.

My process was as per the POH, doing it too much doesn't do much for you:

From the POH:
In order to keep the airplane in best lateral trim during cruising flight, the fuel should be used alternately from each tank.. It is recommended that one tank be used for one hour after take-off, then the other tank be used for two hours, then return to the first tank for one hour. Each tank will then contain approximately 1/2 hour of fuel if tanks were full (24 gallons usable each tank) at take-off. Do not run tanks completely dry in flight.

Obviously if you have smaller fuel tanks, do it more often of course. I got used to the 50 in my 180.
Click to expand...

I've got 50 also. It might have been because it was an extremely smooth, "hands off" kind of day. Probably wouldn't even notice it on a normal day.
 
tawood said:
I've got 50 also. It might have been because it was an extremely smooth, "hands off" kind of day. Probably wouldn't even notice it on a normal day.
Click to expand...

Mine did have a right wing heavy tendency so I always burned the right tank for the first hour. More weight on that side too with pax. Was much smoother after that. I do miss that plane :)
 
Caramon13 said:
Also, taking longer trips doing that every 30 minutes got a bit annoying.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I guess that long reach to the fuel selector can really be annoying. Right up there with correcting the DG to the mag compass and checking on with the next controller.
 
rolivi said:
Yeah, I guess that long reach to the fuel selector can really be annoying. Right up there with correcting the DG to the mag compass and checking on with the next controller.
Click to expand...

Hey if you want to "re-balance" the plane for 5 gallons of fuel, go right ahead. To me, 30 minutes is too frequent. Do you flip your hamburger 7 times before eating it too?

Making up your own rules outside of what the POH recommends is your business, but it's entirely unnecessary so..have at it :)
 
Caramon13 said:
Hey if you want to "re-balance" the plane for 5 gallons of fuel, go right ahead. To me, 30 minutes is too frequent. Do you flip your hamburger 7 times before eating it too?

Making up your own rules outside of what the POH recommends is your business, but it's entirely unnecessary so..have at it :)
Click to expand...

I don't understand your hamburger reference. Did I cook it? Did I cook it for 3.5 hours? Doesn't much matter.

You cited a POH "recommendation" hmmm... there's a certain word in play there, you think?

If you like to keep a scrap of paper saying switch tanks at 1338, 1538, and 1638 have at it. (but please consider adjusting those times if you fiddle with the throttle)
 
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