Jeep Peeps, spend my money

Ed Haywood

Ed Haywood

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Display name:
Big Ed
I'm getting the itch to buy a 2 door Jeep Wrangler.
I work from home, so I don't drive much on a daily basis. Just 15 miles to the airfield every 2 or 3 days to fly, and occasional errands. I've been driving a beater F150 for about 5 years, but getting bored of that.
I live in Florida, but just bought a second home in the Colorado mountains. Initially we will spend winters there, but I can see summer trips creeping into the mix. That got me thinking it might be cool to have a jeep to go wheeling in the mountains in a few years.
So three questions:
1) buy a 4 year old JL with low mileage, or get a 10 year old JK beater? Cost isn't really a factor, or shouldn't be ... but I'm cheap and like working on cars.
2) get a Rubicon now, even though I probably won't wheel it for several years, or get a sport model and upgrade or mod if I relocate it to Colorado?
3) just how brutal would a trip from FL to CO be in a 2 door Jeep?
 
Pentastar engines are notorious for cam/lifter wipeout. TJ/4.0 was the last bulletproof combo.

And a 2-door Jeep is miserable on the highway, requires constant correction for wind as the wheelbase is so short.
 
So my son had a 4-door Renegade while he was at Carson and it was great in the little bit of Forest Roads it hit in the COS area. It hasn’t been the most reliable when it comes to the 12V battery, but it did the job.

I’m not a jeep guy, but took a 2WD F150 in most of the places most Jeeps were going. If you’re looking to go places a Razor or other UTV will go that a truck won’t, a 2-door jeep is the ticket. You’ll want to do some suspension work and beef up the drive train, but the platform will work just fine.

Now, I took my Multistrada places Jeeps and UTVs couldn’t go, but you’ve go to be a moto guy to do that. If we ever moved back, I’d probably pick up a KTM 525XC or an LC4 Adventure for backroading in the summer.

ETA: a Defender 95 or 110 would be a better option, but those are rare as hen’s teeth.
 
My experience with Jeeps are mostly in Alaska. In real Alaska, not touristy Alaska where you can get more amenities than you can get at home.

Jeeps were the first ones to not make it through the snow. For the 2 months of the year when we had mud, they did just fine.

I saw front wheel drive cars do better on packed snow and ice roads.

One winter in Texas the highway was covered in black ice. The locals knew it and were driving at around 20mph. Here came the idiots in a jeep with Colorado plates, giant monster mud tires and jacked up at least 16 feet in the air (ok, not really but you get the idea) passing everyone at about 45mph. I could see the guys inside laughing at everyone because the had a nice jeep that they thought could go anywhere. It slipped on the ice and into the icy ditch, and there it sat on top of the ice spinning said giant monster mud tires.

I was nice, being Texan and all and driving my pickup with highway tires but at least 4WD, I pulled over to help. I got my tow strap, hooked it to the jeep and pulled him out. I mentioned to him that I thought folks in Colorado knew how to drive on icy roads.

Ed Haywood said:
just how brutal would a trip from FL to CO be in a 2 door Jeep?
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Since for at least the last 40 years Jeeps are built for comfort and for folks that want to pretend they are driving the grassy plains of Mt Kilamajoojoo Bean but not spill their 24 ounce caramel, creme de menthe, white chocolate powder, butterscotch, English toffee, peppermint and white coffee, I would say you would do just fine. Unless you go off road...

I thought Jeeps were mostly used nowadays for this:

1719249385636.png
 
I owned a moderately built CJ5 at one time, loved driving it around town and on the rocks, but sold it when I started doing a weekly 100 mile trip to our cabin, it was a real drag on the highway. Drove a friend's YJ (square headlight Wrangler) once and it was night and day better on the highway than my CJ even with 35s on it.

Now I have a 2023 JT (Gladiator) and with the longer wheelbase it's a pleasure on the highway while still being capable on the trails. I bought new partly because I'm tired of working on cars, I've owned and repaired cheap cars all my life and now I'm just tired of it, I'd rather work on the plane. I searched for and bought the most stripped down Sport I could find, nice and simple, even has hand cranked windows!
 
FancyG said:
And a 2-door Jeep is miserable on the highway, requires constant correction for wind as the wheelbase is so short.
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Truth. They beat you to death because of the wheelbase. A soft top makes it even worse.
 
pmanton said:
Jeep? Gotta be an M-38A1
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Those were before my time. I did get to get a lot of wheel time in M151's, which were still kept in service for quite a while after they were officially retired from service. People laugh at them, but they are actually pretty decent off road, and ten times more fun to drive than Hummers.

I would imagine an M38 would be more CJ like, in driving and capability.
 
Wranglers, and especially two door wranglers do very poorly on the snow and ice due to the short wheelbase. It’s pretty much a hockey puck.
 
If I'm spending your money I highly recommend the new Jeep wrangler 392. I hear it can't be beat :D
 
It's all about the tires. 98% of jacked up jeeps are on summer tires, which are next to useless on snow and ice. Rubber formulation is the most important factor, not tread. Summer tires harden in the cold and lose their grip. Winter rated tires have additives to remain pliable.
 
I've had 2-door and 4-door Wranglers, V6, 2.0T and the 4xe. Get a 4-door and if you can swing it, a 2.0T JL 4-door (aka JLU).
The 2.0T in all of ours has been perfect, even the 2.0T in the 4xe and I do NOT miss the 2-door Wranglers at all. Unless you are going to go hard core offroad in tight spaces, the space in the 4-door for gear (even if just 2 people) is a world of difference.

Between the JK and JL, both are tough platforms but the JL chassis rides so much better than the JK. I've taken cross country (2000+ miles) trips in the JLU platform and the older JK just cannot compare. Get one that aleady has the LED lights and tow package (stronger rear springs) if you can.

As stated previously, stay away from the 3.6 unless you buy a brand new one and change oil religiously. Slacking on oil changes causes lots of problems in the 3.6. If you get a 3.6 new and change the oil every 3,000 to 4,000 miles they'll run well without an issue (my work Jeep with 3.6 is at 220,000+ running perfect since new and the wife's at ~150,000 the same).
 
I have a JLU Moab (honestly a weird packaged based on Sahara) that I really do love. Lifted on 37x12.5 Nitto Ridge Grapplers. Never regeared, so mileage sucks and never sees 8th gear. Has good highway manners and has done some wheeling out in Colorado and Moab. Owned several Pentastar 3.6 engines and participated in those communities and most of the the issues pointed out here are few and far between or long since fixed. I wouldn't be scared. The 2L turbo gets pretty stellar reviews on the JL forums. Cross country driving any Jeep I've ever been in is more comfortable than my Arrow, but the JLs are pretty cushy, even the sports.

If you want to do a sport + upgrades, I would recommend only going that route because you enjoy the tinkering and upgrades. It's way cheaper to just buy a Rubi than to build one from a sport or a sahara (and that's my only regret, not getting the Rubi up front).
 
Have a dead bone stock JL Sport 2 door, about as basic (and close to original roots) as one can get. Just a Jeep.

3.6 Pentastar, 6sp manual transmission, soft top, no power anything. Has wind up windows, manual door locks, etc. Since it’s not a tarted up mall crawler wanna be, it came with Michelin’s excellent LTX M/S2 tires. Rides decently smooth, handles great for a Jeep.

I plan to leave it just the way it is.

1719449366989.jpeg

1719449396847.jpeg
 
Bill said:
Have a dead bone stock JL Sport 2 door, about as basic (and close to original roots) as one can get. Just a Jeep.

3.6 Pentastar, 6sp manual transmission, soft top, no power anything. Has wind up windows, manual door locks, etc. Since it’s not a tarted up mall crawler wanna be, it came with Michelin’s excellent LTX M/S2 tires. Rides decently smooth, handles great for a Jeep.
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That's where I'm leaning. Tons of them online with less than 50K miles for a decent price.

Seems like most are 2L 8sp though.

Did you add AC? Here in FL that's a must, even with a soft top.
 
Ed Haywood said:
Did you add AC? Here in FL that's a must, even with a soft top.
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I bought ours new, and had to special order to get what I wanted. Dealers only stock high dollar unlimiteds (4-door) with automatic transmission, heated leather seats, automatic climate controls and other luxury nonsense. It’s a Jeep for crying out loud!

I ordered four options

- air conditioning
- trailer tow package
- limited slip rear end
- tinted rear windows, because they look good
 
Ball-park, what does something like that cost to drive off the lot, including tax? I didn’t realize you could custom order anything these days, they are all “packages”. Is that just a Jeep thing?
 
I really wanted the 6 speed manual, but they were simply unavailable last fall... there was a recall and dealer hold on all manuals, seems the clutches have a tendency to catch fire. There is now a "fix", but the word on the street is that it's just a bandaid to get the clutch past the warranty period.

So I got the 8 speed auto, and turns out it's a very good automatic... it's just always in the right gear, all the time. And my wife is happier, she can drive a stick but doesn't like it, it hurts her rebuilt knees.
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Ball-park, what does something like that cost to drive off the lot, including tax? I didn’t realize you could custom order anything these days, they are all “packages”. Is that just a Jeep thing?
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You can't really custom order, but Jeep dealers can search nationwide inventory and if there's some combination you want on another dealer's lot they can get it. In my case the dealer found the truck I wanted in another state but lied to me about the details (and price!) so I tracked it down and drove to that other state (CT to PA) to buy it for a better price.

I don;t think it's possible to buy any new vehicle without A/C any more, though.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Ball-park, what does something like that cost to drive off the lot, including tax? I didn’t realize you could custom order anything these days, they are all “packages”. Is that just a Jeep thing?
Click to expand...

We were right at $32k out the door. Still a lot considering $32k will get a nicely optioned Accord or Camry, but this checks the boxes. She always wanted a Wrangler, I wanted a convertible, and we both wanted stick shift. Boom, done!

Dana said:
I really wanted the 6 speed manual, but they were simply unavailable last fall... there was a recall and dealer hold on all manuals, seems the clutches have a tendency to catch fire. There is now a "fix", but the word on the street is that it's just a bandaid to get the clutch past the warranty period.
Click to expand...

The latest is now FCA is going to replace the clutch and pressure plate, we're next in line at the dealer when he gets parts. And this is now an official recall, so warranty status doesn't apply. I'm good with that, we have 22,000 on the present clutch, and it's still fine. Sooner or later, I get a free new better clutch.

Dana said:
You can't really custom order,
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As of 2022 you most certainly could custom order. We found a dealer we liked (they had the best prices in the area), sat down, and we put in the order. Four months later, our Jeep arrived, exactly as ordered, options, color, everything. Painless except for the wait.
Dana said:
I don;t think it's possible to buy any new vehicle without A/C any more, though.
Click to expand...

Back then, A/C was an option on the base Sport models, but now I think A/C is standard across all Wrangler models.

Aside: I just love driving this thing. It's a bit goofy, but so entertaining. So much fun to drive, and the stick shift contributes a lot to the experience. And we like the soft top, it takes a minute to fold it back for convertible driving. If it got taken out, I'd be back to get another.

In some ways it reminds me of a lifted Miata. Elemental. Simple. Honest. But with chair height seats for old folk knees ;).
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Ball-park, what does something like that cost to drive off the lot, including tax?
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Used ones 3-4 years old with under 50K miles are asking $25-30k.

I hadn't looked at new, but Edmunds says $31k.

Wow, those suckers hold their value.
 
Ed Haywood said:
Wow, those suckers hold their value.
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Which is why we went new. To get a $20k Wrangler, you have to go back quite a few years and it's likely to be high mile and somewhat ratted out.

Edit: And if we ever do decide to sell, we figured we'd do ok on overall cost of ownership due to the high retained values.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I'm getting the itch to buy a 2 door Jeep Wrangler.
I work from home, so I don't drive much on a daily basis. Just 15 miles to the airfield every 2 or 3 days to fly, and occasional errands. I've been driving a beater F150 for about 5 years, but getting bored of that.
I live in Florida, but just bought a second home in the Colorado mountains. Initially we will spend winters there, but I can see summer trips creeping into the mix. That got me thinking it might be cool to have a jeep to go wheeling in the mountains in a few years.
So three questions:
1) buy a 4 year old JL with low mileage, or get a 10 year old JK beater? Cost isn't really a factor, or shouldn't be ... but I'm cheap and like working on cars.
2) get a Rubicon now, even though I probably won't wheel it for several years, or get a sport model and upgrade or mod if I relocate it to Colorado?
3) just how brutal would a trip from FL to CO be in a 2 door Jeep?
Click to expand...
the drive would be good. I bought a brand new 2021 Sierra and drove it from Boise, ID to Dallas, TX. only issue i had was going thru the Rockies. even with nothing but i carry on the jeep could not pull the mountains. i had to down shift to 3rd (i have a manual). but in the flats it drives real nice. an older jeep might have a more powerful engine so climbing hills may not even be an issue for you.
 
Bill said:
Which is why we went new. To get a $20k Wrangler, you have to go back quite a few years and it's likely to be high mile and somewhat ratted out.

Edit: And if we ever do decide to sell, we figured we'd do ok on overall cost of ownership due to the high retained values.
Click to expand...

There's a clear drop between JL and JK used prices now that there are more JL's on the market.

2018 JK Rubicon's with under 50K miles are selling for 25K, and those are the cherry ones that the dealers keep.

The problem with used Jeeps is finding one that hasn't been molested with all kinds of aftermarket appearance crap.
 
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Ed Haywood said:
finding one that hasn't been molested with all kinds of aftermarket appearance crap.
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Another reason I went new. I just wanted a plain Jeep, which obviously puts me in a very small minority.

My Jeep is soooo plain. How plain is it? We’ve only gotten three ducks in two years.
 
Bill said:
Another reason I went new. I just wanted a plain Jeep, which obviously puts me in a very small minority.

My Jeep is soooo plain. How plain is it? We’ve only gotten three ducks in two years.
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If I get a jeep, any ducks I get will be hung by a noose from the rear view mirror or trailer hitch.
 
I’ve never gotten one. Maybe my Jeep is not good enough…

I heard that the lady that started the duck thing died on Saturday. Apparently she started the duck thing to put smiles on peoples faces after a bunch of people were rude to her for driving her Jeep.
 
Bill said:
In some ways it reminds me of a lifted Miata. Elemental. Simple. Honest. But with chair height seats for old folk knees ;).
Click to expand...
Exactly, Jeeps are just plain fun to drive. Unless you're the kind of person who doesn't like that kind of thing, in which case they suck. I'm enjoying the Jeep enough right now that I'm going to sell the Miata (though I'll probably get another one eventually).
 
Dana said:
Exactly, Jeeps are just plain fun to drive. Unless you're the kind of person who doesn't like that kind of thing, in which case they suck. I'm enjoying the Jeep enough right now that I'm going to sell the Miata (though I'll probably get another one eventually).
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I dunno. I borrowed a '90 YJ Hardtop (I6 w/manual tranny) with 35" tires for a week and I wouldn't have characterized it as "plain fun", lol. That thing rode terribly, had sloppy handling, and was noisy as could be. Great for true off-roading, not so much for daily driving. I DO have fond memories of my parent's '89 XJ though with the same 4.0L engine.
 
SoonerAviator said:
I dunno. I borrowed a '90 YJ Hardtop (I6 w/manual tranny) with 35" tires for a week and I wouldn't have characterized it as "plain fun", lol.
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Well, yeah, a YJ on 35s won't handle very well on the road. My CJ5 with 33s was fun around town, great on the trails, and tiring on the highway. But a newer Jeep without any extreme mods or huge tires is pretty civilized on the road without being boring.
 
Dana said:
Well, yeah, a YJ on 35s won't handle very well on the road. My CJ5 with 33s was fun around town, great on the trails, and tiring on the highway. But a newer Jeep without any extreme mods or huge tires is pretty civilized on the road without being boring.
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Oh I agree. I've driven a few newer ones (JK) as rentals and they were fine (although obviously stock). I just meant that "Jeeps are plain fun to drive" isn't universal, lol. Here's a rental I had one time back in 2017, which I was driving to a location in DFW at which there were 3 or 4 employees with highly-modded Jeep Wranglers. I rented the JK on purpose and got to the facility early so I could "park like a Jeeper" so they'd see it when they walked in. I gave them so much grief about it, lol.

1719586313012.png
 
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