Icon A5 lands on river causing inadvertent fire department response

Looks like he was inside the class delta for a local airport. I wonder if he got permission.


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I want to like this airplane and would appreciate the opportunity to fly in one, but I can't help but hate it
 
The demo pilot was on the local news last night. Seems like a reasonable guy. They are operating out of KCPS, so it'd be a much bigger story if he ignored the tower! Also, apparently fire and police responded two days in a row. Are they idiots or just bored?
 
keen9 said:
The demo pilot was on the local news last night. Seems like a reasonable guy. They are operating out of KCPS, so it'd be a much bigger story if he ignored the tower! Also, apparently fire and police responded two days in a row. Are they idiots or just bored?
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If they get a call, they have to respond. All it takes is one Nervous Nelly to dial 911.
 
Stingray Don said:
If they get a call, they have to respond. All it takes is one Nervous Nelly to dial 911.
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I'm pretty sure they could get a park ranger to look east and see if there is a plane crashed in the river vs bringing three police vehicles and two fire trucks.
 
lancie00 said:
Oh my goodness!!! I've seen several planes go down today. They all seem to be crashing near the airport!!! I even saw a helicopter crash on the hospital!!! SEND HELP!!!
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Most GA airports are known to the local community. Even if they're not, there is typically a lot of signage indicating an airport is near by. For people unfamiliar seeing a low flying plane its easier to assume that they are landing at an airport you dont know about than not. The exceptions being if they are visibly in distress (such as a fire or parts falling off the airplane) or they are especially out of place (over the middle of downtown, touching down on a highway, beach or over a river for example).

For most people, seeing a seaplane land is an uncommon occurrence especially since a lot of high volume/traffic waterways dont permit it and waterways around major cities tend to have bridges and wires crossing them which are an aerial hazard that prevents landing.
 
Stingray Don said:
If they get a call, they have to respond. All it takes is one Nervous Nelly to dial 911.
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I can easily see how this can happen, especially if water landings are very rare in that area. A non-aviation knowledgeable person sees a plane land on the water. It must be a ditching!
 
Fire and PD are already on duty. Better to have them respond and have it turn out to be a false alarm than build in a delay waiting for confirmation before sending them out.

I spent 29 years as a deputy sheriff. One of my biggest frustrations was citizens who didn’t want to bother us, wasn’t sure if what they saw was an emergency, or thought that they were supposed to wait until things escalated. Call as soon as you think you might need a cop, fire engine or ambulance. We’d much rather roll and then cancel, rather than get called too late. Every firefighter I knew felt the same way.
 
When they were called when I landed my glider in a field beside the road the fire truck and ambulance still showed up even after the state trooper had called them and told them it was a false alarm.
They just wanted to see what all the commotion was about. Most it was about me sitting by my glider eating a sandwich while I waited for my ground crew to show up with my trailer.

Brian
 
I’ve had police called landing my hang glider on XC flights. I had a good laugh with one who seemed disappointed that I wasn’t hurt. I told him I’d try harder next time.
 
I personally know a lot of police and firefighters...while it is often known to be a false alarm most of them have no problem going out to potentialy just see cool chit!
 
Hang 4 said:
I’ve had police called landing my hang glider on XC flights. I had a good laugh with one who seemed disappointed that I wasn’t hurt. I told him I’d try harder next time.
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Same here, when I was flying my paramotor.
 
keen9 said:
I'm pretty sure they could get a park ranger to look east and see if there is a plane crashed in the river vs bringing three police vehicles and two fire trucks.
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One part of nothing else to do
Mixed with
One part thinking flying is still witchcraft

And that’s what you get fire and PD showing up for a float plane landing on....water.
 
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Tantalum said:
call me jaded, but given Icon's marketing and the type of person they sell to I would say this is doubtful
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To be frank, I don't think they are much different from Cirrus in both respects. They are both attentively marketing to high net worth folks that want to feel what they are buying is something special.

Both planes are actually pretty impressive products, so there's some legitimacy to all of this imo.
 
GRG55 said:
To be frank, I don't think they are much different from Cirrus in both respects. They are both attentively marketing to high net worth folks that want to feel what they are buying is something special.

Both planes are actually pretty impressive products, so there's some legitimacy to all of this imo.
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Only thing is when people got themselves into trouble in cirrus planes at a high rate, cirrus changed their tune, marketing and training.

Icon is still marketing their planes like an ATV to low to no time pilots, and unlike cirrus sells a fixed gear non backcountry plane, icon is selling amphibs.
 
James331 said:
Only thing is when people got themselves into trouble in cirrus planes at a high rate, cirrus changed their tune, marketing and training.

Icon is still marketing their planes like an ATV to low to no time pilots, and unlike cirrus sells a fixed gear non backcountry plane, icon is selling amphibs.
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Well, if the high profile accidents haven't tempered Icon's promotional approach, they are slow learners indeed.
 
Call them up first and notify them of the intended river landing and that you are in contact with ATC. Same as when burning brush on my farm - call the sheriff first and let him know it's a controlled, planned burn.
 
jnmeade said:
Call them up first and notify them of the intended river landing and that you are in contact with ATC. Same as when burning brush on my farm - call the sheriff first and let him know it's a controlled, planned burn.
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I did that when I first moved into my current house. I still met the guys from the fire department...

I'll admit it was during winter. I had covered the small brush pile to keep it dry and I had waited until the snow was falling, but still someone panicked and called it in....
 
Rick emphasizes, his pilot followed all the right protocols, including getting permission from air traffic control.

“We followed all the right procedures, had clearance from the tower and we’re just trying to have fun,” he said.
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Being fairy familiar with this area and the character of the locals and the St Louis area controllers, this story sounds entirely likely to me.
 
I believe that a couple years ago that people panicked when a seaplane landed on Lake Michigan near Chicago.
 
jnmeade said:
Call them up first and notify them of the intended river landing and that you are in contact with ATC. Same as when burning brush on my farm - call the sheriff first and let him know it's a controlled, planned burn.
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Generally if it’s welcome to decent sized powerboats that heads up is not needed or expected.

The issue if you give the goverment types a heads up is it confuses them, especially if you keep doing it. When the heads up isn’t required, after not too long they will think you need their blessing where none is required.
 
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GRG55 said:
Well, if the high profile accidents haven't tempered Icon's promotional approach, they are slow learners indeed.
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One drugged up guy, whose father is a pilot, who had plenty of hours and owned a Caravan, certainly isn't the supposed Icon demo of "non-pilot with money". The other fatal Icon crash involved a box canyon and an Icon demo pilot.
 
Lindberg said:
Do you need permission to land on a river within D airspace?
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Doesn't D airspace go to the surface? I would think that all aircraft activity within D would need ATC approval.
 
Lindberg said:
Do you need permission to land on a river within D airspace?
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Just 2 way communication to enter the airspace, they don’t control the water. Probably smart to let them know what you’re doing so they don’t think you’re ditching in the river ;)

“Podunk tower, amphib 1232 is 8 to the Southwest 1500’, looking to enter your airspace for take off and landings on the river by XYZ location”

I normally use Amphib vs Cessna for my call sign, so if I divert to a lake or something ATC is less likely to freak out and start asking souls on board and all lol
 
Cam Bender said:
Doesn't D airspace go to the surface? I would think that all aircraft activity within D would need ATC approval.
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No aircraft activity within D airspace, save landing at the airport, requires ATC approval.
 
James331 said:
Just 2 way communication to enter the airspace, they don’t control the water. Probably smart to let them know what you’re doing so they don’t think you’re ditching in the river ;)

“Podunk tower, amphib 1232 is 8 to the Southwest 1500’, looking to enter your airspace for take off and landings on the river by XYZ location”

I normally use Amphib vs Cessna for my call sign, so if I divert to a lake or something ATC is less likely to freak out and start asking souls on board and all lol
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My instructor would have said, "Are you asking them or telling them?" And then make me tell them:

“Podunk tower, amphib 1232 is 8 to the Southwest 1500’, will be landing on the river by XYZ location.”
 
Lindberg said:
My instructor would have said, "Are you asking them or telling them?" And then make me tell them:

“Podunk tower, amphib 1232 is 8 to the Southwest 1500’, will be landing on the river by XYZ location.”
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Your instructor needs to chill lol

Ain’t a 7700 level event


Just saying it the same way I’d give a heads up in a normal friendly like way, also I am somewhat asking, if he’s got something going on in that area I’d be happy to use another part of the river or a different altitude, it’s a team sport :)
 
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Lindberg said:
No aircraft activity within D airspace, save landing at the airport, requires ATC approval.
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I will need to review the regs on that as I thought one had to follow ATC instructions within any airspace they controlled.
 
Lindberg said:
No aircraft activity within D airspace, save landing at the airport, requires ATC approval.
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Not what i was taught during my PPL. Which was a few months ago. You need to establish 2 way comms with the tower prior to entering the Delta. I have personally heard over the radio 2 different pilots get deviations from not doing this.


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Stingray Don said:
If they get a call, they have to respond. All it takes is one Nervous Nelly to dial 911.
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I believe there can be exceptions to that. My first flying job was operating from a grass strip. There was a line of trees around the perimeter of the property so you couldn't see there was a strip in there if you were outside the property. A major highway passed about a mile east of the field.

In order to avoid over flying the neighbors houses, we would keep our patterns low and tight. About 150' and within a couple hundred feet of the runway were typical for us. So a casual observer would see a plane maneuvering just above the trees then suddenly turn sharply and seem to dive toward the ground. Calls to 911 reporting a plane crash were a common event. The authorities never showed up or even called to check.
 
Peter Anderson said:
Not what i was taught during my PPL. Which was a few months ago. You need to establish 2 way comms with the tower prior to entering the Delta. I have personally heard over the radio 2 different pilots get deviations from not doing this.
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Me: "Tower, Bugsmasher 123AB"
Tower: "3AB, Tower, go ahead"
Me: "3AB is 4 to the east at 2500 over flying the field for a landing on the river."
Tower: [silence]

I've established two-way comms and recieved no permission for anything. But I can enter the airspace and do what I said I was going to do (or something else).
 
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