How to manually sequence to next waypoint on Garmin 430W?

brcase

brcase

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Brian
Last week I got the following instructions from ATC shortly after passing Adexe....

Fly heading 110 intercept V4.

Easy to do with the VOR. But how do I this with only the GPS? I sometimes fly planes with just a Garmin 400 or 420.

What I really need to know is how to tell the Garmin 430 to manually sequence to the next leg. I could easily put Adexe to Canek to Alkal. But since I don't get close enough to Canek for it to auto sequence it tries to fly me back to Canek after I have already passed it. If I could Manually tell it that I need to join the leg between Canek and Alkal that would work fine. I don't know how to do that? Is there a trick to that?

upload_2023-2-23_14-54-24.png

Brian
 
I believe you just highlight the waypoint and go Direct To. It should then continue to sequence the flight plan
 
brcase said:
Last week I got the following instructions from ATC shortly after passing Adexe....

Fly heading 110 intercept V4.

Easy to do with the VOR. But how do I this with only the GPS? I sometimes fly planes with just a Garmin 400 or 420.

What I really need to know is how to tell the Garmin 430 to manually sequence to the next leg. I could easily put Adexe to Canek to Alkal. But since I don't get close enough to Canek for it to auto sequence it tries to fly me back to Canek after I have already passed it. If I could Manually tell it that I need to join the leg between Canek and Alkal that would work fine. I don't know how to do that? Is there a trick to that?

View attachment 115220

Brian
Click to expand...
Put in CANEK ALKAL. Or ATETY ALKAL. The winds and/or DG error could maybe have you intercepting west of CANEK. Maybe you should start it at BOI to make sure. Does the 400 series Garmins allow airways? Do BOI V4 ALKAL. Activate that leg. Now fly heading 110 until you’re on V4.
 
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luvflyin said:
Put in CANEK ALKAL. Or ATETY ALKAL. The winds and/or DG error could maybe have you intercepting west of CANEK. Maybe you should start it at BOI to make sure. Does the 400 series Garmins allow airways? Do BOI V4 ALKAL. Activate that leg. Now fly heading 110 until you’re on V4.
Click to expand...

Quite possible I am missing something obvious. Activate the leg is exactly what want to do but don't know how.
I can tell it take me directly to the fix and the beginning of the leg and then it will auto sequence once I pass over the fix. But that doesn't help in this case.
Best I could tell the 400 series does not support Victor airways.

Brian
 
Eric Brunelle said:
I believe you just highlight the waypoint and go Direct To. It should then continue to sequence the flight plan
MauleSkinner said:
Unless you’re on V4 already, it won’t intercept V4 to the fix.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Right. Going Direct To, you won't be flying the assigned 110 heading. That's why you would rather do...
brcase said:
Quite possible I am missing something obvious. Activate the leg is exactly what want to do but don't know how.
I can tell it take me directly to the fix and the beginning of the leg and then it will auto sequence once I pass over the fix. But that doesn't help in this case.
Best I could tell the 400 series does not support Victor airways.
Click to expand...
What did you have in your FPL? If you already had ALKAL in there, do as was mentioned in post #2: insert CANEK, highlight ALKAL and "Activate Leg". Fly the assigned 110 heading until intercept.
https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?faq=bXSNcz8tbO13ovFaWLDEs9

I believe the GPS that preceded the GNS430 (CNX80/GNS480) supported Victor airways as does all of the GPS that came after the GNS430 (GTN, 175/355/375). Sucks to be in that gap.
 
brcase said:
Quite possible I am missing something obvious. Activate the leg is exactly what want to do but don't know how.
I can tell it take me directly to the fix and the beginning of the leg and then it will auto sequence once I pass over the fix. But that doesn't help in this case.
Best I could tell the 400 series does not support Victor airways.

Brian
Click to expand...
Two ways.

1. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the Direct key twice. First tap is direct; second tap is activate leg.

2. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the MENU button. Activate leg is one if the choices.

Hint 1: play with that menu button. There's a lot there. That's why I use method 2 far more than method 1.

Hint 2: activate leg is very useful in a number of situations. I use it instead of vectors to final in order to create the leg to the FAF when I am vectored for an instrument approach.

and, you are correct about No airways in the GNS.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Two ways.

1. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the Direct key twice. First tap is direct; second tap is activate leg.

2. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the MENU button. Activate leg is one if the choices.

Hint 1: play with that menu button. There's a lot there. That's why I use method 2 far more than method 1.

Hint 2: activate leg is very useful in a number of situations. I use it instead of vectors to final in order to create the leg to the FAF when I am vectored for an instrument approach.

and, you are correct about No airways in the GNS.
Click to expand...
The direct direct enter is a hidden gem. Makes some of the weird things it wants to do on approaches seamless.
 
benyflyguy said:
The direct direct enter is a hidden gem. Makes some of the weird things it wants to do on approaches seamless.
Click to expand...
:D I'm not sure about "hidden" when we're talking about a unit introduced 25 years ago :D. I learned activate leg as part of basic transition training.

I see @RussR and I share a preference for the Menu key.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Two ways.

1. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the Direct key twice. First tap is direct; second tap is activate leg.

2. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the MENU button. Activate leg is one if the choices.

Hint 1: play with that menu button. There's a lot there. That's why I use method 2 far more than method 1.

Hint 2: activate leg is very useful in a number of situations. I use it instead of vectors to final in order to create the leg to the FAF when I am vectored for an instrument approach.

and, you are correct about No airways in the GNS.
Click to expand...


Thank You

That was exactly what I was looking for. I didn't know about #1.

#2 was my guess at how it should work, but I didn't see it when I tried it. I don't think so, bit I might have had the 1st way point of the FPL highlighted and it might not of showed the Active Leg option.

Thanks Again.

Brian
 
asicer said:
I believe the GPS that preceded the GNS430 (CNX80/GNS480) supported Victor airways as does all of the GPS that came after the GNS430 (GTN, 175/355/375). Sucks to be in that gap.
Click to expand...

I have no inside knowledge of any of this, but the 430 series architecture was developed in the late 90s. As I recall, at that time there was the optimistic belief that with GPS coming into widespread use, there would be no more need for airways. The term was "Free Flight" and "everybody" believed that once leaving the terminal area, airplanes would be cleared more or less direct to their destination.

Obviously it hasn't generally worked out that way, but that belief probably affected the decision to not include airways.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Two ways.

1. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the Direct key twice. First tap is direct; second tap is activate leg.

2. cursor to highlight to end of the leg. Tap the MENU button. Activate leg is one if the choices.

Hint 1: play with that menu button. There's a lot there. That's why I use method 2 far more than method 1.

Hint 2: activate leg is very useful in a number of situations. I use it instead of vectors to final in order to create the leg to the FAF when I am vectored for an instrument approach.
Click to expand...
I didn't know about method #1. Sounds like a handy shortcut.

and, you are correct about No airways in the GNS.
Click to expand...

Of course, one can enter the end points of each leg of an airway, but that's more labor-intensive. (Do you know if the 430 database includes CNF fixes for airway legs that have a dogleg?)
 
RussR said:
I have no inside knowledge of any of this, but the 430 series architecture was developed in the late 90s. As I recall, at that time there was the optimistic belief that with GPS coming into widespread use, there would be no more need for airways. The term was "Free Flight" and "everybody" believed that once leaving the terminal area, airplanes would be cleared more or less direct to their destination.

Obviously it hasn't generally worked out that way, but that belief probably affected the decision to not include airways.
Click to expand...
I guess they didn't think about the issues of direct routings through high mountain ranges for aircraft with limited high-altitude performance.
 
Leg: Direct - Direct - Enter
Fix: Direct - Enter - Enter
Verify by looking at the FPL

Or use the menu button.
 
Palmpilot said:
Of course, one can enter the end points of each leg of an airway, but that's more labor-intensive. (Do you know if the 430 database includes CNF fixes for airway legs that have a dogleg?)
Click to expand...

Do you have an example of a CNF dogleg on an airway?

Yes, one can enter points but that can be incredibly labor intensive. Below is a segment of a trip I've done a few times from home to the NYC area. . The segment depicts the standard IFR routing between Richmond, VA and JFK in NY. File it and you travel "as filed." File something else, and you get it as an amendment. You can't really zoom in but this is one airway, V16. People work around it by starting small and adding waypoints as needed or only entering the the bends.

upload_2023-2-24_13-5-12.png
 
Note that if the V airway is pushed in from ForeFlight via FlightStream then the V airway on FF will be automatically converted and show up on the GNS430 as the appropriate collection of waypoints.
 
brcase said:
Thank You

That was exactly what I was looking for. I didn't know about #1.

#2 was my guess at how it should work, but I didn't see it when I tried it. I don't think so, bit I might have had the 1st way point of the FPL highlighted and it might not of showed the Active Leg option.

Thanks Again.

Brian
Click to expand...
Question: what was the initial clearance loaded into the box? Did you already have KANEK and ALKAL? If that's the case, here's what it would look like (I used the bigger screen 530 but otherwise the same). 1st shot is after activating the leg. But yeah, you need to have the cursor on ALKAL.

upload_2023-2-24_13-20-19.png upload_2023-2-24_13-23-0.png
 
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Others have explained how to do this, but I would also add that manual sequencing is one of the most important things to know in a GPS system. If you are on an approach, and the system does not sequence you (which could happen for a variety of reasons), you could get totally useless indications This has happened to me more than once, in IMC.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Question: what was the initial clearance loaded into the box? Did you already have KANEK and ALKAL? If that's the case, here's what it would look like (I used the bigger screen 530 but otherwise the same). 1st shot is after activating the leg. But yeah, you need to have the cursor on ALKAL.

View attachment 115254 View attachment 115255
Click to expand...

I pretty much had it loaded like you show it. When I hit the Menu Button I think I had Canek Highlighted by the cursor. Which should have still shown the activate Leg option even if it was the wrong leg. I would have figured out from there had I saw the Activate leg option.

Brian
 
sarangan said:
Others have explained how to do this, but I would also add that manual sequencing is one of the most important things to know in a GPS system. If you are on an approach, and the system does not sequence you (which could happen for a variety of reasons), you could get totally useless indications This has happened to me more than once, in IMC.
Click to expand...
Sounds like getting vectors to final with the GPS commanding and the AP making an "unexpected" procedure turn outbound. It hasn't happened to me (it shouldn't but ya never know) but I've heard first person accounts of it happening and watched it happen during recurrent training.
 
midlifeflyer said:
Sounds like getting vectors to final with the GPS commanding and the AP making an "unexpected" procedure turn outbound. It hasn't happened to me (it shouldn't but ya never know) but I've heard first person accounts of it happening and watched it happen during recurrent training.
Click to expand...
I have had this in VFR on practice approaches where the GPS was still sequencing to points or legs I was no longer going to pass due to radar vectors bringing me in closer. My technique is when on radar vectors to switch to heading mode and fly the vectors. That gives me time to que up the gps. On the 430, go into FPL, scroll down to the leg I am going to intercept and activate the leg either by the shortcut method described above or the menu method also described above. Either way, always go back into FPL to verify that what you think is next sequence (active leg or active waypoint) is actually showing. Easy to click the wrong button. But when verify if not correct then easy just fix your mistake and verify again. Then with my leg active and verified and heading towards it on radar vectors when ATC turns me loose, all I have to do is switch from heading mode back to GPSS mode.
 
Palmpilot said:
(CFVGJ), which is 23 NM west of NIKOL intersection on V244.

https://skyvector.com/?ll=37.96513234793375,-119.16137695535174&chart=302&zoom=1

Another one is (KAGYE), 23 NM south of MUREX intersection on V25.

https://skyvector.com/?ll=41.56293100415997,-121.7530632040403&chart=302&zoom=2
Click to expand...
midlifeflyer said:
I would expect them to be there since the only reason for them is GPS. I can check the GNS trainer tomorrow but it is there for the GTN.
Click to expand...


Here you go...
upload_2023-2-25_8-50-33.png
 
Mongoose Aviator said:
I have had this in VFR on practice approaches where the GPS was still sequencing to points or legs I was no longer going to pass due to radar vectors bringing me in closer. My technique is when on radar vectors to switch to heading mode and fly the vectors. That gives me time to que up the gps. On the 430, go into FPL, scroll down to the leg I am going to intercept and activate the leg either by the shortcut method described above or the menu method also described above. Either way, always go back into FPL to verify that what you think is next sequence (active leg or active waypoint) is actually showing. Easy to click the wrong button. But when verify if not correct then easy just fix your mistake and verify again. Then with my leg active and verified and heading towards it on radar vectors when ATC turns me loose, all I have to do is switch from heading mode back to GPSS mode.
Click to expand...
My SOP is similar.

Of course we switch to heading mode - we have to if using the autopilot. ATC will be very upset with us if we don't.

On the GPS end (and GNS, GTN, IFD, whatever, doesn't matter to me; same procedure for all), upon hearing "turn left heading 260. Vectors to the final approach course," I activate the leg to the final approach course. If it's for an ILS, I also switch to green needles at this point (I like to treat automatic switching as a backup). Basically I'm done with everything I need as early in the process as I can. All I need to do is fly the assigned headings, wait for the PTAC, and intercept For the few situations where ATC changes their mind and decides to send me to a waypoint (it doe4s happen and is the reason for the AIMs' guidance to avoid VTF), it's simple enough to go back into the flight plan, make the change and hit the CDI button.
 
I don't know that I've come across any CNF's that are not in standard GPS databases. The practical difference is that they're not readily accessible to ATC, or are depicted on their scopes.
 
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