How much time to spend on Pre-Flight?

azpilot

azpilot

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azpilot
I know the right answer is, "you take as long as you need to take". But I guess what I'm really after is "how long do you usually spend on the pre-flight"?

I feel like I take forever to get through the pre-flight. I timed it the other day and from the time i walked up to the plane I rent parked on the ramp, to the time I was seat belted in and ready to start the engine, it took about 45 minutes. There were some distractions involved. I had two people come up and talk to me, and so I backed up in the checklist to make sure I didn't skip anything, so that probably did make it take longer.

I took about a two year break from flying. In late 2021, I'm just now getting back into it. I've been renting a 172 and a Cherokee, and now I've signed up in a club where I'll be flying a 182 and an Archer. I know bouncing back and forth between airplanes certainly doesn't help. I'm going to have to "re-learn" the pre-flight process. I'm sure I'll get more efficient at it as time goes on, and I get more flights under my belt.
 
In a rental, I do take quite awhile. Even in the plane I own, if it's been on a ramp out of sight for any length of time I take what it takes. When the airplane is in the hangar next to my house and I've flown recently, I don't look as closely, but it still takes long enough that I don't have passengers even come to the hangar until its done in order to not feel rushed.
 
"Kick the tires and light the fires!"

But seriously, you will probably get a lot of variables in answers. Complexity of the aircraft, rental versus owned, frequency of operations, person comfort or overcomfort, lots of factors that can impact how long someone takes.

My Citabria, in my hangar, that no one else has had access to or touched lately, maybe 10 minutes max (as long as I remember to actually pull it out of the hangar). Hopping into the FBO rental, that lord knows who did what last in it, probably longer.
 
I don't worry about how long it takes, but I generally figure from parking my car (pretty close to the tie down) to engine start will be 30 minutes or so. It's a club 172, parked outside, so while I know the plane pretty well, I'm rarely the last person to have flown it.
 
Depends if my wife is along to help, but generally I can start engines about 15 min after parking my car. If she's helping and I don't have to add oil, less than 10.
 
+/-15min

After finding a loose pitch link once, I will never rush a preflight

Little more time if I need to clean the windows
 
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I am the only person flying my plane and it stays in a hangar. Still I like to make a thorough walk around following a standard checklist. I'll still sump the tank even though no fuel has been added and no one has been near the plane.

To another part of your post ... I do not like to be interrupted when pre-flighting the airplane. I also don't care to ride with pilots that do their preflight with a phone in their ear ... but that's just me. :)
 
On average, probably about 15 to 20 minutes, but that includes getting stuff situated and connected in the cockpit, plus other prep like disconnecting the BatteryMinder, pulling chocks and cowl plugs, pulling the plane out of the hangar, etc.

One of the nice things about having my own plane now is that I don't feel as rushed on the pre-flight. When I was renting, I had a block of time reserved and pre-flight time ate into that block.
 
Rather than RASDASEAB*, one thing that will speed things up with the external pre-flight is to learn a flow around the plane, do the flow, then when you are done read your c/l to ensure you didn't miss anything.

My other advice is don't be the jackwagon student/renter doing your pre-flight in front of the fuel pump.

* Read a step, do a step, eat a banana. Pejorative phrase used by some in the Air Force to mock those who are great c/l disciplinarians but don't really know what or why they are doing it.
 
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Van Johnston said:
...one thing that will speed things up with the external pre-flight is to learn a flow around the plane...
Click to expand...

Yep! I've been revising my checklist to arrange items in an orderly flow, so I don't retrace steps.
 
If I’m efficient, about 10 minutes unless there’s something extra I need to do.
 
5-10 minutes for a plane I know well. For a plane you fly a lot, it's amazing how something that is out of place jumps out. A backed out baffle screw, loose baffle or an oil or brake fluid drip seems to be easy to spot at a glance. I put fluorescent marker gel on all the really critical screws, like the ones on the elevator attach brackets, etc. so any anomalies are readily apparent during preflight.
 
Mine are relatively short, but my plane is parked in a hangar, and has been reviewed post flight during bug removal. Post flight takes awhile due to that, connecting a battery tender, venting the dip stick (yes I get actual steam after shutdown and have the stick out for the 15-20 minutes it takes to clean the bugs off leading edges and windshield).
 
More practice and recency makes it go faster, but as others have said, it takes as long as it takes.
 
What are you doing that is taking so long? 45 one minute tasks or is something taking the majority of the time. Or are you just inefficient at doing the tasks.

3-5 minutes open the cockpit cycle and position control.
3-5 minutes to sump the tanks and check the fuel levels.
1-2 minutes to check the oil and inside the engine cowling.
3-5 minutes to walk around, undo tie downs, and move and check all the controls and connections.
So somewhere between 10-17 minutes until I am sitting in the seat getting ready to start.
Maybe another 2-5 minutes, setting radios, seat position, listen to Awos/ATIS. Before engine start.

I could see maybe 45 minutes if it includes adding oil, cleaning the windshield, and fueling , opening closing hanger doors the airplane.

Are you spending a lot of time going to get a ladder.
Going to get a rag to check the oil.
Going to the car to get the iPad.
Or is the time really being spent preflighting?

Maybe you should practice your preflight. If the plane isn’t being used for anything else I bet you could ask to just go do a preflight on it, even if you don’t fly. If you do it everyday for a week I bet you will get a lot faster.

After you do it a few times regularly you will get a flow so you will be more efficient at it.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
For the club plane, I take at least 20min, maybe close to 30. That thing gets rode hard and put away wet, and I don't fly it often, so I want to make sure nothing has worn out or fallen off since last time. It also sits outside a fair bit, so I have gotten water out of the tanks a couple times. 45 min from walking out until startup really isn't THAT unreasonable for a rental, especially if you're like me and have to mount the tablet, fire up the stratux, check the time in the book, etc.

My plane, which is only flown by me and lives in a hangar, I only spend 5-10 minutes on. I worry sometimes that I should be more thorough, but I'm the only person who even has a key to the hangar, so there's a pretty reasonable expectation it will be in the same condition I left it in. I also do a lot of the maintenance on it, so I'm pretty "close" to it, and the post flight rubdown touches a lot of the places you look on a normal preflight. Oil & gas always get visual verification, but sometimes that's about it. It's one of the best things about having your own plane.

I like the idea of torque seal paint on critical fasteners. I can think of a couple spots I'd like to do that.
 
Distractions are the worst for pre-flights. I love shootin' the bull but only after I am done flying :)

We drive in the hangar from the back garage door. SO, unless I crank up the stereo, no one really knows we are even in there. Rather than having the slow door opening while I preflight I leave it closed until its pre-flighted and loaded. Definitely keep it shut in the winter even though not heated yet. When its really hot in the summer I will open it right away if there will be a breeze. Then begins the routine:

Remove cowl plugs and pitot cover, unlock doors, remove gust lock, throw stuff on the seat.
Unplug battery tender ext cord.
Unplug tannis heater ext cord.
Stick fuel and sump tanks (no exceptions).
Grab wall mounted flash light.
Verify oil fill cap and lanyard, check dipstick and belly sump.
Write fuel, oil and tach time in our tiny log book (inside plane) and up on white board.
Full walk around plane starting in front by pilot side door and ending at prop.
- Spend majority of time on ailerons - piano hinges & pins & actuator, elevator hinges, elevator trim actuator, etc.
- Check tires periodically - more in winter but always check brakes
- Extra time on prop for unwanted blade twist, flexing. Flashlight for oil leaks and check leading edge
End with re-verify dipstick locked and oil access doors shut.
Flashlight back on the wall to charge again.
Install tablet, hook up headset(s), turn on CO detector & inReach
Open hangar door
Push out
Start hangar door closing and pee
Lock front door

....That always takes me 15-20 minutes. So I always get to the airport 30min before I plan to be in the air and its usually pretty close. Winter adds 15 minutes because I start a small cabin heater in the early part and unplug it right before pushing it out. I think any quicker and I would start miss things.

Add in Gopro's and its anyones's guess.
 
I'm about 15-20 minutes, depending. Two things have saved time: (i) first thing I do is check fuel (and top of wings), so that if I need to order fuel, I can do the rest of the preflight while waiting; (ii) now that I'm familiar with the checklist, do the preflight, then go through the checklist to make sure I didn't forget anything (rather than going item by item, which takes me a lot of time finding my place on the page, returning eyes to the airplane, and interrupts flow). Before these two things, and when I wasn't as familiar with the preflight checklist, I'd be more in the 20-40 minute range. Note, this does NOT include startup and runup, which is another 10-ish minutes.

Now, if the plane has frost, add 20 minutes...
 
20 minutes unless you are cleaning the windscreen and/or fueling.
 
I too am the only person flying my Warrior II and do most of the maintenance under supervision. It lives in a closed hangar. About 30 minutes from driving up to the hangar to ready to pull it out. I include cockpit setup (headset, kneepad, iPad) in my preflight ritual. I figure an hour from stopping the truck to lift off and I'm doing pretty well.
 
Kick the tires, check the barf bags, check the oil and go.!!

Kidding of course, but the time spent on pre-flight depends on the airplane, who is maintaining it (Pt 91 or Pt 135) and what the plane is used for among others. (passenger or cargo or off airport for example)
 
A good follow up question is how much shorter does the pre-flight get when you're starting the return le
Van Johnston said:
Rather than RASDASEAB*, one thing that will speed things up with the external pre-flight is to learn a flow around the plane, do the flow, then when you are done read your c/l to ensure you didn't miss anything.
Click to expand...

Great feedback. It's a checklist, not a do list.
 
Or with a team and practice, 1 minute 40 seconds from arrival to launch with the glider.

I have done about 15 minutes with 2 experienced helpers, but not rehearsed.
Is interesting to be driving into the airport with the glider in the trailer at 1:00 and at 1:15 be circling over the airport climbing in a thermal.
Normal time is about 45 minutes with the glider.

Brian
 
Groundpounder said:
Depends if my wife is along to help, but generally I can start engines about 15 min after parking my car. If she's helping and I don't have to add oil, less than 10.
Click to expand...

If my wife helps it takes longer. I kid, I kid. ;) She usually gets the headsets ready and gets the other gadgetry running.

Normal pre-flight 10-15 minutes. Our T-hanger is open to other hangers but there is very little people traffic. There is only one other regularly flying plane in the row. I know my partner would tell me if there were any issues if he flew it before me. He emails me the tach when he is done as I log things like fuel burn and oil use. The Champ I fly that is owned by the museum I take a closer look at as it sits in an open hanger with visitors and people who like to let their kids sit in planes and hang on things but it is a Champ so it really doesn't take long there isn't much to look at.

Generally it goes like this for my 172.

Open the hanger doors
Open the plane doors
Pull the flaps, Johnson bar
Pull the gust lock
Pull the master
Check the lights
Turn off master
Sump the fuel
Pull the cowl covers
Start at the prop and do a complete walk around and detailed look at everything
Check the oil add if necessary
Finish setting up electronics if necessary
Remove chocks
Pull the airplane out of the hanger
Put tow bar back in hanger
Take several steps back and do a final once over just to be sure things are straight and level
Saddle up and fire up
 
50 foot "has anyone mucked with my plane since I parked it last?" assessment
has fuel
has oil
baggage doors secured

Those are every time, every flight.

Other checks based on suspicion level from the muckery assessment. Usually first flight of the day will do the walkaround, jiggle ailerons, make sure i didnt chock or chain myself, but those are a minute or three tops.

I think short preflights are one of the perks of ownership and hangarage, when people complain about the costs -- you're getting a "known" plane in a "known" condition in exchange for that wheelbarrowful of cash that you light on fire every flight. :D
 
this
Van Johnston said:
Rather than RASDASEAB*, one thing that will speed things up with the external pre-flight is to learn a flow around the plane, do the flow, then when you are done read your c/l to ensure you didn't miss anything.

My other advice is don't be the jackwagon student/renter doing your pre-flight in front of the fuel pump.

* Read a step, do a step, eat a banana. Pejorative phrase used by some in the Air Force to mock those who are great c/l disciplinarians but don't really know what or why they are doing it.
Click to expand...

Learning the flow is key....but that's really only good for known aircraft that you fly enough to know it. It helps for unfamiliar aircraft of course, but you won't know what to check on something unfamiliar. One important point though...after doing the flow, really do the checklist for real, point by point. It's awful easy to rush that part and gloss over things. you tend to see what you want to see, read what you want to read....

The thing I've noticed....most checklists.... the one in the manual, those checkmate cards, etc.... have a lot of extraneous stuff and do things out of order. They are kind of horrible in my opinion both as a checklist or as a to do list. Too verbose, too many things marked "if equipped", say things that go without saying, etc....
 
Brad W said:
The thing I've noticed....most checklists.... the one in the manual, those checkmate cards, etc.... have a lot of extraneous stuff and do things out of order. They are kind of horrible in my opinion both as a checklist or as a to do list. Too verbose, too many things marked "if equipped", say things that go without saying, etc....
Click to expand...

Exactly. Best to use those standard checklists as a guide and make your own custom version, tailored to your plane, your flow, and any special extra items you need.

That reminds me - I should add “Take airplane keys out of pocket” before the seatbelts item.... :)
 
I’m about 5-10 minutes. Maybe a bit longer if I’m parked overnight on an unknown ramp and have the airplane cover on, or if I have the cowl covered during the winter to let the engine heater work a bit less.
 
If its a nice 70 degree day then 10 minutes. If its 15 degrees and the ramps a slurry of deice fluid and slush then however long it takes me to run around the plane.
 
azpilot said:
I know the right answer is, "you take as long as you need to take". But I guess what I'm really after is "how long do you usually spend on the pre-flight"?

I feel like I take forever to get through the pre-flight. I timed it the other day and from the time i walked up to the plane I rent parked on the ramp, to the time I was seat belted in and ready to start the engine, it took about 45 minutes. There were some distractions involved. I had two people come up and talk to me, and so I backed up in the checklist to make sure I didn't skip anything, so that probably did make it take longer.

I took about a two year break from flying. In late 2021, I'm just now getting back into it. I've been renting a 172 and a Cherokee, and now I've signed up in a club where I'll be flying a 182 and an Archer. I know bouncing back and forth between airplanes certainly doesn't help. I'm going to have to "re-learn" the pre-flight process. I'm sure I'll get more efficient at it as time goes on, and I get more flights under my belt.
Click to expand...

I find that the key is to be focused and purposeful. I hate it when I climb into the cockpit and then I can't remember if I checked for this or that. The worst is after I am strapped in and ready to start, I can't remember if I removed the tow bar. Even though I am 99% sure I did, that 1% doubt is enough to make me unbuckle and get out just for my peace of mind. This type of stuff only happens if my mind is somwhere else as I am preflighting. Being focused and attentive is critical.

I don't think you can measure the effectiveness of a preflight by length of time. Complexity of the airplane and familiarity makes a huge difference. I can do a basic preflight in our club R182 in 5 minutes (when I am fully focused), but if it is a cross country trip where I need to set up my tablet, portable batteries, drinks and snacks, briefing passengers etc.. it could take a lot longer.
 
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azpilot said:
I know the right answer is, "you take as long as you need to take". But I guess what I'm really after is "how long do you usually spend on the pre-flight"?

I feel like I take forever to get through the pre-flight. I timed it the other day and from the time i walked up to the plane I rent parked on the ramp, to the time I was seat belted in and ready to start the engine, it took about 45 minutes. There were some distractions involved. I had two people come up and talk to me, and so I backed up in the checklist to make sure I didn't skip anything, so that probably did make it take longer.

I took about a two year break from flying. In late 2021, I'm just now getting back into it. I've been renting a 172 and a Cherokee, and now I've signed up in a club where I'll be flying a 182 and an Archer. I know bouncing back and forth between airplanes certainly doesn't help. I'm going to have to "re-learn" the pre-flight process. I'm sure I'll get more efficient at it as time goes on, and I get more flights under my belt.
Click to expand...
The important thing is not to rush, with half of your attention always already on the next step instead of what you're doing.

For example, when you're looking at the left wing, let the aileron pushrod be the only thing that matters to you while you're checking in. and then when you finish the whole wing group, stop, take a deep breath and pray* "Lord*, did I do that right?". If nothing jumps into your head in 5–10 seconds, then breathe again, shake out your shoulders, and move on to the next group of inspection steps.

* substitute alternative religious or non religious terms of choice for "pray" and "Lord".

(I stole this idea from Nevil Shute's 1951 novel Round the Bend.)
 
Re Nevil Shute, "Slide Rule" should be required reading as part of any college degree program.

I follow the same pre-flight procedure every time. I'm not smart, so I need systems.
Before the airport, I get an online briefing. Besides the weather, I'm looking for goofy local notams and tfrs. I also check NOAA GFA. That maybe takes 10 minutes
At the airport I get my flying stuff ready, turn on the tablet, gps, put on the watch, etc.
I'll ask how the local weather is, and if there's anything goofy about the plane.

Walking to the plane I stop maybe 50 feet out. Look at the stance, the shape. Is it bent/crooked, etc?
Next I pull any pitot or cowl covers.
Next check fuel, both tanks, must be at a known level. Tabs or higher for a PA-28. Get fuel if required.
Next put away those covers, load my stuff in the plane, set trim, grab fuel tester.
Sump fuel at each point, always. Put away fuel tester. Turn on strobe. Check strobe. Turn off strobe via master.
Walk around and do the preflight. Special attention to make sure trim is actually set right.
Special attention that all latches are closed.
Last step outside is to check the oil.
Then inside, check the seat position, complete the inside portion, and I'm ready to go.
I think that takes about 10-15 minutes.

Between that 50' point and the rest of the preflight I ignore anyone around me except the line guy for fuel.
Interrupting someone while they're doing a preflight is pretty much a jerk move, unless they're asking if you need fuel.
 
10-15 minutes without fueling. My plane I own and is in a hangar so I know the relative condition it was left in from the prior flight which makes it go by faster than when I rented. I still do the flow I learned as a student 20 years ago. when I was renting it would take me closer to 30 minutes.
 
Half Fast said:
That reminds me - I should add “Take airplane keys out of pocket” before the seatbelts item.... :)
Click to expand...

Ah, SOOOO relatable!

Prime.
Primer in and locked.
Mixture - Full Rich.
Throttle - slight. Master - On.
CLEAR PROP.
Mags...oh hold on...*struggles to retrieve keys from pocket without taking off seatbelt*
CLEAR Pr...nevermind, still clear from the last time I called it.
Mags to start.
 
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