How I almost/did fail the checkride because..

Z06_Mir said:
I'm told in my area it's 1 in 5 that pass it the first time around.. 80% fail rate :yikes: Not looking forward to that ride.. oh and it's 2 days.
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Alot of that is an old wive's tail...Most people I know (myself included) passed the CFI initial on the first try.
 
flyingron said:
The 480 ******* at you if you've selected an ILS or VOR approach and you've not tuned the NAV side (it even puts the right frequency in the standby) and further gripes at you if you don't switch the CDI over.
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The 430/530 series will show a message which says "Select VLOC on CDI for approach" however most people just acknowledge the message and don't read it so the yellow MSG flashing annunciation goes away. Defeats the whole purpose of the message.
 
flyingron said:
The 480 ******* at you if you've selected an ILS or VOR approach and you've not tuned the NAV side (it even puts the right frequency in the standby) and further gripes at you if you don't switch the CDI over.
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In fact, for ILSs, it can be set to automatically switch the CDI to NAV mode at a certain point (I'd have to check, but I believe it's when established within a certain distance from the FAF). Handy little setting, though personally I like to switch it myself before that point. I have it set to auto though, just in case I forget. ;)
 
There are different ways to approach (no pun intended) instrument training and all of them are probably valid for different students. My first CFII did start out with the basics, but by lesson 4 or so he had me flying approaches. I had been working on my scan and studying instrument flying before starting the actual training (in fact, years before). Good instructors also adjust the pace of training to the student.
 
Took me two tries to pass the IR ride. I screwed up one of the approaches. One I got credit for was an ILS where I had the ILS tuned and identified, was solid on glide slope and localizer, but I had pushed a wrong button the 430 somewhere and it was telling me I needed to be going in the opposite direction. I told the DPE was was happening, but I was established and was completing the approach, regardless of the message on the 430. He was happy with that.

If you fail the first time some remedial training from your CFII will fix it and you go back (and pay some more money). That's the best part about passing the first time, avoiding re-test fees from DPEs.
 
DPE turned off the GPS once the plane was started with a "we won't be needing that 'till the end" statement.

I got the pinkslip as a result of a botched VOR-A approach. During the approach he started giving me a complex, non-standard hold for the missed right as I approached the IAF, which required a PT. I blew through the radial and it was game over.

He told me after that I should have asked him to standby. He was doing his job and managed to distract me whilst my head should have been elsewhere. Lesson learned and the re-test a week later involved flying that VOR-A approach and then to heading back to the field.

Oh the oral was also pretty strenuous @ 3 1/2 hours!

- Tim
 
I'm pretty sure I came about 30 seconds from busting my instrument ride...was getting vectors for an ILS 08 into BTP and nearly blew through the localizer! Thankfully the controller gave me a final "turn right 090 to intercept 3000 until established blah blah"

Saved my bacon on that one. The DPE knew it too. Other than that it went fine. Flew one of my best no gyro approaches to date.
 
Arbiter419 said:
I'm pretty sure I came about 30 seconds from busting my instrument ride...was getting vectors for an ILS 08 into BTP and nearly blew through the localizer! Thankfully the controller gave me a final "turn right 090 to intercept 3000 until established blah blah"

Saved my bacon on that one. The DPE knew it too. Other than that it went fine. Flew one of my best no gyro approaches to date.
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If the controller vectored you through the localizer you wouldn't be failed for that.
 
My instrument ride went GREAT... Until I failed.

The oral was a fun discussion at the end of which the DPE said, "I like the way you think. Let's go fly."

I nailed the maneuvers, I nailed the first approach (can't remember what it was offhand), DPE said "OK now do the VOR/DME 32, full procedure" (KMSN) and I caught him - There's no way to do that one without vectors. Nailed that one, went missed, and came back around for an ILS to 36.

Here's where I failed: Just after I got the clearance ("Archer 62S, you're 3 miles from OZMIX, maintain 2700 until established, cleared ILS 36"), he failed nav1. No problem, thanks to the myriad of failures my CFII threw at me, I already had Nav2 ready to go, tuned and all. Switched to that to fly the localizer (no GS on #2 on that plane), it was coming alive, I turned final and got established, and began my descent.

15 seconds or so later, the DPE says, "Where's OZMIX?"

:mad2::mad2::mad2::mad2::mad2::(:(:(

I was so keyed into "maintain 2700 until established" that I forgot to wait until after the FAF to begin my descent. DPE said "That's too bad, you flew the whole ride to ATP standards up to that point." That didn't make me feel any better. I was ready to just give up and not get the IR at that point. DPE and CFII talked me out of that, CFII took me up for an approach, signed me off again, and I shot the last approach to finish the ride the next day.

I'm kinda glad it happened, actually - You can be sure I double-check before I descend now, every time!
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Here's where I failed: Just after I got the clearance ("Archer 62S, you're 3 miles from OZMIX, maintain 2700 until established, cleared ILS 36"), he failed nav1. No problem, thanks to the myriad of failures my CFII threw at me, I already had Nav2 ready to go, tuned and all. Switched to that to fly the localizer (no GS on #2 on that plane), it was coming alive, I turned final and got established, and began my descent.

15 seconds or so later, the DPE says, "Where's OZMIX?"

:mad2::mad2::mad2::mad2::mad2::(:(:(

I was so keyed into "maintain 2700 until established" that I forgot to wait until after the FAF to begin my descent.
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I'm having trouble following what you did. You maintained 2700 until established on the localizer, as instructed. Then, once established, you intercepted the glide slope and descended with it? Or you mean you just started on down without the glide slope at all? I guess I'm just not seeing what the FAF has to do with this situation.

edit- ignore all that... now I realize that you didn't have a #2 glide slope, so obviously you weren't tracking it. But you'd still be able to descend to 2500' before OZMIX... I take it you were headed on down to 1420 or lower before you reaced OZMIX?
 
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dukeblue219 said:
I'm having trouble following what you did. You maintained 2700 until established on the localizer, as instructed. Then, once established, you intercepted the glide slope and descended with it? Or you mean you just started on down without the glide slope at all? I guess I'm just not seeing what the FAF has to do with this situation.

edit- ignore all that... now I realize that you didn't have a #2 glide slope, so obviously you weren't tracking it. But you'd still be able to descend to 2500' before OZMIX... I take it you were headed on down to 1420 or lower before you reaced OZMIX?
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Exactly. I think I was down to well under 2300 before he said anything... Gave me every chance to catch it and miss, but I didn't.
 
EppyGA said:
My DPE mentioned that and as we were flying the ILS approach on my ride he thought I was going to forget it and was yelling at me about it. Actually he yelled during the whole ride. Seems to be his method of trying to shake you and get you to throw your hands up and quit.
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The 430 should kick over to white needles on its own just prior to the FAF
It is fine to intercept in gps as long as you are in vloc before passing the FAF..just brief what your doing.
 
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taters said:
The 430 should kick over to white needles on its own just prior to the FAF
It is fine to intercept in gps as long as you are in vloc before passing the FAF..just brief what your doing.
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I had it under control but apparently he was worried about it. :D I certianly didn't want to have to do it again.
 
saracelica said:
Okay I may be a little paranoid but I'm hoping the IR ticket doesn't take over 100 hours like the PPL did so I'm being very structured with my studies. Was hoping to pick the brains of you fine people.

You can answer the question several ways, how you almost failed the checkride (were you not cleared for the approach), how you did fail it, or what good advice did your CFI give you that I probably heard a couple times over the last 12 hours of training that made it all click for you. During my PPL I forgot the fuel pump on take off and busted that section of the checkride and passed the rest. I will NEVER forget the fuel pump switch again.
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I had what one of my buddies calls a very thorough instructor and did spend something like 100 hours getting my IR. The checkride went very smoothly, though. I managed to not pass my checkride the first time with my private pilot so it was nice to pass the IR the first time.
 
Anybody take a check ride recently and use ONLY Foreflight or another EFB app for charts? I'm wondering if DPEs are "coming of age" with the technology options or being sticklers about having paper as a backup. After all, even the airlines are flying without paper charts now.

As to the training order, I started with several hours of dedicated simulator training on the items Jesse listed, with a seasoned old salt who had lost his medical but could still do ground training. When I finally went into the air, my CFII said I was one of the best prepared students he'd seen, and I passed my IFR checkride on the first attempt.
 
My partial panel approach on the checkride was truly ugly. I did a mock checkride the Sunday before on which I flew the same approach, with the same problem, then reflew it and did a better job. It seems to be something I need work on, I do not do well when partial panel and ATC vectors me in tight, and I have to lose a lot of altitude in a short distance. I thought for sure the DPE would fail me at that point, but he just made sure I was using the approved NAV source, then had me go visual for the circle to land.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Anybody take a check ride recently and use ONLY Foreflight or another EFB app for charts? I'm wondering if DPEs are "coming of age" with the technology options or being sticklers about having paper as a backup. After all, even the airlines are flying without paper charts now.
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I had the paper charts along and told the DPE that, and he basically said don't worry, we won't really be IFR. I'm quite sure he would have been okay with Foreflight only.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Anybody take a check ride recently and use ONLY Foreflight or another EFB app for charts? I'm wondering if DPEs are "coming of age" with the technology options or being sticklers about having paper as a backup. After all, even the airlines are flying without paper charts now.

As to the training order, I started with several hours of dedicated simulator training on the items Jesse listed, with a seasoned old salt who had lost his medical but could still do ground training. When I finally went into the air, my CFII said I was one of the best prepared students he'd seen, and I passed my IFR checkride on the first attempt.
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I did my Instrument Ride with my iPad and ForeFlight. I did print out paper copies of the approach plates just in case.
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Anybody take a check ride recently and use ONLY Foreflight or another EFB app for charts? I'm wondering if DPEs are "coming of age" with the technology options or being sticklers about having paper as a backup. After all, even the airlines are flying without paper charts now.

As to the training order, I started with several hours of dedicated simulator training on the items Jesse listed, with a seasoned old salt who had lost his medical but could still do ground training. When I finally went into the air, my CFII said I was one of the best prepared students he'd seen, and I passed my IFR checkride on the first attempt.
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I've sent 4 instrument students to checkrides with the iPad running Foreflight being the only thing they used for approach plates and cross country planning.
 
I got my PPL in 2004 at age 52. Got my IR next year. I failed the check ride because I arrived at my 2500' FAF at 3000'. I actually caught my mistake be fore I reached the fix. I looked over at the examiner and told him, "Crap, I missed my altitude." it was too late to 'dive' down. He was glad to see I noticed the error, but said he could not pass me. I understood. So I returned to my home base, my instructor went up with me, we spent 10 minutes flying to my FAF, met with the examiner in Michigan City next day. We took off and literally within 10 minutes were back on the ground with my IR ticket. He said the only thing he had to check me on was the fix altitude. I met it and he said that's it. In 2005 I bought a 1981 Saratoga and haven't flown a VFR flight yet. Well maybe one. I don't ever file on a bad weather day, but that's not why I wanted the IR. I flew to Mackinac Island several times when I could not have made the trip VFR although weather was fine at both ends. Plus if questionable weather does appear, it's such a comfort to have the confidence to complete the trip. I do have to say I'm probably not as smart as some of these other posters because this was one of the hardest things I've attempted. But, I made it.....
 
dcmoser said:
In 2005 I bought a 1981 Saratoga and haven't flown a VFR flight yet
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Don't do any proficiency flights that aren't instrument? Like practicing engine out and other emergency procedures?
 
Beware of this one in a /A cockpit ..this got my sim partner busted on a check-ride.

You are on a DME based approach..the DME quietly fails prior to the FAF...dont forget that timer.

Also remember "same side safe" if you have an OBS set to a crossing radial..you haven't passed it yet if your heading is displayed on the same side of the OBS as the needle... doesn't matter to or from.
 
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jesse said:
Don't do any proficiency flights that aren't instrument? Like practicing engine out and other emergency procedures?
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Well yes, I actually meant point to point flying. A friend of mine exchange our IR currency flying and some BFR flying turns into maybe a VFR stop for lunch. But I mainly meant I file a 100 mile trip on crystal clear days. I figure when I need it weather wise I'm pretty accustomed to how the system flows. So, I correct myself to most flights......
 
Dave Krall CFII said:
We took off for a straight out departure for the first few legs of the simulated X-country portion before joining our Victor Airway and on lift-off the FAA examiner popped the usual door but, also "accidently" jerked the chart enough that it flew outside into the slipstream! I figured, "I'm not going to fall for him tricking me into starting out on a cross-country with no chart." He then pretended to get sick with the dry heaves as I turned a precautionary crosswind and then we actually hit an air pocket and he did puke up quite a bit with the bumps, asking repeatedly for a sickbag which I gave him while turning onto the downwind. He kept saying, "Just fly normally and treat me like a passenger. Sorry about the puke stink, I'll light a match..." but the whole matchbook caught on fire with considerable sulphorous smoke.

I opened my window to vent the smoke and stink out but the breeze blew the sticky sickbag down onto the cockpit floor and blew the flaming matchbook into his crotchal area as I turned onto base. Like many others in the heat of summer, he'd worn khaki shorts for coolness but the exposed skin was in quite a bit of pain from second degree burning at that point and I had to hit his crotch with a blast from a little canister of Halon from my flightbag, I don't know, maybe that wasn't necessary because of all the wet puke, but best to be sure, for safety. He was now making quite a bit of noises altogether like coughing, gaging, spitting up vomit and yelling (but no cussing cause he was FAA) -all mixed up.

I knew to expect distractions and by now I'm thinking, "Man, this guy's GOOD!" I can also tell you that I NEVER smelt anything like it at that point. Then as I turned onto final he sort of spasmed up all rigid like and quit making noise, except his legs were spasmed straight out onto the rudder pedals and he was grasping at his throat and chest. He was a pretty big ol' boy too, so I had to reach over and sort of bang upwards on the back of both his knees with my right fist to unlock his legs from blocking my rudder pedals.

He had a lot of years on his airframe too, so to speak, and I figured it was no check ride drill anymore and a real honest to goodness cardiac arrest at that point and was reaching for the mike to radio for an ambulance on short final when he said, "OK, go around and we'll finish the checkride." Altogether a pretty standard checkride and then later on after the flight he gave me my temporary IFR rating.

Hope this helps, and good luck, we're all counting on you....
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That is the craziest story I have ever heard. It's just too insane to be
true. The examiner actually lit a match in the cockpit? You had time
to find an extinguisher to put out his crotch-torial area during
base/final? Good heavens :)
 
Kent, I don't understand the part about not being able to fly the VOR/DME RWY 32 at MSN without radar vectors. There are two fixes from which the approach can be flown without any assistance (the IAF and the feeder).

As for things to watch out for, I got myself in trouble on a published hold during a missed. I was executing a parallel hold entry when the DPE hit me with some pretty good distractions. End result, once I hit the holding fix, I turned the same way I did during the parallel hold entry.
 
coma24 said:
Kent, I don't understand the part about not being able to fly the VOR/DME RWY 32 at MSN without radar vectors. There are two fixes from which the approach can be flown without any assistance (the IAF and the feeder).
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The IAF is not part of the enroute structure, and we were not GPS equipped. On the current plate it looks possible to fly to Janesville and do the feeder off the VOR... Not sure if that feeder was there 8 years ago or not. ;)
 
skyjake said:
As far as ALL check rides go, I recommend using a DE you know and like. Or, use one you can find a lot of info on. To me, this is just working smart.
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This is what I did. I got as much information from others that took their ride with the same DPE and it paid off. The ride was exactly as others had written about, where I was going, what approaches I would do, where to hold and airwork.

But make no mistake, even knowing ahead of time where you will be going is no guarantee for success. You still need to perform.

I was a nervous wreck and worried mostly about the oral, which was a full two hours. In the end it turned out that I was over-prepared for the oral and flight portion. He got me on a few questions, but I was at the top of my game. The worrying paid off because it made me study that much harder.
 
I actually flew up to the airport where the DPE was and he was up with another student and we walked up and shook his hand and I asked for his weight so I could preplan the W&B, etc.. and did he want me to do anything else special. He gave us the hint that we'd fly most of our approaches at this airport (which we figured I should practice at anyhow).

Frankly it was a good experience for me. No attempt to play games or stump the chump. Straight forward oral and flight. Did get some odd stuff thrown at me I'd not done before but frankly nothing I couldn't handle (he did unusual attitudes by having me fly around and execute maneuvers with my eyes closed until I got into the attitude he wanted....I found that very unnerving...much more so than the 'put your head down while I fly a bit' method).
 
flyingron said:
I actually flew up to the airport where the DPE was and he was up with another student and we walked up and shook his hand and I asked for his weight so I could preplan the W&B, etc.. and did he want me to do anything else special. He gave us the hint that we'd fly most of our approaches at this airport (which we figured I should practice at anyhow).

Frankly it was a good experience for me. No attempt to play games or stump the chump. Straight forward oral and flight. Did get some odd stuff thrown at me I'd not done before but frankly nothing I couldn't handle (he did unusual attitudes by having me fly around and execute maneuvers with my eyes closed until I got into the attitude he wanted....I found that very unnerving...much more so than the 'put your head down while I fly a bit' method).
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That method of unusual attitude entry is... ugh. I hate it so much. It's very, very effective in my experience at getting you good and mixed up (and also a good lesson on not trusting your body - trust your instruments!), but it is EXTREMELY unnerving to me.
 
saracelica said:
Okay I may be a little paranoid but I'm hoping the IR ticket doesn't take over 100 hours like the PPL did so I'm being very structured with my studies. Was hoping to pick the brains of you fine people.

You can answer the question several ways, how you almost failed the checkride (were you not cleared for the approach), how you did fail it, or what good advice did your CFI give you that I probably heard a couple times over the last 12 hours of training that made it all click for you. During my PPL I forgot the fuel pump on take off and busted that section of the checkride and passed the rest. I will NEVER forget the fuel pump switch again.
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I was being vectored for a LOC-BC approach. I had verified the navaid on NAV1, dialed in the CDI to the BC and was waiting for the needle to come alive. It did not. I started trying to figure out what was going on while still flying the last heading. My ATC was to intercept the LOC-BC and was cleared for the approach. Just as I was in the middle of my troubleshooting ATC advised me I had flown through the course. I asked for new vectors and started setting up NAV2.

It was then that the examiner pointed out that the GPS/Nav switch was in the GPS position. IOW the CDI was not actually hooked up to the NAV output. She told me that since I had caught it and knew something was wrong and did a half decent attempt at trying to fix it and responded to ATC well that it would be my one and only mulligan for the checkride. FWIW I did pass after flying everything else within tolerances.
 
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