NorthEast Ohio
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NorthEast Ohio
Nowhere on this plate do I see GPS is required. So, How do you do the missed approach procedure?
How do you do the missed approach procedure? GPS required?
- Thread starter NorthEast Ohio
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Nowhere on this plate do I see GPS is required. So, How do you do the missed approach procedure?
dmspilot
Final Approach
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Upper left, above "RADAR required".
AIM 1-2-2 explains RNP, but the explanation is not very good in my opinion. To me, the FAA seems to have used nomenclature that is needlessly confusing. But to fly RNAV procedures and use of WAAS GPS, you must understand it.
@RussR has a decent explanation of required equipment on his website.
Goodbye /DME, Hello Equipment Requirements Notes!
@RussR has a decent explanation of required equipment on his website.
Goodbye /DME, Hello Equipment Requirements Notes!
NorthEast Ohio
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Thank you for the info. So I guess that means if there’s some kind of RAIM prediction/GPS outage you will not be able to fly a GPS approach nor have the ILS as a back up.
MauleSkinner
Touchdown! Greaser!
The FAA wanted to sound Continental.
I think I’m turning European
i think I’m turning european
i really think so!
You wouldn't be able the fly the ILS approach that you referenced, but a GPS outage wouldn't disallow all ILS approaches. In fact, there is a program called the VOR MON program which would allow backup coverage in the case of a GPS outage which would include ILSs.
With respect to RAIM, your options will depend on the type of GPS receiver you have. If you have WAAS capabilty, you have much more flexibility and you're relieved of the requirement to check RAIM prediction. Here again, the AIM 1-1-17 and 1-1-18 makes this topic more confusing than it needs to be with their choice of terminology and phrasing.
I've heard it going to change again. Like a lot of changes in nomenclature over the past 30 years or so, it's all about recognizing that aviation is international.
MauleSkinner
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yeah, I’m just a little salty about some stuff my company does to penalize non-EASA pilots.
Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
91.175 Takeoff and landing under IFR.
(a) Instrument approaches to civil airports. Unless otherwise authorized by the FAA, when it is necessary to use an instrument approach to a civil airport, each person operating an aircraft must use a standard instrument approach procedure prescribed in part 97 of this chapter for that airport
§ 91.187 Operation under IFR in controlled airspace: Malfunction reports.
(a) The pilot in command of each aircraft operated in controlled airspaceunder IFR shall report as soon as practical to ATC any malfunctions of navigational, approach, or communication equipment occurring in flight.
(b) In each report required by paragraph (a) of this section, the pilot in command shall include the—
(1) Aircraft identification;
(2) Equipment affected;
(3) Degree to which the capability of the pilot to operate under IFR in the ATC system is impaired; and
(4) Nature and extent of assistance desired from ATC.
Some locations have a preplanned alternate
missed approach procedure for use in the event the
primary NAVAID used for the missed approach
procedure is unavailable. To avoid confusion, the
alternate missed approach instructions are not
published on the chart. However, the alternate missed
approach holding pattern will be depicted on the
instrument approach chart for pilot situational
awareness and to assist ATC by not having to issue
detailed holding instructions. The alternate missed
approach may be based on NAVAIDs not used in the
approach procedure or the primary missed approach.
When the alternate missed approach procedure is
implemented by NOTAM, it becomes a mandatory.
Short of declaring an emergency, I think you are out of luck being issued an approach for 4R at EWR with an RNAV failure.
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I would imagine it's to avoid a traffic conflict with a procedure of sort for another airport. Teterboro is right next door in that general direction, my guess is it would be something to do with that.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
That's actually the PBN Requirements Box. Any equipment listed there is required equipment just as if it was in the Equipment Requirements Box
What additional information are you providing? I have no idea what the point of your comment is and why you quoted me.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
None of the Approaches at Newark have an Alternate Missed Approach. Here's an excerpt from the latest Amendment to the ILS or LOC RWY 4R, effective 05/10/2023 explaining why.
CHANGES - REASONS
- INCORPORATED APPLICABLE CHANGES FROM FDC 1/7776, 0/2604, AND 7/7220.
- TERMINAL ROUTES: CHANGED MISSED APPROACH INSTRUCTIONS FROM “CLIMB TO 600 THEN CLIMBING RIGHT TURN TO 2500 ON HEADING 060 AND TEB VOR/DME R-205 TO TEB VOR/DME AND HOLD” TO “(DO NOT EXCEED 210 KIAS UNTIL NEBTE) CLIMB TO 560 THEN CLIMBING RIGHT TURN TO 2000 DIRECT TYNIE THEN LEFT TURN ON TRACK 014.97 TO NEBTE, CROSS NEBTE AT OR BELOW 2000 THEN CLIMBING LEFT TURN TO 3000 ON TRACK 313.46 TO FLYRS AND HOLD, CONTINUE CLIMB-IN-HOLD TO 3000.” - FPT INITIATED CHANGE TO GIVE ALL RUNWAY 4R/4L PROCEDURES AT EWR THE SAME RNAV MISSED APPROACH PROCEDURE. FPT CHECKLIST CALLED FOR MANDATORY 2000 MSL CROSSING ALTITUDE AT NEBTE; COORDINATION CONFIRMED INTENT WAS “AT OR BELOW 2000 AT NEBTE”.
- DELETED ALTERNATE MISSED APPROACH - FPT REQUEST, NOT REQUIRED DUE TO ADDITION OF RNAV MISSED APPROACH
MauleSkinner
Touchdown! Greaser!
He noted that you directed the OP to the wrong place on the chart, and provided information regarding the correct place on the chart.
I guess I learned something. There is a distinction between required equipment notes and PBN notes even though they are essentially co-located on the chart.
Edited to add: A little futher digging says if the approach is a conventional approach, there is a required equipment notes box. If the approach is a RNAV approach, it has a PBN notes box. In the OP's example, it's a conventional approach that required PBN equipment. So seems kind of a hybrid situation.
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Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
You see a below restriction from time to time in busy airspace to keep you below other traffic.
Clip4
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Didn’t claim it did, was noting how available alternate missed procedures are now charted and they are always based on a loss of a miss approach based on ground navaid.
MauleSkinner
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kinda the object.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
Yeah. They usually have a Note saying descent to at or below[altitude] may be required when executing an early missed approach.
John Collins
En-Route
The PBN equipment box specifies requirements for any required PBN equipment. At one point this might have read as "GPS required" or later as "RNAV 1 - GPS required". This is because the path followed on the missed approach required use of a GPS and the path was RNAV 1. Unfortunately not all GPS that are IFR approach capable meet the RNAV 1 PBN specification requirements, example KLN90B, KLN94, GNC300XL, and others. However, there is a PBN specification that is used to define what we would have in the past called a GPS approach. The PBN specification is named "RNP APCH" and includes provisions for using RNAV 1 segments as part of the approach procedure, so since all the GPS systems including those I mentioned, comply with "RNP APCH", using this specification in the PBN box, effectively allows any GPS that is certified for IFR to be used to satisfy the equipment requirement. "RNP APCH" is simply the name of the PBN specification used to define a GPS system that is capable of flying a GPS approach. In this instance, it is only needed for the missed approach segment, sometimes the same specification can be used for the initial segment to join the conventional approach procedure. As VOR get discontinued, you will see more and more dependence on hybrid procedures, using RNP APCH to join the procedure, determine an ATD, or to execute the MAP. Pretty much all RNAV (GPS) approach procedures will also have "RNP APCH - GPS" specified in the PBN equipment box.
ICAO has changed the names of what we termed GPS approach and now as a RNAV (GPS) approach to use the terminology RNP. US decided not to change their approach names for the second time to RNP, but did agree to add the PBN equipment box and specify "RNP APCH" as the requirement. We in the US have been using these GPS approaches since the mid 1990's, like 30 years or so, whereas for the rest of the world, they are just getting into using them, so as the new kids on the block, they could not adopt our naming conventions and made their own. When they came up with these changes there were very few procedures that they had to update, while in the US we had thousands and thousands of them already published. They call GNSS rather than GPS because in theory there are all sorts of GNSS systems deployed, but for all practical purposes only one is being used for navigation, the US military GPS system. There are other SBAS systems in use that are compatible with WAAS, but they rely on the US GPS system.
luvflyin
Touchdown! Greaser!
Those locations are missed approaches based on ground navaids. In some cases, it even uses the same intersection, but defined differently.
Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
Which Navaids are not ground based? Even most RNAV has a ground component.
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It may not be 100% pure technically correct, but I think most generically consider VOR, Localizer, NDB and other traditional systems as "ground-based" as opposed to sattelite systems, even if enhanced by a ground component.
If my use that term in that way confuses you, I apologize.
Clip4
Touchdown! Greaser!
No, but most people, including the FAA, define NAVAIDS as physical devices on the ground that aircraft can detect and fly to. What I posted was a cut and paste from a FAA source that seemed to confuse you.
“Some locations have a preplanned alternate
missed approach procedure for use in the event the
primary NAVAID used for the missed approach
procedure is unavailable.”
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