Hey Jason (HPN)

tonycondon

tonycondon

Gastons CRO (Chief Dinner Reservation Officer)
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Tony
what a crummy week of weather. have a happy birthday tomorrow anyway.
 
Thanks, Tony. Doesn't look like I'll get my ticket on my 17th, but at least I'll get the oral done! I'm scheduled to do the oral at 9am tomorrow and fly Wednesday at 11am. We'll just have to see what happens...
 
Well I just passed the oral despite a few 'fuel injected engine' questions I didn't know and temporarily forgetting the demensions of class G airspace. Now I just have to get out there and fly tomorrow -- the easiest part.

Here's the question I wasn't quite sure of: "What icing condition affects aircraft powered by fuel injected engines?"
 
induction system icing?

looks like tomorrow should be flyable? maybe even this afternoon...
 
HPNPilot1200 said:
Well I just passed the oral despite a few 'fuel injected engine' questions I didn't know and temporarily forgetting the demensions of class G airspace. Now I just have to get out there and fly tomorrow -- the easiest part.

Here's the question I wasn't quite sure of: "What icing condition affects aircraft powered by fuel injected engines?"
Click to expand...

Do good, Jason, and have a happy!
 
Thanks guys. Weather was below minimums today, so there was no chance of going at all. Rescheduled for early Sunday morning, we'll see how that works out.
 
bkreager said:
Airframe icing!

Happy Birthday Jason! Hope the flying goes smoothly.
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speaking of that i got about 1/4 inch of rime on my car on the drive home through snow yesterday. no detrimental performance was noted, however.
 
tonycondon said:
speaking of that i got about 1/4 inch of rime on my car on the drive home through snow yesterday. no detrimental performance was noted, however.
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Yea, I was driving back to Adel from Ottumwa and had about the same results...started fishtailing on a bridge or two on Hwy 5 near DSM :dunno:
 
tonycondon said:
induction system icing?
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Most likely. It's common for people to not understand this because most fuel injected airplanes deal with it automatically like the Cessna 172R/SP or the Beech Sierra I flew. The DA-20 has a manual alternate air lever by the throttle that must be thrown if you encounter ice. My understanding is that it's more or less an air-filter bypass.
 
Jesse, what aircraft is in your avatar? The winglets caught my eye after reading Kate's article about stall control characteristics.
 
KennyFlys said:
Jesse, what aircraft is in your avatar? The winglets caught my eye after reading Kate's article about stall control characteristics.
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2004 Diamond DA-20-C1

It stalls somewhere in between a C172 and a C150 as far as aggressiveness.

Video of me spinning it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHEQOXgA9WU

Now before someone jumps on me about recovering early...It is a very clean airplane and builds speed fast when it's pointed down. The best I could ever get was about a turn in and half before it was time to call it quits. Perhaps it'd do better with a different CG.

Here is a video of me spinning a C-150. They will stay in a spin much easier.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXinAgokQmw
 
jesse said:
2004 Diamond DA-20-C1

It stalls somewhere in between a C172 and a C150 as far as aggressiveness.

Now before someone jumps on me about recovering early...It is a very clean airplane and builds speed fast when it's pointed down. The best I could ever get was about a turn in and half before it was time to call it quits. Perhaps it'd do better with a different CG.
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Does Diamond have any words on recommended recovery?

By different CG, I assume you mean further aft. I'm guessing that's not even an option unless you threw a sandbag or two behind the seat. Even then, what about recovery? Are there CG limits for performing spins?

This is the reason I'm finding interest in having manuals for other aircraft, even if I don't fly them.
 
KennyFlys said:
Does Diamond have any words on recommended recovery?
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POH Cautions:
Intentional spinning is only permitted with flaps in CRUISE position.

Depending on CG and spin entry technique, attempts to enter spins may develop into spiral dives.

Monitor the airspeed during the first turn and recover immediately if it increases to 65 KIAS.

Spins with aft CG may oscillate in yaw rate and pitch attitude.
This has no effect on recovery procedure or recovery time
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POH Spin Entry:
(a) Spin Entry
1. Loose Items stowed
2. Seat Belts fastened
3. Altitude and Airspace check
4. Fuel Pump ON
5. Wing Flaps CRUISE
6. Mixture FULL RICH
7. Throttle IDLE
8. Entry Speed trim to 58 KIAS
9. Reduce speed with elevator speed reduction rate 2-3 kts per second
10. When stall warning sounds apply simultaneously, full aft stick and full rudder
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POH Spin Recovery:
1. Throttle IDLE
2. Rudder fully applied in opposite to direction of spin
3. Control Stick ease stick forward until spinning stops
4. Rudder neutral, immediately after rotation has stopped.
5. Wing Flaps check CRUISE
6. Control Stick ease stick backward cautiously
Bring airplane from descent into level flight position.
Do not exceed maximum permissible speed (vNE)
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KennyFlys said:
By different CG, I assume you mean further aft. I'm guessing that's not even an option unless you threw a sandbag or two behind the seat. Even then, what about recovery? Are there CG limits for performing spins?
Click to expand...

Well. Too far aft is not a good thing. It tends to flatten the spin. I'm no aeronautical engineer, nor am I a test pilot with a team of engineers advising me. So I do what the POH says and nothing more. As soon as that airspeed hit 65 knots I would recover as per the POH. If you mess around with this you'll find yourself blowing past Vne scary fast. My first attempts were with a pretty relaxed recovery and resulted in a rapid gain of airspeed (never past vne). I later discovered it's better to be more aggressive and keep the airspeed manageable.

The DA-20 makes it pretty simple. You are either in utility category approved for spins or you aren't flying the airplane. If you are within weight and balance you can spin it. There is no option to be in normal category until certain conditions like other airplanes.

KennyFlys said:
This is the reason I'm finding interest in having manuals for other aircraft, even if I don't fly them.
Click to expand...

Diamond puts all their POH's on their website.
http://diamondaircraft.com/owners_world/

If you have an interest in learning more about spins I *REALLY* would recommend you read "Stalls, Spins, and Safety" by Sammy Mason.
 
jesse said:
If you have an interest in learning more about spins I *REALLY* would recommend you read "Stalls, Spins, and Safety" by Sammy Mason.
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Jesse, do you have a copy to loan?
 
Jesse,

Thanks for the recommendation. I printed that post to add to my reference material for books to get my hands on. I have "Facts About Spins" by DeLacerda.
 
I've spun the DA20 a couple of times. It's very resistant, you literally have to KICK it over. It wants to spiral dive rather than spin, but you can get it to spin.
 
bbchien said:
I've spun the DA20 a couple of times. It's very resistant, you literally have to KICK it over. It wants to spiral dive rather than spin, but you can get it to spin.
Click to expand...

How many rotations did you remain in the spin for? I could usually get a clean entry but after about 1.5 turns it was game over.
 
The Super D is somewhat resistant to spins to the left. For my last few before sign-off, Jimmy threw it into spins "while my attention was diverted" then I had to recover. Some, I started and had to really force the rudder an extended time for a left spin. The last one, he sent to the left and would call "Your airplane." I never heard him. We were well into the fourth spin and I was wondering when he was giving me control. "It's yours!" "Oh... ok."

This was long after him telling me I really didn't want to do three full spins. I brought it up because I'd read the average pilot who gets into an unintentional spin has made at least three turns before they begin to react. So, I got a nice taste! :)
 
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