Garmin will continue to support GNS-4XX/5XX for years to come

While this is an important issue, it begs the question - how long before they make the same statement about legacy G1000's? These systems are 20 years old and it's not a $10K decision like a 430W, it's more like $150K. That will be a painful day. As a long-time semiconductor executive, I echo the earlier comment about the responsibility of a manufacturer of a long-lifecycle product to stockpile spares for extended maintenance. Garmin is playing in the same arena as other manufacturers of military-aerospace systems that require ongoing maintenance for 30 years or more. You don't ground A10 Warthogs due to lack of a few spare parts.
 
Correct me if I’m wrong - but some planes require the G1000 to remain certified. You can’t replace it with modern version of the G3, etc.
 
WDD said:
Correct me if I’m wrong - but some planes require the G1000 to remain certified. You can’t replace it with modern version of the G3, etc.
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Just like other airplanes were only certified with siamese mag engines. The provisions for retrofit into engines with non-siamese mag eventually pop up, and it cost an arm and a leg to not become a paperweight. The same will probably be true eventually for G1000 certified fac built, though perhaps at a much lower expense than that of a non-siamese mag engine.

Either way, cost potato is the symptom, the certification rules are the root cause.
 
WDD said:
Correct me if I’m wrong - but some planes require the G1000 to remain certified. You can’t replace it with modern version of the G3, etc.
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Most, but not all of the G1000 systems were STCd into an airframe so they should be able to be replaced. The ones that were TCd in will likely still be able to be replaced but it may take more work to get it approved.

There are already some aircraft receiving G1000 upgrades.
 
Can you get rid of the G1000 and get a less expensive option?

For example, you buy a Cirrus with an ancient non wass g1000. Can you replace it with a G500, G 3x, or even a few 275’s?
 
WDD said:
Can you get rid of the G1000 and get a less expensive option?

For example, you buy a Cirrus with an ancient non wass g1000. Can you replace it with a G500, G 3x, or even a few 275’s?
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I would think so, If there’s approvals for the equipment to be installed. My friend who runs an avionics shop feels the same way. Cirri aren’t my thing, so without some research I can’t say with absolute confidence however.
 
mondtster said:
The ones that were TCd in will likely still be able to be replaced but it may take more work to get it approved.
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While this comes from the helicopter side, its my understanding before several helicopter OEMs elected to integrate the G1000H platform on the production line 10 years ago, there were agreements made the G1000 series was to be supported differently than other Garmin lines due to this level of integration. So there is an understanding in this side of the industry the G1000 line will remain supported for decades as it would be suicide for any helicopter OEM to allow a finite timeframe on their products. How that applies to the small fixed-wing side G1000 support I don't know. But with G1000H being the sole cockpit display equipment available on some new helicopters it will be here to stay for a long time.
 
WDD said:
If your other radio is the traditional Nav/Com, then you have one GPS nav source and one radio nav source. Which today actually seems like a great balance. The option would have been a GTN 650 xi - bigger screen and addition of a nav radio - and of course more money. It would have added the Nav radio that you didn't need, if your POV is that you can safely navigate in a GPS outage with only one Nav radio.
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Should have said... a Cessna 152 that I am using to help keep my skills sharp without breaking the bank. The current suite is very strong for old-school IFR (ILS VOR LOC), just need the LPV capability for my home airport that doesn't have an ILS and a pesky marine layer that sneaks in from time to time.

But now you got me thinking as I can always take it with me should I sell the plane.
 
SebIp said:
...And before everyone give them too much credit, isn’t it true the older avionics in some case are still supported because the service manual was available and not for newer stuff by the likes of garmin? And since these gps are not that great outside of data updates you buy from them, supporting all this is good for business. I mean they don’t want too many 440 swaps do they?
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If they're supporting them out of self-interest instead of altruism, I don't care. The only thing I care about as a user is whether support is still available. And if they're doing it out of self-interest, that's probably a more reliable motivation than any supposed altruism.
 
Palmpilot said:
If they're supporting them out of self-interest instead of altruism, I don't care. The only thing I care about as a user is whether support is still available. And if they're doing it out of self-interest, that's probably a more reliable motivation than any supposed altruism.
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Absolutely. Just seems there was some legend making here instead of just business as it really was.
 
David Loftus said:
While this is an important issue, it begs the question - how long before they make the same statement about legacy G1000's? These systems are 20 years old and it's not a $10K decision like a 430W, it's more like $150K. That will be a painful day. As a long-time semiconductor executive, I echo the earlier comment about the responsibility of a manufacturer of a long-lifecycle product to stockpile spares for extended maintenance. Garmin is playing in the same arena as other manufacturers of military-aerospace systems that require ongoing maintenance for 30 years or more. You don't ground A10 Warthogs due to lack of a few spare parts.
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The G1000 support problem is somewhat ameliorated by the fact that the system is modularized into line-replaceable units (LRUs). If one LRU becomes unrepairable, there is the possibility of designing a compatible replacement, which would eliminated the need to replace the whole system.
 
Garmin has such a way with cultivating warm feelings amongst the user base...... ;)
 
WDD said:
Got to love the $500 charge for taking the GNS apart and telling you they can’t fix it.
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Take it someplace else…oh wait, you can’t.

I’m okay with Garmin dropping support IF they allow others to take up the slack, they should publish the schematics and part numbers.
 
Right to repair? I guess I can see that.

But for replacement parts that needs to be certified by the FAA, I don’t see that as having enough volume to make it work for anyone.
 
WDD said:
Right to repair? I guess I can see that.

But for replacement parts that needs to be certified by the FAA, I don’t see that as having enough volume to make it work for anyone.
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I believe electronic parts don’t need FAA certification, there’s an existing standard for electronic components and if they meet standards and functionality they can be replaced.
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
I believe electronic parts don’t need FAA certification, there’s an existing standard for electronic components and if they meet standards and functionality they can be replaced.
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those are considered common parts.....
 
WDD said:
But for replacement parts that needs to be certified by the FAA, I don’t see that as having enough volume to make it work for anyone.
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There have got to be many many GNS430W/530W units out there, and that most of us still feel quite useful. I think that some enterprising company could make repairs a go, if Garmin would allow them to. A suitable replacement display may or may not be insurmountable, but in my mind, if Garmin was playing this out, they might be losing the business altogether to the IFD440/540 replacements. Maybe they don’t care and only want to sell their new units, but this maybe the last straw for many of us regarding buying Garmin again.
 
REPEAT BUYERS - will upgrade to the GTN (either eagerly or grudgingly)
NEW BUYERS - New to airplanes / buying Garmin for first time
SWITCHERS - Replacing ACME with GARMIN
LOST - People who will just walk away from Garmin because the GNS 430 broke

My guess is that Repeat+New+Switchers outweighs "Lost" by quite a bit.

Also, think of the ROI of keeping GNS service capability. Money spent on a shrinking, non growth business vs the return for adding a new feature to the GTN. Think of adding new features to a vacuum tube vs shifting business to transistors, then to chips, etc.
 
I've always wondered what the technical justification for not making the new Garmin units plug compatible with the old? Obviously Avidyne managed. I realize the 530 doesn't have a form compatible replacement but the 430 does.

I can imagine many marketing, perhaps borderline nefarious reasons. But I still guess it started with something from an engineering perspective.
 
Perhaps engineering. Maybe similar to moving from a parallel cable to UCB C, etc. Maybe the old connections don’t have enough what not.
 
jsstevens said:
I've always wondered what the technical justification for not making the new Garmin units plug compatible with the old? Obviously Avidyne managed. I realize the 530 doesn't have a form compatible replacement but the 430 does.

I can imagine many marketing, perhaps borderline nefarious reasons. But I still guess it started with something from an engineering perspective.
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WDD said:
Perhaps engineering. Maybe similar to moving from a parallel cable to UCB C, etc. Maybe the old connections don’t have enough what not.
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This interview with the UI engineer for the GNS430 and now executive VP of Garmin aviation products confirms @WDD 's suspicions. They claim that they couldn't get stuff like HSDB (Ethernet) on the old connector.
MajorTurbulence said:
A suitable replacement display may or may not be insurmountable
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According to the video, they actually did retool for a replacement 530 display a few years after the 530 was off the market. The 530 uses a QVGA screen, so apparently there's vendors out there that were willing to take that on but not the weird resolution of the 430.
 
Last edited:
What the OP posted was from a few years ago.

The March 2023 is more recent.

Garmin has never said that they will stop supporting them, just that certain parts will run out and there will not be able to repair some units.
 
Palmpilot said:
The G1000 support problem is somewhat ameliorated by the fact that the system is modularized into line-replaceable units (LRUs). If one LRU becomes unrepairable, there is the possibility of designing a compatible replacement, which would eliminated the need to replace the whole system.
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THIS ^^^^^ is a HUGE point.

Also, it seems that 10.6" displays are very standard across the entire spectrum of electronic products. Not so much with the 430/530 displays.
 
Pinecone said:
Also, it seems that 10.6" displays are very standard across the entire spectrum of electronic products. Not so much with the 430/530 displays.
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The G1000 is XVGA standard resolution. The 530 is QVGA standard resolution. The 430 is weird. Garmin did manage to find a second supplier for the 530 display after the 530 was out of production. See post #68.
Pinecone said:
Latest, screen repairs are no longer available from Garmin.

www.avweb.com

Garmin's GNS 430/530 Sunset Takes Another Step

Garmin advises that support for its iconic navigator series has taken a significant step back.
www.avweb.com www.avweb.com
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See post #53.
 
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