Full Time Safety Pilot Arrangements

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UTLonghorn_1979

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UTLonghorn_1979
Hi,

I'm currently going through a medical deferral, which I expect to end up with a SI after all the hoops are jumped through, but was wondering, worst case scenario, what an annual cost would be to have an on call full time right seat/safety pilot flying with me. I'm thinking of flying in a twin like a Piper Aerostar, or maybe a turbine TBM/Daher 700/850 or Piper M600.

Would likely be around 50 hours per year.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!
 
You need someone qualified to act as PIC and then convince them to let you sit in the left seat or you’ll be in the right.

if you can swing the OpEx of any of the stated aircraft, you’ll have no trouble paying for someone qualified and acceptable to your insurer to do what you’re asking.

Expect $500-$1000/day.
 
TCABM said:
You need someone qualified to act as PIC and then convince them to let you sit in the left seat or you’ll be in the right.

if you can swing the OpEx of any of the stated aircraft, you’ll have no trouble paying for someone qualified and acceptable to your insurer to do what you’re asking.

Expect $500-$1000/day.
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Super helpful, thank you! Any idea if there are forums or "want ads" for pilots providing such services in the DFW, TX area? I'm sure I can Google something, but any additional guidance is appreciated!
 
UTLonghorn_1979 said:
Super helpful, thank you! Any idea if there are forums or "want ads" for pilots providing such services in the DFW, TX area? I'm sure I can Google something, but any additional guidance is appreciated!
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Type owner groups. But for your use case of 50hrs/year, it’ll probably be easier just to pick a place off this page that will rent you a plane and CFI. Unless you already hold a PPL w/multi and instrument rating.

cirrusaircraft.com

Flight Training from the Experts in the Dallas Metroplex

At Cirrus Aircraft, we believe that the best pilots never stop training. And whether you’re starting your pilot journey for the first time or jumping back into the pilot’s seat […]
cirrusaircraft.com
 
TCABM said:
Type owner groups. But for your use case of 50hrs/year, it’ll probably be easier just to pick a place off this page that will rent you a plane and CFI. Unless you already hold a PPL w/multi and instrument rating.

cirrusaircraft.com

Flight Training from the Experts in the Dallas Metroplex

At Cirrus Aircraft, we believe that the best pilots never stop training. And whether you’re starting your pilot journey for the first time or jumping back into the pilot’s seat […]
cirrusaircraft.com
Click to expand...
I’ve got my PPL with complex, HP and tailwheel endorsements. Need to get checked out in either the twin or turbine.

Goal would be to at least build up hours with the safety pilot then fly myself once out of the FAA crosshairs, or just keep safety pilot working with me. I’d probably do that anyways until I get my IFR rating…that’s on hold too without the medical after taking written 05/2023 with a 97 grade.

Thanks!
 
He can still log the time if he is rated and sole manipulator of the controls. Of course, that means that the safety pilot cannot log the time unless they are an instructor giving instruction of the pilot flying is under the hood.

You will be paying a LOT for an on call, immediate response pilot for only flying 50 hours per year.
 
It's not proper to call this guy the "safety pilot." The only place safety pilots occur in the regs is for simulated instruemnt flights. What this guy is called is simply "the pilot in command." Frankly, if UT wants to do this, he'd be well advised to have an instructor in the right seat and not just someone that is marginally qualified to fly the aircraft alone.
 
flyingron said:
It's not proper to call this guy the "safety pilot." The only place safety pilots occur in the regs is for simulated instruemnt flights. What this guy is called is simply "the pilot in command." Frankly, if UT wants to do this, he'd be well advised to have an instructor in the right seat and not just someone that is marginally qualified to fly the aircraft alone.
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What I’m looking for is someone that is checked out in the aircraft, can instruct in it including IFR (actual or simulated) and that would essentially be employed by me, whether part time or full time but where I can build hours too. Can’t imagine it would be drop of a hat need. I might also split with another pilot wanting to do the same just for safety. He’s not in any medical issuance situation, just likes to have a second person present.

I’d probably be willing to just put them on a $25K retainer that’s debited per diem.
 
It's not "safety." You are not qualified. You're paying this man to be the pilot in command and accept the ultimate authority for the flight. If he can give you some legal flight instructions, all the better.
 
flyingron said:
It's not "safety." You are not qualified. You're paying this man to be the pilot in command and accept the ultimate authority for the flight. If he can give you some legal flight instructions, all the better.
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Can I log that as PIC if in control of manipulating the controls solely, or dual only? Once I get checked out in the aircraft, then I can log as PIC, correct?

Thanks!
 
UTLonghorn_1979 said:
Hi,

I'm currently going through a medical deferral, which I expect to end up with a SI after all the hoops are jumped through, but was wondering, worst case scenario, what an annual cost would be to have an on call full time right seat/safety pilot flying with me. I'm thinking of flying in a twin like a Piper Aerostar, or maybe a turbine TBM/Daher 700/850 or Piper M600.

Would likely be around 50 hours per year.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
Let me guess, you aren’t multi rated and have zero turbine time?
 
I would pay good money to be a fly on the wall during that call into the insurance brokers.
Hopping into a TBM with those credentials seems... unlikely... to me.
 
Clip4 said:
Let me guess, you aren’t multi rated and have zero turbine time?
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Correct, but you don't have time until you have time in type. Maybe the turbine is ambitious? I have 400 hours with my complex, HP and tail wheel endorsements. Most of my experience is in a Cirrus SR-22T. Seems at least twin piston is a logical next step for rating, right?
 
ArrowFlyer86 said:
I would pay good money to be a fly on the wall during that call into the insurance brokers.
Hopping into a TBM with those credentials seems... unlikely... to me.
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Pipedreamy? I concur. And they wouldn't give two licks about that tail wheel endorsement.

And buying a tbm or aerostar and fly it 50 hours a year???
 
You keep using the word "full time". Is that really what you mean? Because to me, that means you are paying that person an annual salary whether they're flying or not. Maybe they're doing other things for your business as well. But that way they would always be available to fly you. However, few pilots are going to want a full time flying job that only flies 50 hours a year. And you're going to pay a lot per year for those 50 hours.

If you're looking for a contract pilot, that's a day rate proposition. Figure on the $1000 range per day for that. But then you don't have exclusive use of that pilot - if they have another trip scheduled when you want to go, you're out of luck - you don't want the type of pilot that will drop another trip because yours is a better offer, since they could just as easily do that to you too.
 
UTLonghorn_1979 said:
Can I log that as PIC if in control of manipulating the controls solely, or dual only? Once I get checked out in the aircraft, then I can log as PIC, correct?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
There's no FAA concept of being "checked out."

Yes, you can log PIC time if you are rated in the aircraft (which just means airplane and single-engine land in this case).

However, until you are qualified to be PIC: properly endorsed for HP/Complex/High ALtitude, current (flight review and if necessary passenger carrying), and possess a medical, you are entirely SPURIOUS with regard to the responsibility for the flight. It is 100% on the pilot in command both in a regulatory and a legal liability sense.
 
RussR said:
You keep using the word "full time". Is that really what you mean? Because to me, that means you are paying that person an annual salary whether they're flying or not. Maybe they're doing other things for your business as well. But that way they would always be available to fly you. However, few pilots are going to want a full time flying job that only flies 50 hours a year. And you're going to pay a lot per year for those 50 hours.

If you're looking for a contract pilot, that's a day rate proposition. Figure on the $1000 range per day for that. But then you don't have exclusive use of that pilot - if they have another trip scheduled when you want to go, you're out of luck - you don't want the type of pilot that will drop another trip because yours is a better offer, since they could just as easily do that to you too.
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You probably also need to find someone who's at a point in his career where he doesn't care about hours. Because he's going to be spending a lot of time sitting in the right seat not logging anything.

This really seems like a job for an instructor.

I mean, not a lot, because 50 hours a year is not a lot. But literally any other job would take priority.
 
flyingron said:
There's no FAA concept of being "checked out."

Yes, you can log PIC time if you are rated in the aircraft (which just means airplane and single-engine land in this case).

However, until you are qualified to be PIC: properly endorsed for HP/Complex/High ALtitude, current (flight review and if necessary passenger carrying), and possess a medical, you are entirely SPURIOUS with regard to the responsibility for the flight. It is 100% on the pilot in command both in a regulatory and a legal liability sense.
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Got it, thank you!
 
Lindberg said:
You probably also need to find someone who's at a point in his career where he doesn't care about hours. Because he's going to be spending a lot of time sitting in the right seat not logging anything.

This really seems like a job for an instructor.

I mean, not a lot, because 50 hours a year is not a lot. But literally any other job would take priority.
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I appreciate the feedback! I'll see if I can find an instructor that's willing to do that. It's kind of a hybrid role of sorts, I guess. I'm looking to be able to log PIC hours, be legally flying the aircraft with someone well versed in said aircraft, and be able/willing to fly with me to various destinations throughout the year, but not on a pure hourly rate like the flight schools.

Thanks all!
 
UTLonghorn_1979 said:
Can I log that as PIC if in control of manipulating the controls solely, or dual only? Once I get checked out in the aircraft, then I can log as PIC, correct?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

If you are properly rated you can log PIC as well as dual. They are not mutually exclusive.
 
Because so few people understand it.
 
Once again, being pilot in command is neither a necessary nor sufficient condition to log PIC.
 
EdFred said:
If only there was a sticky/flowchart/or semi-interactive website on this topic somewhere.
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Not sure if that was directed at me, the OP, sorry if this has been a common and beat to death subject. New to the forum.
 
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