Fueling Practices

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Bob Kutzler

Filing Flight Plan
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Dec 23, 2006
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Phillipsburg, NJ
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flyingbk
As a general rule, do you top off your tanks after every flight? Do you check prices at your destination airports and try to buy where the prices are better? Considering maybe your most recent flight was only an hour, and it leaves one tank at tabs, do you top it off or wait until the next flight?
Currently our practice is to top off regardless, and was wondering what other have experienced. Our planes fly almost daily, so they would not sit for any length of time with partial tanks.
Thanks
 
Unless I know that I will need the payload soon I always top off. We have a wide daily temperature range in my neck of the woods and the potential for sweating in a half filled tank is real.
 
Everybody is going to have different answers depending on location an mission. If you are an owner you have a choice. Renters generally don't, which is a mixed bag. You can walk to the plane and fly away knowing that you have full fuel with out calling a truck. It's problematic if you want to load 4 people into a 172. (And be legal.) But it makes it simpler for the rental companies. And they don't really have to worry about a student running out of fuel on a 75 nm trip.

I tend to always fly with full tanks. I'm usually by myself and taking long trips. 300nm+. My company on the other hand fuels just before the flight. The tendency is to have full tanks. (Fuel stops are less frequent up here in AK.) But, depending on payload required fuel is downloaded as needed. We also fuel out of drums too at times, but that's another story.

Price is generally the last on my list of things to consider. I mean sure if you can buy it for $5/gal vs $8+ yeah that makes a difference. And those are realistic numbers up here. But sometimes, maybe most times, the choice is to fly or not.

Even when I fly back in that part of the world. I've quit getting crazy concerned about the price of fuel. Sure, if I can fill up at a cheaper place then I do it. Sometimes though, it's cheaper to buy the expensive fuel in Chicago or some other big city than pay the fees. I will plan trips if I am renting dry to land at place with cheaper fuel if it's only a fuel stop.

I won't drive my car across town to save 3 cents/gal. 50 cents however....
 
On a related note, what would the procedure entail if you decided that you needed to offload fuel in order to get within W&B?

I realize the answer will probably depend on a lot of variables, but what are some of them? If I land and tie down at an FBO and ask them to fill it up, and then come back in a day and DA has gone up to the point where I can't take off fully loaded, what happens? :dunno:
 
Rigged4Flight said:
On a related note, what would the procedure entail if you decided that you needed to offload fuel in order to get within W&B?

I realize the answer will probably depend on a lot of variables, but what are some of them? If I land and tie down at an FBO and ask them to fill it up, and then come back in a day and DA has gone up to the point where I can't take off fully loaded, what happens? :dunno:
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Off load fuel. ;)
 
I keep the tanks full... Mostly because when I am in the mood to fly I don't want to have to spend the time it takes to tug the plane over to the pumps, then take the tug back, etc... It just seems easier to stop at the tanks when I taxi past after a flight... I'm just lazy I guess.. The secondary benefit is bladder tanks will go forever if kept full... Fat Albert was built in October 1956 and the original bladders are still tight and dry...
 
Threefingeredjack said:
Unless I know that I will need the payload soon I always top off. We have a wide daily temperature range in my neck of the woods and the potential for sweating in a half filled tank is real.
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Wide temp fluxuations is even more reason not to top off as expansion and contraction of the fuel will create an ullage space regardless. Any ullage space will form the same amount of condensation in your tank. If condensation is your concern, better to put a desiccant sleave over the vent.
 
Rigged4Flight said:
Thanks :rofl:

But exactly how? Do most FBOs have a barrel handy for this? If so, do they ever reuse it? :dunno:
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No they don't. And if they did, I don't think it is legal for them to reuse the fuel in airplanes. Maybe surface vehicles.

But the REAL answer is to not top off after every flight. One sort of restricts the usefulness of the airplane that way.
 
Rigged4Flight said:
Thanks :rofl:

But exactly how? Do most FBOs have a barrel handy for this? If so, do they ever reuse it? :dunno:
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Hold up a sign that says; "Free Aviation Fuel". You will have plenty of help. :lol:

There are many ways. Before you need to fly heavy, fly light and burn the fuel off is the most practical. If not, get a 5 gallon can and a funnel, and remove the quick drain, or get a syphon hose. Give the fuel away or sell it.

Better yet, buy an RV and you never have to worry. All RV's can fly full of people, fuel, and baggage.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
No they don't. And if they did, I don't think it is legal for them to reuse the fuel in airplanes. Maybe surface vehicles.

But the REAL answer is to not top off after every flight. One sort of restricts the usefulness of the airplane that way.
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Or employee owned planes;) I got a lot of free fuel that way...
 
As a general rule, do you top off your tanks after every flight?
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That really depends on the aircraft and the type of operation being flown.

Full tanks do tend to have less moisture buildup and water in the fuel from condensation in the tanks, and in avgas aircraft, it's better for the fuel system (and bladders).

In one of the airplanes I fly, topping the tanks takes about 330,000 lbs of fuel, so we generally don't put fuel in the airplane until we know what the payload and the flight assignment will be. Carrying extra fuel means burning extra fuel to carry the extra fuel; generally any extra fuel carried costs an additional 4-5% fuel burn (which can be significant when dealing with large fuel numbers.

I'm flying a different kind of airplane presently, and I fill the tanks every time I stop. The operator for whom I'm flying has a policy that the aircraft won't be flown below 1/2 tanks, and any time someone reaches 1/4 tanks, a written report and explanation is required. I don't disagree with that policy: it's hard to run out of fuel if one doesn't burn off the bottom half of the tanks.

On many light airplanes, of course, if one runs with full fuel all the time, one won't have much available payload, or performance.
 
The only time I top off at my home field is when I am planning a very long flight which must be non-stop (or if I am flying a fairly lengthy IMC flight and require lots of fuel for diversion options, but that's hypothetical and I really don't do that any more). Gas is $7.74/gallon ("guaranteed" ;-)) at my home field, so buying elsewhere is a good call.

Plane holds 74 usable, so with my typical 1.5 to 2 hour mission, I have a lot of flexibility as to when and where I buy gas. And, as others have noted, having tanks down a little really improves your load flexibility, and performance (especially in this summer heat).

Edit

I plan to always land with an hour fuel remaining (VFR), or IFR reserves plus a cushion (IFR). Rarely creates any issues for me, as the plane can almost always fly further with the gas on board than I am comfortable sitting.
 
When I owned my own plane outright I didn't but with the current plane, the other guy and I have agreed to top the tanks off after each flight.
 
Geico266 said:
Hold up a sign that says; "Free Aviation Fuel". You will have plenty of help. :lol:

There are many ways. Before you need to fly heavy, fly light and burn the fuel off is the most practical. If not, get a 5 gallon can and a funnel, and remove the quick drain, or get a syphon hose. Give the fuel away or sell it.

Better yet, buy an RV and you never have to worry. All RV's can fly full of people, fuel, and baggage.
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Ya know, your constant preaching of the RV gospel is actually starting to grow on me. You caused me to spend a very long time looking at RV ads on barnstormers and trade-a-plane and google. I hope you are proud of yourself. I will never get those two hours back. :mad:
 
I almost never top off after a flight in either plane. Both are hangared, the 421 has only been topped off once and that was the day I picked it up and we found out the nacelle tank leaked, so technically it wasn't topped off then. ;) Very few if any twin pilots top off, especially before the mission is known. I leave the 182 with whatever fuel we land with until we are ready to go again, even with a good useful load it's possible to get it over gross with full fuel and 3 people, we aren't from a small tribe. :rolleyes:
 
In our specific case, our Club is flying Archers. Typically, most flights taken are only about one hour of flying time. To date, we have always topped the tanks off when returning. But virtually every airport within a 100 mile radius is 50 cents or more a gallon cheaper. So it seems prudent to me, to fuel up at the destination airport, and leave our tanks a few gallons light when returning. With full fuel, you have at least 4-5 hours of flying time. If the mission warrants, call the fuel truck and top off then. The planes are hangared, and temperature deviations are not as rapid, and most say condensation is an OWT. Due to the fact that the planes fly almost daily, often twice a day, I think there is a possibility of a good savings in fuel costs. But I do appreciate the input from others.
 
Henning said:
Wide temp fluxuations is even more reason not to top off as expansion and contraction of the fuel will create an ullage space regardless. Any ullage space will form the same amount of condensation in your tank. If condensation is your concern, better to put a desiccant sleave over the vent.
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Valid point, but I adhere to the principle that a little condensation mixed into a full tank is safer than condensation from a larger area mixed into less fuel.
 
Threefingeredjack said:
Valid point, but I adhere to the principle that a little condensation mixed into a full tank is safer than condensation from a larger area mixed into less fuel.
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Our first 182 always had "condensation" in the tanks, it was a P model with the original flat fuel caps and stored outside, my current 182 is a Q model with the new style gas caps and is in a hangar every night and I have never had condensation in the tanks. Funny how that works. :dunno:
 
Those flat caps should just be AD'd away.

We usually fuel full in winter, but with our high DA in summer we usually shoot for somewhere between 50-60 gallons on board in the hangar.

It won't help the longevity of our bladders but the long-range tanks in the 182 are a disadvantage around here in the summertime until you know if you're loading up four people to go somewhere.

There's no "tabs"on the bladder tanked system, so we just do the math.

Different amounts of nose gear compression and/or parking on a non-level surface will really throw the numbers around on tanks that long and shallow. We try to stick it sitting in the same spot in the hangar when we're at home.

We all fly it with very conservative fuel reserves. An hour of fuel at landing barely reads on a stick in those big tanks.
 
SCCutler said:
The only time I top off at my home field is when I am planning a very long flight which must be non-stop (or if I am flying a fairly lengthy IMC flight and require lots of fuel for diversion options, but that's hypothetical and I really don't do that any more). Gas is $7.74/gallon ("guaranteed" ;-)) at my home field, so buying elsewhere is a good call.

Plane holds 74 usable, so with my typical 1.5 to 2 hour mission, I have a lot of flexibility as to when and where I buy gas. And, as others have noted, having tanks down a little really improves your load flexibility, and performance (especially in this summer heat).

Edit

I plan to always land with an hour fuel remaining (VFR), or IFR reserves plus a cushion (IFR). Rarely creates any issues for me, as the plane can almost always fly further with the gas on board than I am comfortable sitting.
Click to expand...

Likewise. WHile I *prefer* to land with >1.5 hours left in the tank, I'll take it lower as needed. Having a totalizer makes the math easier. I can save over $1.00/gallon filling up elsewhere than the home field.
 
Having a weight restrictive two seater I try not to top off unless im taking a long cc. I also like to have room to take fuel at the airports i visit. Price is not usually a consideration unless I am topping off.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
No they don't. And if they did, I don't think it is legal for them to reuse the fuel in airplanes. Maybe surface vehicles.

But the REAL answer is to not top off after every flight. One sort of restricts the usefulness of the airplane that way.
Click to expand...


The airline code is the one that doesn't allow the resale of fuel that has been in an aircraft. GA aircraft could, if the person doing the resale wasn't holding to, or being held by a third party to the requirements of the airline code. I don't know the exact reference right now.

The issue is of known fuel quality. How do you know that fuel out of an aircraft hasn't been contaminated in some way? Thus, don't allow that fuel to be resold.

If you were going to do it yourself, I simply recommend to use a good filter. We have one made by Facet that will absorb water as well as particulates. Works on our barrel pumps. We pump out of barrels regularly with complete safety. We have certain procedures of course, but sometimes one needs to fly a barrel somewhere so that fuel will be available at a distant location.

For most of you, that's not an issue. But if you did have a barrel in your hangar with the proper filter system on a pump you could defuel/reuse as needed. The practicality of defueling is another story. Even though I am an A&P and have several tricks I use on various A/C, I still would rather not de fuel. It's just a pain to me. Go fly it off and quit whining about the extra flying you have to do.
 
Threefingeredjack said:
Valid point, but I adhere to the principle that a little condensation mixed into a full tank is safer than condensation from a larger area mixed into less fuel.
Click to expand...

Nice theory but not valid, and actually can be counter intuitive. If you have significant enough ullage space that the top of the tank never comes in contact with the fuel during the xpansion and contraction process, the condensation will typically stay on the surface until it evaporates. If the expansion hits the top then it will displace the condensate, which being heavier will fall to the bottom. Welcome to Tankerman 101...:rolleyes:
 
Geico266 said:
Hold up a sign that says; "Free Aviation Fuel". You will have plenty of help. :lol:

There are many ways. Before you need to fly heavy, fly light and burn the fuel off is the most practical. If not, get a 5 gallon can and a funnel, and remove the quick drain, or get a syphon hose. Give the fuel away or sell it.

Better yet, buy an RV and you never have to worry. All RV's can fly full of people, fuel, and baggage.
Click to expand...

Which sounds great until you realize they don't hold much of any of it :D

I have some 5 gallon jugs I keep at the hangar, Waiting for fuel to drain out isn't something I want to do very often though. I fill "as needed" before a trip if my plane is on the ground, it probably needs fuel.
 
In my personal plane I keep it topped off, also in certain weather I top it off so I dont get any moisture in the tanks.

For work it depends on the loads which always change, after we know the load the plane is hot fueled to match.


As for taking on fuel and removing it, thats easy, here's my old rig for my plane, worked great, I could pump 40gal in or out in 10min. Each keg is15.5 gal. which is a good capacity, not so much you cant lift it by hand, yet enough that I only needed three (with change left over) also made entirely of stainless steel. between the pump and the three kegs think I was into it for under 150 bucks.

image.jpg
 
If I'm under 2/3 fuel, I'm topping off. Maybe not right then if it's been a long day, but first opportunity. My flying habits have a surprisingly large percentage of last-minute trips to locations that defy prediction, so I like to have the plane in the hangar fully fueled ready to go on short notice. I have plenty horsepower, plenty runway, and I'm at a low altitude so breaking ground with a full load isn't a problem. Your mileage may vary.
 
NineThreeKilo said:
In my personal plane I keep it topped off, also in certain weather I top it off so I dont get any moisture in the tanks.

For work it depends on the loads which always change, after we know the load the plane is hot fueled to match.


As for taking on fuel and removing it, thats easy, here's my old rig for my plane, worked great, I could pump 40gal in or out in 10min. Each keg is15.5 gal. which is a good capacity, not so much you cant lift it by hand, yet enough that I only needed three (with change left over) also made entirely of stainless steel. between the pump and the three kegs think I was into it for under 150 bucks.

image.jpg
Click to expand...
Awesome :yesnod:
 
gismo said:
Or worse yet pour a glass for a quick drink from the wrong one.
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:yikes: I still remember years ago, I was maybe 12, we had a 70 Charger on the lot that didn't want to start. Bob had a bottle of Stag beer and a Pepsi bottle of gas on the fender and had me turning the key cranking it over. It gave a quick chuff and he grabbed a bottle and poured it in the carb and it fired up. The bottle was his beer...:rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
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