Food for thought.

Greg Bockelman

Greg Bockelman

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Greg Bockelman
“They came first for the Communists…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a communist. Then they came for the Jews…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for the Unionists…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Unionist. Then they came for the Catholics…but I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me…and by that time there was no one left to speak for me.”

Anyone see an aviation correlation here?
 
I see a definite correlation and it occurs is every arena not just aviation. I am also involved in a similar affair in regard to the publics use of public lands. It is a tactic with a proven track record.

Barb
 
Greg Bockelman said:
“They came first for the Communists…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a communist. Then they came for the Jews…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew. Then they came for the Unionists…but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Unionist. Then they came for the Catholics…but I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me…and by that time there was no one left to speak for me.”

Anyone see an aviation correlation here?
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I definitely see a correlation to one of the world's most well-known logical fallacies there.
 
flyersfan31 said:
The NSDAP and its policies were hardly a logical fallacy. They were all too real for the affected folks.
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Quite true. Fortunately we're not discussing anything that even remotely resembles that in any way, shape, or form.
 
Really? Tell that to the attorney who uses a Pilatus PC-12 to move himself, staff and clients around the countryside. Seeing how a PC-12 is also frequently used as a charter aircraft, that attorney will soon be affected though he isn't using it for charter.

"Since it has to be monitored for charter use, it's only reasonable to force monitoring of the same aircraft for private use."

That logic is out there and more common than most realize.
 
The fallacy is that after the TSA guts general aviation in this country, which is what will happen in the absence of Dr. Manhattan appearing and blasting them all to little puddles of red goo (just saw Watchmen. Either they digitally enhanced Billy Crudup's personal recreational equipment, or Mrs. Crudup is one happy woman) no one will notice. Not one American who isn't a pilot will so much as notice the lack of our little puddlejumpers in the air. The TSA won't do diddly to trucks, vans, and anything else unless they can find another small politically unconnected minority on whom to plant their outsized bootprints.
 
That's the part I find so interesting. What vehicle was that which was used in the 1993 World Trade Center attack? And, for those who have rented one in the last few years even since 9/11, how much documentation was required to show who you were?

I can tell you those "undocumented" vehicles make it into underground building docks a LOT more often than anyone realizes. Sometimes, they sit there, locked and unattended while the driver is supposedly off making deliveries in the building.

As for who cares, a lot of folks will care once word begins to get around about how restrictive life has become who depended heavily on GA. How much do you think it will cripple Mercy Flight and Angel Flight? More than anyone realizes.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
AND the Federal Building in Oklahoma City. Anyone remember Timothy McVey?
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But, but, but... he was a "domestic terrorist" and pro-militia as well as anti-government.

Come to think of it, I'm anti-government. At least in its current form and reach into the private citizenry.
 
steingar said:
The fallacy is that after the TSA guts general aviation in this country, which is what will happen in the absence of Dr. Manhattan appearing and blasting them all to little puddles of red goo (just saw Watchmen. Either they digitally enhanced Billy Crudup's personal recreational equipment, or Mrs. Crudup is one happy woman) no one will notice. Not one American who isn't a pilot will so much as notice the lack of our little puddlejumpers in the air. The TSA won't do diddly to trucks, vans, and anything else unless they can find another small politically unconnected minority on whom to plant their outsized bootprints.
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They won't notice it now. They may notice it in a few years, after the pool of pilots to feed the JIT manufacturing, their favorite airline, etc. dries up.
 
steingar said:
The fallacy is that after the TSA guts general aviation in this country, which is what will happen in the absence of Dr. Manhattan appearing and blasting them all to little puddles of red goo (just saw Watchmen. Either they digitally enhanced Billy Crudup's personal recreational equipment, or Mrs. Crudup is one happy woman) no one will notice. Not one American who isn't a pilot will so much as notice the lack of our little puddlejumpers in the air. The TSA won't do diddly to trucks, vans, and anything else unless they can find another small politically unconnected minority on whom to plant their outsized bootprints.
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Yeah. (resigned sigh) Good point. :frown3:
 
They won't notice period. Angle and mercy and doggie and all the other nice charity flights we do are insufficiently numerous, and benefit those to socioeconomically disadvantaged to have any political clout. The airlines will find a source of pilots if they have to do their training in house. There will be a profound economic impact as the billions of dollars of economic activity we generate goes away, with lots of lost jobs as a result. But the TSA doesn't seem to care about any of that, and no one seems to care about the TSA. No one but us.
 
steingar said:
But the TSA doesn't seem to care about any of that, and no one seems to care about the TSA. No one but us.
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That was sort of my point. But we need to start paying attention to what is happening to and in the world around us. That too, was sort of my point.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
That was sort of my point. But we need to start paying attention to what is happening to and in the world around us. That too, was sort of my point.
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Amen, Brother. I am a lawyer and just went to a seminar yesterday- part of the seminar was a review of recent case law. With only one exception, all the recent cases reviewed demonstrated a degredation of our fourth amendment rights, government reaching into private life and imposition of new manners of government surveillance.

This county is headed down a nasty, scary, un-American path. If we all don't pay attention we are going to end up in a terrible place- we're already on our way there. More and more often I consider throwing in the towel- I become less sure this is my America every day.
 
Agreed Greg, but from what I can see pilots are paying attention. I myself feel utterly helpless. The last time I went to bat for GA tens and thousands of others did so as well. It did no good whatsoever.

I actually worry more about our 4th amendment rights than my quickly vanishing ability to fly. Such power could be used for great evil, and there have been an are politicians in our recent history who would gladly use their abilities to promote their own agendas and careers.
 
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