FF routing SNAFU?

[Jon Weiswasser]

Has Foreflight expected routing ever led you astray? Do any of you ever just file direct? In my experience, I’ve received clearances into the flight levels based on victor airways, so I’m not sure what I missed here. In this Ep of LIFL, I got a bad clearance after having filed the expected routing from FF based on an altitude of FL280.

 

[benyflyguy]

I’ve had FF give me some routes that were heavily amended on the ground as well as on is in the air. The class B closest to me is 100 miles away. But the airways the big NY 3 use are right on top of our heads so you get a lot of rerouting pending on where you are going in relationship to them. I don’t get to the FL though. My buddy does in his plane and he files direct a lot and gets it.

 

[NordicDave]

Foreflight shows route recently filed and flown. I find the recommendation based on this history to be inconsistent with my actual. When looking at aircraft types, they seldom match my 182, and commonly PC-12’s, King Airs, and other higher performing aircraft.

I see some patterns that are helpful in setting expectations. Example, Commonly flying out of KRHV (Delta Airport) to points south, expect to be directed over KSJC mid field (nearby Charlie airport). Sometimes I’ll get a down wind clearance, but when traffic I’d heavy, get routed via KSJC. See attached.

 

[luvflyin]

Has Foreflight expected routing ever led you astray? Do any of you ever just file direct? In my experience, I’ve received clearances into the flight levels based on victor airways, so I’m not sure what I missed here. In this Ep of LIFL, I got a bad clearance after having filed the expected routing from FF based on an altitude of FL250.

What did you file? What was the clearance you got on the ground? What did they end up giving you? I see 4 routes in FF Route Advisor. The only one that seems right for you to have filed is SBJ V6 CIP

 

[flyingron]

File what you want.
Fly what you get.
Log what you need.

Sometimes I get the issued route kicked back. Sometimes I get something really bizarrely different issued.

My favorite was filing a route and getting it parrotted back. When I picked up my clearance, they gave me a different route. When I took off, and got in radar contact, I get a "we have a new route for you, advise when ready to copy." I copied it. Hey! This is what I filed originally.

 

[Jon Weiswasser]

What did you file? What was the clearance you got on the ground? What did they end up giving you? I see 4 routes in FF Route Advisor. The only one that seems right for you to have filed is SBJ V6 CIP

Thats the one I got -SBJ V6 CIP @ FL280. I got the expected route email with it and was cleared as filed.
In this case (as you'll see), however, it was really important because I needed to be in the flight levels to get above the cumulus layer and avoid storms. The routing I got, even though it was associated with FL280 (what I filed) would not have enabled me to do that and would have been a significant problem as far as weather avoidance, not to mention fuel burn and time.

 

[Jon Weiswasser]

File what you want.
Fly what you get.
Log what you need.

Sometimes I get the issued route kicked back. Sometimes I get something really bizarrely different issued.

My favorite was filing a route and getting it parrotted back. When I picked up my clearance, they gave me a different route. When I took off, and got in radar contact, I get a "we have a new route for you, advise when ready to copy." I copied it. Hey! This is what I filed originally.

Ive had EXACTLY that happen. I also have an instructor who INSISTS on filing everywhere direct. When I did that once with him (and he has a good point and is often right) I got the email with a route to expect. Clearance was 'As Filed'. We launched with the instruction to proceed on course. I argued with him that I should at least put the the routing I got in the flight plan just in case. He got irritated with me and barked "You didn't file for it! Why would you bother if they said 'cleared as filed'"? Sure enough, the controller wondered where we were going and I had to scramble at an inopportune time to get the waypoints programmed.

Hope you liked the video.

 

[frfly172]

I file direct most of the time ,then take what atc wants while on the ground.

 

[mondtster]

Foreflight suggested routing is worthless pretty much everywhere except large metro areas. But in those high traffic areas I've found that the suggested routing often is the same as the actual route you receive in your clearance.

I've had similar experiences to flyingron. I've filed a reasonable route only to be issued a clearance that contained a route that would take me through the center of a presidential TFR, followed by vectors and an amended clearance that almost perfectly matched my original filed route. These days I almost always just file direct unless I know beyond reasonable doubt that I won't get it. In those cases I'll try to file a route that I know has worked before.

 

[flyingron]

I had filed what seemed to be a reasonable route out of the Boston area V3 - MRB. V3 goes way west of NYC so you'd think that it would be OK (especially down low). Nope. OWD even had the strip with my simple route and was about to read it to me and then they said "Well that won't work, got your pencil ready?" and gave me one that zig-zagged through three fixes, down the length of Long Island Sound to intercept some random JFK radial, over the top of JFK and then V16 down to the eastern shore and then "IAD" as a fix. (Not AML which is the colocated VOR, the airport).

 

[Jon Weiswasser]

Agree with all of the above. Have had my fair share of reroutes - especially when I file direct to the NJ from the east coast or from the south (the ride from Nashville back to NJ comes to mind - I'll get issued direct and then three re-routes as I get closer to DC/NY airspace). In this case, of interest was that I filed for FL280 and was given a clearance for a low altitude route, which was an issue because I needed to be in the high 20's to top a cumulus layer and do some serious convection avoidance (see video). Forget FF even - this was a situation where the SNAFU was in the system IMO.

 

[N1120A]

Garmin Pilot gives me suggested routings that were rogered or proposed by ATC. I've never gotten a substantial reroute

 

[Jon Weiswasser]

Reroutes happen all the time for me, esp when aiming for anywhere in the NE (like my home base at KCDW). If Im coming from the midwest or south, I file direct, and usually about 200nm out, I start getting the reroutes to fit in the with traffic flow. Earlier if I am passing through two or more major traffic areas (like Nashville to NJ - around DCA and PHL and then cycle into NYC). I have found that neither Foreflight, Garmin, or FltPlan can predict this. I think they all draw from the same data.

What was interesting in this case was that the route I got was dealt me by clearance delivery based on a filed altitude of FL280. You'll see in the video that the controller expected me to stay at 6000' for the trip based on that routing and that being in the flight levels was critical to success of the trip because I needed the altitude for weather reasons..