Engine problem on rotation

FlightofTwo said:
You don't know me, but a serious piece of advice---the longer you take to get back in an airplane after a scare, the harder it can be to do it. If you want to go up with another pilot or instructor first, that's fine, but it really would behoove you to get back up quickly, if you don't want the thoughts and incident to grow bigger and more problematic.
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This. Get back in the saddle....asafp. You were trained well.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
No, I was instructed to stay in the plane and maintain radio coms with tower until tug arrives.
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Can we discuss this side-topic? And I mean discuss; you know I am the last person to criticize, I am looking for opinions.
If I am in a disabled airplane on the runway I might not stay in the airplane.
(As pic, I think I have the right to override tower 'instructions')
I want to be in the grass, away from where the landing a/c will crash into my disabled airplane. I don't think I am staying in the airplane on the runway. I will secure it and walk upwind a little. What say you guys?
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Can we discuss this side-topic? And I mean discuss; you know I am the last person to criticize, I am looking for opinions.
If I am in a disabled airplane on the runway I might not stay in the airplane.
(As pic, I think I have the right to override tower 'instructions')
I want to be in the grass, away from where the landing a/c will crash into my disabled airplane. I don't think I am staying in the airplane on the runway. I will secure it and walk upwind a little. What say you guys?
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If it's a controlled airfield, I'm doing as the tower requests unless I believe I'm in danger. I'm not too worried about someone landing/crashing into me since the controller should be actively diverting traffic. Non-towered airport, I'm out of the aircraft and trying everything possible to get the aircraft off of the runway.


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OP, you've got one of this country's best flight instructors at your FBO (JP). Ask him to take you for a 30 minute confidence-booster in the other 152. I've got 50 hours of flight time in the one you're talking about. You likely experienced a nose gear shimmy on the takeoff roll. Add more back pressure during the taxi, takeoff, and landing so as to keep minimal pressure on the nose gear during all ground movement ops.

The only time you want to exit the airplane is if a legitimate life-threatening emergency exists. LAF has a lot of activity going on as a high-intensity student training airport, so you're better off staying inside the airplane than walking around near a busy runway intersection.
 
Thanks everyone. I started pre-planning a short XC for my next flight.

Even though I'm familiar with the area of my home field, and have an understanding of what surrounds the airport, I am going to be a bit more formal in my preflight briefing in noting off-field areas for landing (RWY would require a 90 degree turn).

As for tower's instructions, I was listening to and watching traffic before take off and knew there were two planes coming in. I heard the controller begin diverting traffic immediately (you can hear it here about 4 minutes in - http://archive-server.liveatc.net/klaf/KLAF-Twr-Sep-23-2016-2230Z.mp3).

Harold, your suggestion is a good one; If I get skittish, that's what I'll do. (By the way, I saw some student marketing materials from Purdue last month that say KLAF is the second busiest airspace in the State.)
 
Verdict over the phone: strut blew out. Not sure if that means damper or strut. No more details beyond that yet. I will ask and learn more. When I go over there later this week.

Engine may have stalled due to WOT-to-idle so fast, or fuel sloshing due to severe shudder. Engine runs smoothly apparently.

Slightly embarrassing, but learned a lot...:oops:
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Verdict over the phone: strut blew out. Not sure if that means damper or strut. No more details beyond that yet. I will ask and learn more. When I go over there later this week.

Engine may have stalled due to WOT-to-idle so fast, or fuel sloshing due to severe shudder. Engine runs smoothly apparently.

Slightly embarrassing, but learned a lot...:oops:
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Never ever be embarrassed making a decision when you think your safety is at risk. You should not feel stupid, and even if you do feeling stupid is better then being dead.
 
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MassPilot said:
When I was a solo student I aborted a takeoff due to a bad shimmy. Turns out the shimmy damper did need to be replaced. I don't think I got above 20 knots. I got it on video.

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Wow, this video could have been filmed in my airplane. You pulled onto the runway and added power a little early: looked like before your turn was completed. My nose wheel began to shimmy just the same and lasted just as long. I pulled off the runway and tower called down to say 'looks like you had quite the shimmy!' I agreed, advised I would shut down to check it out, confirmed there wasn't a deer stuck to my nose gear and hopped back in. This time I took the runway a little easier before adding go juice and all was fine and has been ever since.

The kicker? This happened at KLAF too. Maybe it's your runway?!? :eek:
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Yeah, I thought about that overnight. My gut reaction (training) was from shock. I'm ok to call it fear (scared) and desire for survival. Whatever it was kicked in.

But the thing that bothered me was not wanting to get back on that horse yesterday...and maybe not today either.

Am I scared? I've never been afraid to die or get hurt in the past (and I requestioned that a lot in bed last night)...I raced cars and was an industrial volunteer firefighter and hazmat responder for a quarter century. I gave those up, but mostly out of duty to my young family at the time (and time management). When I started flight training, the family is older, we are financially fine, I thought that the reward was greater than the slight additional risk. But I think I am having trouble thinking about those that might be left in grief if I'm gone. I can fly to go visit my elderly parents more often, but I'm sure they would rather see me less often than not at all. Dang, too deep, sorry guys, lotsa introspection.
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I had a similarly difficult time getting back in after a near loss of directional control following a go around. Drifted away from centerline and the trees not too far away got amazingly large.

Needless to say I replayed this a bit.

As I mentioned a second before reading, this IS PTSD. In addition to getting back on the horse, AN option is counseling. Can help you figure out if you are truly done or if the joy of flying is worth the risk that we intuitively know to exist, but only feel on select occasions.

If not too personal please keep us posted on this! I think everyone here is rooting for you.
 
iflyvfr said:
Wow, this video could have been filmed in my airplane. You pulled onto the runway and added power a little early: looked like before your turn was completed. My nose wheel began to shimmy just the same and lasted just as long. I pulled off the runway and tower called down to say 'looks like you had quite the shimmy!' I agreed, advised I would shut down to check it out, confirmed there wasn't a deer stuck to my nose gear and hopped back in. This time I took the runway a little easier before adding go juice and all was fine and has been ever since.

The kicker? This happened at KLAF too. Maybe it's your runway?!? :eek:
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I was a solo student when this happened with about 2 hours of solo time in my logbook. This was at 1B9.
 
455 Bravo Uniform said:
Verdict over the phone: strut blew out. Not sure if that means damper or strut. No more details beyond that yet. I will ask and learn more. When I go over there later this week.

Engine may have stalled due to WOT-to-idle so fast, or fuel sloshing due to severe shudder. Engine runs smoothly apparently.

Slightly embarrassing, but learned a lot...:oops:
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Nothing to be embarrassed about, it sounds like you handled it like Chuck Yeager. I was impressed reading your story.
 
MassPilot said:
I was a solo student when this happened with about 2 hours of solo time in my logbook. This was at 1B9.
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I was referring to the OP's home drome, KLAF. Sorry could have been more clear. But the vid is very similar to my own experience with about 1250 more hours than you at the time! :)
 
FlightofTwo said:
You don't know me, but a serious piece of advice---the longer you take to get back in an airplane after a scare, the harder it can be to do it. If you want to go up with another pilot or instructor first, that's fine, but it really would behoove you to get back up quickly, if you don't want the thoughts and incident to grow bigger and more problematic.
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SkyDog58 said:
PTSD for such a minor occurrence is highly unlikely.
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I don't know about PTSD, but he was under the impression that he came within seconds of having an engine failure immediately after takeoff which is a nightmare scenario for all of us. I'd be pretty freaked out too, but I'd feel a whole lot better when I realized it was just a shimmy and I would have been fine if I rotated.
 
I once landed and just as soon as the nose wheel touched down, the damper decided to go on strike. It felt like the plane was going to come from together and directional control was very difficult to maintain. A shimmy sounds so benign and just doesn't accurately describe what's happening - more like a 6.2 magnitude quake that is about to rattle the fillings out of your head! Replaced the damper and haven't had an issue since.
 
Stingray Don said:
I once landed and just as soon as the nose wheel touched down, the damper decided to go on strike. It felt like the plane was going to come from together and directional control was very difficult to maintain. A shimmy sounds so benign and just doesn't accurately describe what's happening - more like a 6.2 magnitude quake that is about to rattle the fillings out of your head! Replaced the damper and haven't had an issue since.
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Very typical of Cessna 150/152/172s, especially if they're used for training.
 
Stingray Don said:
I once landed and just as soon as the nose wheel touched down, the damper decided to go on strike. It felt like the plane was going to come from together and directional control was very difficult to maintain. A shimmy sounds so benign and just doesn't accurately describe what's happening - more like a 6.2 magnitude quake that is about to rattle the fillings out of your head! Replaced the damper and haven't had an issue since.
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Completely agree. I don't know if it's obvious from the video I posted but it was violent. I couldn't see straight as it was happening.
 
It was ruled excessive nose wheel shimmy. It blew one of the o-rings on the nose strut, causing it to lose nitrogen charge.

Shimmy plus abrupt cut to throttle caused disrupted fuel flow to the engine, causing the engine shut off.

My former CFI suggested when that happens to apply a little more back pressure to alleviate the weight of the airplane on the nose wheel.

I was applying back pressure to rotate and I released that back pressure as soon as the shudder started. I don't think I pushed forward on the yoke, but I very well may have (subconscious "get the nose down now!"). Or maybe when I jumped on the brakes and pulled throttle I shifted all the weight forward and blew it out.

I thought maybe blowout caused the shimmy, but probably not, because strut was charged when I checked it on preflight.

That blowout probably explains why I had a tough time steering.

I'll blame it on the prior driver for loosening the oring with a hard landing, lol.

Waiting for decent VFR weather for a short XC flight.
 
It all came from together on you. That's in the rental policy so you should be able to get a free hour of use. But then I'm just making that up.
 
Often Cessna nosewheel shimmy is caused by poor shimming, or out of balance nosewheel assemblies, and people do the cheaper fix and replace the dampener constantly.
 
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