Dream To Be A Airline Pilot

[theyalg]

Good Day,

I have always had a dream to be a airline pilot, I love everything about planes, airports, travel... it all fascinates me. There have been many different obstacles that have stopped me from obtaining my dream. So now I am here requesting any suggestions, help or advice on what I should do.

My situation is I am 25 years old about $53000 of debt in college loans working as an engineer (not really enjoying it). Every time I fly somewhere I just want to quit my job and go to a flight school and get all the necessary licenses. I would love to get a chance to talk to a airline pilot whos been through this who can help.

Is it worth it?
Whats the best flight school to go?
How do I deal with the money issue?
What is the possibility of becoming an airline pilot?
How long will it take?

Any help or advice will be very appreciated. Thank you everyone have a great day.

 

[wabower]

I think you may need to take the long view.

Good Day,

I have always had a dream to be a airline pilot, I love everything about planes, airports, travel... it all fascinates me. There have been many different obstacles that have stopped me from obtaining my dream. So now I am here requesting any suggestions, help or advice on what I should do.

My situation is I am 25 years old about $53000 of debt in college loans working as an engineer (not really enjoying it). Every time I fly somewhere I just want to quit my job and go to a flight school and get all the necessary licenses. I would love to get a chance to talk to a airline pilot whos been through this who can help.

Is it worth it?
Whats the best flight school to go?
How do I deal with the money issue?
What is the possibility of becoming an airline pilot?
How long will it take?

Any help or advice will be very appreciated. Thank you everyone have a great day.

 

[ronnieh]

This ought to be good.

 

[AdamZ]

Good Day,

I have always had a dream to be a airline pilot, I love everything about planes, airports, travel... it all fascinates me. There have been many different obstacles that have stopped me from obtaining my dream. So now I am here requesting any suggestions, help or advice on what I should do.

My situation is I am 25 years old about $53000 of debt in college loans working as an engineer (not really enjoying it). Every time I fly somewhere I just want to quit my job and go to a flight school and get all the necessary licenses. I would love to get a chance to talk to a airline pilot whos been through this who can help.

Is it worth it?

Is it worth it? Well only you can answer that question.

Whats the best flight school to go?

There are lots of good flight schools out there and several different routes to becoming an airline pilot. Keep in mind that all of them will take a good amount of time and and extrodinary amount of money.

How do I deal with the money issue?

Well that right there is the million dollar question. Can you afford to go into more debt to get the ratings you will need inorder to acheive your goal? Is the military an option for you? Finances are a very personal issue that only you can answer.

What is the possibility of becoming an airline pilot?

Well all the reports we hear say that there will soon be a shortage of airline pilots so if you can get the rating the prospects may be good. I think the real question is can you financially afford it. New rules are in place that have increased the hours needed to sit right seat and more hours means more money or at least a longer time to get to the airlines.

How long will it take?

Depends on how much money and how motivated you are.

Any help or advice will be very appreciated. Thank you everyone have a great day.

There are a few different ways to get to the airlines you can go the military route if they agree to train you, you can go the hump your way up route where in you pay for your private, instrument, commercial and Flight Instructor Ratings and then instruct at $40 or so an hour until you have enough hours to go sit right seat in a commuter making 20K per year.

In short its a long road and its going to be tough to pay off the loans. But really the best advice you can get is to talk to airline pilots such as Greg Bockleman or Charter pilots such as Mari and Teller or guys fresh out of aviation programs at major universities such as Jason Herman all on this forum. They have the experience that I and many of us here don't have.

Finally have you considered that if you like flying that much to just get your private rating and enjoy flying GA? That may make the working hours a bit more tolerable.

 

[poadeleted20]

Is it worth it?

That's a question only you can answer.

Whats the best flight school to go?

If you really want to jump into the airlines, you will get the best "leg up" on that by going to one of the major flight schools feeding the regional airlines such as Flight Safety, Aerosim (formerly Delta Connection Academy), etc.

How do I deal with the money issue?

That's difficult to say. You're already in the hole for over $50K, and you're talking about another $50K investment. Delta Connection Academy used to have a deal with Key Bank to finance training, but I don't know if that's still an option. The schools will be able to tell you more, but you'd better realize you'll be living hand-to-mouth for about five years.

What is the possibility of becoming an airline pilot?

If you have no medical issues and complete one of those professional training programs, pretty near 100% for someone your age. The airlines are all about to experience a dramatic retirement wave that was put off for five years by the increase from 60 to 65, but it's still going to happen, and with the military having cut way back on pilot production and increased the active duty commitment, nobody knows where they're going to get the next generation from.

How long will it take?

You can probably complete all the flight school training in about 12 months or less, and then build some time as an instructor there until getting hired by a regional carrier -- typically about 500 hours total time, which means a year or so. Then it's about 3-5 years with a regional before the majors will look at you seriously.

 

[theyalg]

Thank you so much for everyones reply so far. The toughest situation is the money, in the past year or so that has been one factor that has slowed me down.

 

[ClimbnSink]

Engineer for work, fly for fun. How you feel about your engineering job is how you will feel about a flying job once the shine wears off(doesn't take long)

Good Day,

I have always had a dream to be a airline pilot, I love everything about planes, airports, travel... it all fascinates me. There have been many different obstacles that have stopped me from obtaining my dream. So now I am here requesting any suggestions, help or advice on what I should do.

My situation is I am 25 years old about $53000 of debt in college loans working as an engineer (not really enjoying it). Every time I fly somewhere I just want to quit my job and go to a flight school and get all the necessary licenses. I would love to get a chance to talk to a airline pilot whos been through this who can help.

Is it worth it?
Whats the best flight school to go?
How do I deal with the money issue?
What is the possibility of becoming an airline pilot?
How long will it take?

Any help or advice will be very appreciated. Thank you everyone have a great day.

 

[AggieMike88]

Engineer for work, fly for fun. How you feel about your engineering job is how you will feel about a flying job once the shine wears off(doesn't take long)

I was thinking the above.

Especially since of major importance is acquiring a good engineering job, setting up and sticking to a bare survival budget, and working hard to kill off that student debt ASAP! (hint: Read this book...NOW!)

The sooner the student loan debt is dead, and 6-months of cash reserve set up, the sooner you can apply more wisdom to a reality than just an interesting fantasy.

Having the money saved up in advance for anything aviation might not be as fun, but is the more secure way to go about it.

You're young, you have plenty of time. Do your homework and research as Adam suggests (especially talking to our cadre of commercial pilots) and make sure the desire outlasts the glitz and shine your "I've always wanted to..." thinking has put on this.

Another commercial pilot to talk to is ntbjounin (Allen G. based in the Dallas area).

 

[ainokea]

You can probably find some answers in this video. There's another video there that might have additional info,

 

[Z06_Mir]

My advice? Work your way out of debt and get your ratings while you work.. at least to start with. It would take a loooooong time to get out of $130k+ of debt making $20k a year.

 

[Everskyward]

My advice? Work your way out of debt and get your ratings while you work.. at least to start with. It would take a loooooong time to get out of $130k+ of debt making $20k a year.

I totally agree with this advice if the OP decides to go for it. Keep your day job.

 

[Clark1961]

Engineer for work, fly for fun. How you feel about your engineering job is how you will feel about a flying job once the shine wears off(doesn't take long)

Yup, time to grow up a bunch. Not a popular message but a practical one.

On the other hand, there are pilots that love to fly, even commercial pilots.

 

[MSPAviator]

Downsize your life to pay off the debt, keep your day job, find an AME, get your medical/student pilot certi. Then get your private the Part 61 way. Get back to us after you've done your first lesson.

 

[bockwoman3]

Another thing to consider that you don't mention...do you have a significant other?

Greg (my husband and the Greg Adam Zucker mentioned) was fortunate that we started dating way back when he was getting his ratings and I appreciated that he was preparing to have a career in the airline business. I just accepted the fact that he would be gone from home on a regular basis and the thought never really bothered me even though I knew it would have its challenges. I also for the fun of it got my private pilot certificate (yes, he did teach me how to fly...the key is to do it before you get married...lol) and we enjoy GA flying and going to fly-ins together.

If you have no significant other to consider, that can be a plus...one less thing to consider at this point.

 

[wabower]

And maybe one more. Paying off $1k/mo takes more than 5 years.

I totally agree with this advice if the OP decides to go for it. Keep your day job.

 

[bockwoman3]

Engineer for work, fly for fun. How you feel about your engineering job is how you will feel about a flying job once the shine wears off(doesn't take long)

I believe one's perspective does not necessarily equal another individual's perspective and/or experience...but something to consider.

 

[bockwoman3]

Yup, time to grow up a bunch. Not a popular message but a practical one.

I neither see nor hear a reason to tell this gentleman to grow up...he's asking an opinion...not going out and quiting his engineering job tomorrow with no job prospects in mind...at least not that he has indicated by his post. (this is a pet peeve of mine...defensive, snide or inconsiderate remarks that uncalled for because they are interjected out of someone else's personal issues and not necessarily rooted in reality.)

 

[ClimbnSink]

There are a handful of working pilots that still have a happy for flying, and there are retards happy to coral shopping carts all day long. Only the retards dont have school debt, and smile more.

 

[Clark1961]

I neither see nor hear a reason to tell this gentleman to grow up...he's asking an opinion...not going out and quiting his engineering job tomorrow with no job prospects in mind...at least not that he has indicated by his post. (this is a pet peeve of mine...defensive, snide or inconsiderate remarks that uncalled for because they are interjected out of someone else's personal issues and not necessarily rooted in reality.)

53,000 in debt is not a reason? Okay, we can agree to disagree. I'll leave it at that.

 

[denverpilot]

Call it "growing up" or just "taking responsibility for one's own finances and prior choices", it's the same thing.

I didn't see Clark's commentary as negative or snarky. My dad and grandfather would have used the same words.

"You bought it, you pay for it. Grow up."

In this case, the young man purchased something that cost $53,000. It apparently has garnered the beginnings of engineering career which is returning something on the investment. Pretty good. Most grads aren't finding jobs at all. Congrats on that.

He doesn't say what starting engineer pay is these days, but I can guess. If his date of first dispersement on a typical fixed rate student loan was between 2006 and 2011, he's probably paying about 6.5% interest.

This choice is already the done portion of the deal.

If he can swing paying $1000/month toward his loans, it's a five year, three month payoff and an additional $9600 in interest over that time. The $53,000 loan became $59,000.

The fact that he has to pay the loan with after-tax money is also brutal here, since earning one more dollar really only nets him anywhere from roughly $0.80 to $0.65 depending on salary. Hitting that bump to the 35% tax bracket hurts when it happens... you think you're doing great...boom. Making less than you were prior to that pay increase. Be careful there.

Of course, he should also be saving now for retirement and that can keep the tax rate low, but also kill the cash flow for paying the student loan debt.

Most folks don't have the level of willpower to pay that hard on a student loan at typical starting salaries, since it would mean driving a complete beater vehicle, and frugal dining options, in most cities, where the engineering jobs are. A small apartment also. But at least it's his own apartment.

They don't have you run these calculations when you're signing for the loans in school. (Which would be a real education, but I digress.) But anyone who's title is engineer should be able to work up the spreadsheet to figure out best rate of return on taxes vs student loans. And add in the ability to tweak it to different salary levels.

He's got numbers to work with there. As my grandfather used to say, "Get out your calculator." whenever I'd ask him his advice on a new job or expensive purchases. New job might be 20 miles away for a commute. How much do gas and maintenance costs go up vs higher salary?

All big kid questions. Nothing wrong with saying it's "growing up" to start figuring it all out on paper.

In contrast, kids coming out of big name aviation schools are quite often double that amount in student loans and making half of what a starting engineer makes, and not topping that salary for at least five years.

They live at home with parents or family and often have crash pads with anywhere from three to ten bunkmates near their home base with the airline.

Sure there are better situations than that, but not that many.

If he can avoid buying a spouse (haha...) and kids, he could pay off the existing student loan debt and save up to take a good shot at aviation without debt (already has the degree, just needs ratings and flight time, lots of it) on a pay-as-you-go basis in about five years. He also has a marketable skill and career to fall back on. Not such a bad place to be.

If he's already started purchasing stuff like the new car, or the spouse, or the kids, or the gadgets and toys, and gotten used to the beginning engineer lifestyle of his peers, it'll be ten years to that point. Age starts to become a factor in getting hired into a new career eventually.

The old fashioned way to accelerate this would have been to get a second job, but that's pretty rare nowadays. Bummer. It worked for lots of folks in the past. Economy sucks now.

I don't think Clark was saying he was dropping the engineering job tomorrow, really. He was just saying that even if he didn't and started paying hard on the existing loan, it's going to take five years or more to dig out of the loans already purchased.

Debt is the modern form of slavery. Pure and simple. Kill the debt and start again. At 25 there's still time. Next round, no debt. Cash and carry.

You're going to have to want it REAL bad now. But you have the required four year degree. Pay that off, and then fly your butt off with every dollar. That's the path from where you're at, in my opinion. Can be done. Won't be easy.

 

[jspilot]

Can people please lay off the student loan debt issue. It is not his or her fault they are 50,000 plus dollars in debt, it is the redicilous cost of college nowadays and a failing student loan situation. Many people graduating from college in the US are saddled with similar levels of debt. I can't help but think how overwhelming and restricting the student loan situation in our country has become. In this case the original poster probably can't pursue a different career because of the debt but how many others in similiar situations don't or can't pursue other options because of the debt.

I usually steer clear of political like discussions but this is my one "sore spot"- now back to chatting about flying and airplanes, a much more enjoyable topic.

 

[ClimbnSink]

Not talking about student debt doesnt make it go away.

 

[Dr. O]

Being a pilot looks glamorous - it ain't. It's a mind numbing grind with a boss who loves to give your shorts a wedgie - being bored stupid overnight (or worse) in a strange city where you can't afford to do anything interesting, so you drink.
Until you are in the left seat of a type rated airliner, you won't be living in one place long enough to stay married (and you won't afford it)

Now the worst part - If you did not have your cfi by the time you were 21 and hundreds of hours in twins by 25 (probably from flying freight in a clapped out bucket of bolts across the Appalachians at night - in thunderstorms; and survived) you are too late.

You do have one plus, a BS. But by the time you go get a multiengine CFI rating and accumulate some hours you will be considerably older than the kids they will be hiring THEN.
And anyone your age applying with you for that one opening will likely a mustered out military pilot they will take in a heartbeat over you.

You will not be able to pay on your student debt by flying. CFI and flying freight pays less than minimum wages. Basically, you are screwed.

So, keep working as an engineer.
Work like a dog and live like a church mouse and pay off that student loan (you will still be living like a millionaire compared to how you would live as a CFI/freight pilot)
Get your commercial and CFI.
Once you have cleared the student debt buy a couple of older planes and set yourself up as an FBO/CFI and you will be the one giving the wedgies.
If you continue to work your engineering job full time and run your FBO full time you might just break even at the end of each year.

Ain't flying wonderful?

 

[HerrGruyere]

To the OP, most people our age are in debt. It's kind of a fact of life if you go to school nowadays. I mean, who has 53K laying around to up and go to college? It stinks and there's gotta be a better way. German university students pay I think maybe maximum $1,000 per year to to go to school. I was shelling out a lot more than that per semester. Ridiculous.

Anyway, like you, I had to get my hands on the controls of something. Plus, my friends were tired of hearing me waffle on about flying and how much I want to do it. A little coaxing from my girlfriend got me moving on it. I sought out a school that would be affordable and calculated whether or not I could afford to do this with minimal loan costs. You have to be really careful here. Create a backup plan for your backup plan. Make sure that after it's all said and done you can still repay those student loans. Also, don't quit your day job. And don't let anybody steer you away from what you want to do. Some people really regret the world of aviation and are super bitter. Some people are happy as a clam where they are. It depends on your drive and your passion.

Anyway, I'm going about this much slower than you. I also have no "dream" of working for the airlines. I'd be just as happy flying something else. Anything else. I have come to the realization that I might just end up instructing on the weekends and that's as far as it goes. I'd still be happy. Just keep that in mind, OP.

I'm happy right now, though. Aviation isn't a race. Some think it is. You can rush through it if you want, but you might look back and wished you hadn't. I'm excited to take a day trip or just fly for fun getting my IFR. I want to experience all types of aircraft and don't need to be behind the yoke of some jet.

My point is kind of vague, but just be careful in what you choose. Spend some more time job hunting on the side. You never know what you can find.




Also, what's this business of "buying a wife?" My girlfriend and I split the bill/trade who pays almost 95% of the time, and we've been together for almost two years. She doesn't care. She's realistic, since she knows this isn't 1958 and the man doesn't have to pay for everything anymore. I think we're like the last country in the world that still follows this belief.

 

[NoHeat]

Maybe find an engineering job related to aviation?

Rockwell Collins, which is located in Cedar Rapids near my home town, is often hiring engineers, and not just electrical engineers. They are a big maker of avionics and simulators for airlines and military.

 

[Kevin H.]

Dang. You guys really know how to crush someones dream. lol. Just messing. You guys gave some hard truths when it comes to aviation, which is extremely important to anyone starting out. I wouldn't say the shine wears off fast. I've been flying for about 6 years in GA with a single/multi engine commercial license and I still love it more today than I did my first time sitting in an airplane. Don't let anyone suck the life enjoyment out of flying for you -- They do that enough at the fuel pump. Build up a small fund over the next couple of years and go for your PPL and see where it takes you. Adding on HP and ME rating can always follow as well, you never know. But if you love flying, find a way to make it happen, but within reason of course.

 

[Threefingeredjack]

Just a look from another perspective. I have flown medium sized airplanes and helicopters in a regimented environment for a fair chunk of time, and while it was rewarding and offered challenges, I enjoy just putting around on my own schedule a whole lot more. I know guys who tell me that flying the line is like driving a bus after a while, and the chance to do fun flying is lost in company procedure and regulations.

 

[denverpilot]

Can people please lay off the student loan debt issue. It is not his or her fault they are 50,000 plus dollars in debt, it is the redicilous cost of college nowadays and a failing student loan situation. Many people graduating from college in the US are saddled with similar levels of debt. I can't help but think how overwhelming and restricting the student loan situation in our country has become. In this case the original poster probably can't pursue a different career because of the debt but how many others in similiar situations don't or can't pursue other options because of the debt.

I usually steer clear of political like discussions but this is my one "sore spot"- now back to chatting about flying and airplanes, a much more enjoyable topic.

Huh? Not his fault? Signing up for classes, there's a list of prices. One decides if they can afford to pay back those prices with a job garnered by said "education", or one decides said "education" is worth the price.

The second decision after that is whether or not to finance it.

Your finances are your own, and they make a difference on your options in life. If he didn't want us to take his finances into account, he wouldn't have shared them.

He signed up for the classes and read the price sheet. He's a big boy and can pay for them. My wife's still paying on hers. Welcome to adult decisions.

I was three-part-time-jobs and cash-and-carry in college with no days off for years. I paid every semester off at the due date except one, or I didn't go to class. I also scraped up the money for a Private rating because it was required in an Aviation degree program. Part of the price tag I signed up for.

When one of the part-time-jobs showed the potential of becoming a career, I dropped out of aviation school and instead spent nights studying the skills needed for the career and traveling installing gear in crap-hole data centers.

20 years later, I scraped up the dough for an Instrument Rating. I took eight years off of flying somewhere in there, too. Had some very large personal debt (non-education) to pay off. Dug out. Learned a lesson. Never again. Can't pay cash, don't buy it. Includes school classes. And industry certifications. Everything.

So... I don't know why you're upset that the advice is to pay off his debts he signed up for. He chose that path. He shared that he did. And asked advice.

Now he wants to fly for a living. We're just explaining how to get there. He can run up more debt if he likes. It can be put into Forebearance while he makes it much bigger, and then he's going to make about half of what he does now -- for a lot of years.

Nobody's stopping him. It's just where he's at. He also has an engineering job in an economy where a guy who programmed code for 21 years asked me if my company was hiring. He's selling real-estate to make ends meet. He wants to be coding.

His debt is just a very difficult additional circumstance. It's not political. It's his balance sheet. There was nothing political mentioned.

Buckle down, beat that engineering horse for all it's worth, buy nothing not needed, and go flying. No fancy aviation school or more debt required.

 

[AggieMike88]

Buckle down, beat that engineering horse for all it's worth, buy nothing not needed, and go flying. No fancy aviation school or more debt required.

 

[denverpilot]

Also, what's this business of "buying a wife?" My girlfriend and I split the bill/trade who pays almost 95% of the time, and we've been together for almost two years. She doesn't care. She's realistic, since she knows this isn't 1958 and the man doesn't have to pay for everything anymore. I think we're like the last country in the world that still follows this belief.

It's both a joke and a warning that wives sometimes come with expectations of houses, and kids, usually.

And many want husbands that aren't gone in a hotel room half the month.

Not all. But most.

Guys, gals, hell... Pilots... We'll sleep on the floor or couch at a buddy's apartment in our uniforms and fly the next morning. Our spouses may put considerable pressure on us to live a better lifestyle that we probably can't afford.

Settle down. Have the white pocket fence and a mortgage. That's what you're "buying" in my corny comment.

It was not a commentary on who makes money in a household at all. And there's some women who'll live the pauper lifestyle to fly also. Or support someone who does.

That's not the general expectation in our society though. Fall in love, get married, buy stuff, have kids. That's the general plan most kids grew up hearing. I don't know any pro pilots who had young marriages survive those societal pressures. Very rare.

The girl in the right seat, killed in the Colgan crash, was living in her folk's house and commuting from the West coast to the East, with almost no sleep in two days, to chase her aviation dreams. She's dead. Her Captain stalled the airplane. She didn't correct it.

It's definitely not 1958. No way. And societal norms from 1958 were not my intent to convey. More like that pro pilot lifestyles have never fit society's norms, ever.

If your spouse (wife OR husband) can't live happy broke, probably putting off kids for a while, and definitely not driving a newish car while you're away... Don't "buy" a spouse in aviation.

Divorce isn't cheap. That's another aspect of "buy" for aviators. You might finally make some money someday and owe it all to the spouse in alimony or child support.

Better explanation? I forget the younger crowd doesn't have aviation friends who've made it to the big iron who have three ex-wives. (Or husbands. I know a woman who put aviation before family too. She bought a 310 and started her private in i with inheritance money and never held a single-engine rating. She flies big iron now too.)

Maybe that helps with perspective on the comment.

 

[James_Dean]

Ending up $100k+ in debt to compete for a $20k/yr job where you're on the road 130 nights a year?

I hear the Super 8 at the Boise airport is really nice.

Seriously - I've had two CFI's leave for that life and both are back flying charter and instructing.

 

[Greg Bockelman]

Seriously - I've had two CFI's leave for that life and both are back flying charter and instructing.

Its definitely not for everyone.

 

[jspilot]

Huh? Not his fault? Signing up for classes, there's a list of prices. One decides if they can afford to pay back those prices with a job garnered by said "education", or one decides said "education" is worth the price.

The second decision after that is whether or not to finance it.

Your finances are your own, and they make a difference on your options in life. If he didn't want us to take his finances into account, he wouldn't have shared them.

He signed up for the classes and read the price sheet. He's a big boy and can pay for them. My wife's still paying on hers. Welcome to adult decisions.

I was three-part-time-jobs and cash-and-carry in college with no days off for years. I paid every semester off at the due date except one, or I didn't go to class. I also scraped up the money for a Private rating because it was required in an Aviation degree program. Part of the price tag I signed up for.

When one of the part-time-jobs showed the potential of becoming a career, I dropped out of aviation school and instead spent nights studying the skills needed for the career and traveling installing gear in crap-hole data centers.

20 years later, I scraped up the dough for an Instrument Rating. I took eight years off of flying somewhere in there, too. Had some very large personal debt (non-education) to pay off. Dug out. Learned a lesson. Never again. Can't pay cash, don't buy it. Includes school classes. And industry certifications. Everything.

So... I don't know why you're upset that the advice is to pay off his debts he signed up for. He chose that path. He shared that he did. And asked advice.

Now he wants to fly for a living. We're just explaining how to get there. He can run up more debt if he likes. It can be put into Forebearance while he makes it much bigger, and then he's going to make about half of what he does now -- for a lot of years.

Nobody's stopping him. It's just where he's at. He also has an engineering job in an economy where a guy who programmed code for 21 years asked me if my company was hiring. He's selling real-estate to make ends meet. He wants to be coding.

His debt is just a very difficult additional circumstance. It's not political. It's his balance sheet. There was nothing political mentioned.

Buckle down, beat that engineering horse for all it's worth, buy nothing not needed, and go flying. No fancy aviation school or more debt required.

I'm not upset at all and I, much like you, worked and still work very hard to pay my own way through life. I agree completely that life is about choices and balencing options. My only point was, college is a road to debt nowadays long before many people see financial gain from the choice. I just wish the choice to go to college did not seemingly have such crippling financial ramifications for many who choose to go.

I don't want to take away from the original posters question so I'll just let this go.

 

[HerrGruyere]

I see the point you are driving across, jspilot. I know what you're talking about.

It's both a joke and a warning that wives sometimes come with expectations of houses, and kids, usually.

And many want husbands that aren't gone in a hotel room half the month.

Not all. But most.

Guys, gals, hell... Pilots... We'll sleep on the floor or couch at a buddy's apartment in our uniforms and fly the next morning. Our spouses may put considerable pressure on us to live a better lifestyle that we probably can't afford.

Settle down. Have the white pocket fence and a mortgage. That's what you're "buying" in my corny comment.

It was not a commentary on who makes money in a household at all. And there's some women who'll live the pauper lifestyle to fly also. Or support someone who does.

That's not the general expectation in our society though. Fall in love, get married, buy stuff, have kids. That's the general plan most kids grew up hearing. I don't know any pro pilots who had young marriages survive those societal pressures. Very rare.

The girl in the right seat, killed in the Colgan crash, was living in her folk's house and commuting from the West coast to the East, with almost no sleep in two days, to chase her aviation dreams. She's dead. Her Captain stalled the airplane. She didn't correct it.

It's definitely not 1958. No way. And societal norms from 1958 were not my intent to convey. More like that pro pilot lifestyles have never fit society's norms, ever.

If your spouse (wife OR husband) can't live happy broke, probably putting off kids for a while, and definitely not driving a newish car while you're away... Don't "buy" a spouse in aviation.

Divorce isn't cheap. That's another aspect of "buy" for aviators. You might finally make some money someday and owe it all to the spouse in alimony or child support.

Better explanation? I forget the younger crowd doesn't have aviation friends who've made it to the big iron who have three ex-wives. (Or husbands. I know a woman who put aviation before family too. She bought a 310 and started her private in i with inheritance money and never held a single-engine rating. She flies big iron now too.)

Maybe that helps with perspective on the comment.

Oh heh okay. I was being a little silly, too. I dunno, maybe my friends are just super old fashioned having grown up in the south, so I see them always paying for everything. Or maybe I just don't know the other side of their story. It's probably none of my business.

I remember as a poor college student, I always wondered why my friends would always buy drinks, dinners, etc. for girls. I also wondered why I was often leaving the bar single. Then I made the correlation. Cheap guys don't get dates, I guess!

 

[wabower]

How do you view the career opportunity for a young guy who wants to start now? Is the time required to "pay your dues" and get a decent seat with a major as long as it seems from the outside?

Its definitely not for everyone.

 

[ainokea]

Seriously - I've had two CFI's leave for that life and both are back flying charter and instructing.

My CFI also flew for the airlines (regionals) for 2 years and he said after everything the pay ended up to being $7/hour.

Now he's a cop and does CFI and fly's corporate when he's off.

 

[Anthony]

A good dose of reality for the OP.

Next victim!

 

[John Baker]

Whatever dreams you may have, pick the one you are going to go after wisely. You are starting out the right way about this particular dream, your asking questions, finding out about it.

Once you have selected the dream (goal) that you intend to pursue, then go after it with all you've got. In military terms, it's a mission. You never give up, you never quit, you do not look for excuses to explain failure, there is no failure, you accomplish the mission, or you die trying, period.

That by the way, applies to everything in your life, it's called perseverance. Choose your goals and battles carefully, you might be engaged in them for many years to come, make damn sure it is what you want to do before you start, because once you start, you can never quit until you have done it.

This is a hard philosophy for many people to understand or follow, they try things for a while, discover it's a hard task, so they simply quit, and then it's off to another failure. These people are the ones who inspire such endearing terms as "loser".

Find out all you can about this piloting thing, make damn sure it is what you want before you start.

-John

 

[MDeitch1976]

Ending up $100k+ in debt to compete for a $20k/yr job where you're on the road 130 nights a year?

What if the OP decides to jump in for that $20K a year job, and sticks around for 10 years or more, or even 20 years. He is not still going to be making $20K/yr.

There is a lot of talk as to why he shouldn't try for it. How about some more positive side to it all, and some of the paths he could follow. Maybe even some other types of Pilot alternatives. There are definitely several people on the forum who are paid to fly, and it would be hear more about those journeys. Good and the bad.

 

[HerrGruyere]

What if the OP decides to jump in for that $20K a year job, and sticks around for 10 years or more, or even 20 years. He is not still going to be making $20K/yr.

There is a lot of talk as to why he shouldn't try for it. How about some more positive side to it all, and some of the paths he could follow. Maybe even some other types of Pilot alternatives. There are definitely several people on the forum who are paid to fly, and it would be hear more about those journeys. Good and the bad.

Agreed. I believe the pay scale goes up with each year of time employed, at least according to Airline Pilot Central.

It can't be all doom and gloom out there!