Dare I fly my Cirrus into KLAS Las Vegas (from So Cal KWHP)?

VWGhiaBob

VWGhiaBob

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VWGhiaBob
Anyone done it and have stories?

I’m a new IFR pilot and own a Cirrus SR22. I need to go to Vegas tomorrow morning (the Saturday before New Years), returning Sunday am. I usually go to KHND, but it’s so far and they are having their usual gusting crosswind issues.

I’m thinking of filing IFR to KLAS. The Cirrus site says most pilots have good experiences. However, one guy claims he was forced to hold for 2 hours.

This Saturday is probably one of the busier days of the year for Vegas. Anyone here have any first hand experience on arriving IFR or VFR to Vegas???? How about getting a clearance and taking off to So Cal?

Or should I chicken out and go to KVGT?

Thanks in advance!
 
I have flown to a lot of big Class Bs (IAH, HOU, TPA, JFK, EWR, SFO and so on) in my C182 and have always done it VFR without any hassle. That seems to be the easiest way for them to slip you in between the big traffic. I've always been given fast departures VFR too, from an intersection or different runway, jumping the queue.

I'd only go IFR if the weather forced it!
 
I don’t like Las Vegas. Besides, it is really far and there is a cheap shuttle to Vegas that leaves out of Kinston, NC twice a week.
 
VWGhiaBob said:
However, one guy claims he was forced to hold for 2 hours.
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Makes me think of a robot running into into the same wall over, and over, and over, and over, and,....... if he wasn’t smart enough to divert, well, that just shows his stupidity, arrogance, or both.
 
Morgan3820 said:
I don’t like Las Vegas. Besides, it is really far and there is a cheap shuttle to Vegas that leaves out of Kinston, NC twice a week.
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While I don’t have any idea how your response is related to the OPs question, I am curious about the ‘cheap shuttle’. U got a link handy?
 
Fly into KVGT, more runway options, far cheaper fuel, and tiedown fees.
 
Hire an instructor and get some XW training. Day rate for a CFI can’t be that bad. Who wouldn’t jump at the chance to fly to Vegas, short notice for a free hotel room and some spending money? Well I wouldn’t but we have a new puppy.
 
VWGhiaBob said:
Anyone done it and have stories?

I’m a new IFR pilot and own a Cirrus SR22. I need to go to Vegas tomorrow morning (the Saturday before New Years), returning Sunday am. I usually go to KHND, but it’s so far and they are having their usual gusting crosswind issues.

I’m thinking of filing IFR to KLAS. The Cirrus site says most pilots have good experiences. However, one guy claims he was forced to hold for 2 hours.

This Saturday is probably one of the busier days of the year for Vegas. Anyone here have any first hand experience on arriving IFR or VFR to Vegas???? How about getting a clearance and taking off to So Cal?

Or should I chicken out and go to KVGT?

Thanks in advance!
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It's been so long since I've flown there my experience would probably be useless. But, it looks like the weather is going to be VMC. So file. If they give you delay getting out of WHP that you dont want to wait for, then just go VFR. You might avoid the delay by requesting OTP. If once airborne they start jerking you around, then Cancel and continue on your merry way VFR.
 
Another useless opinion but here goes nothin’. I’ve seen many YouTube videos of independent pilots fly their light aircraft into LAS. It doesn’t look like anything out of the ordinary by most that I’ve seen. I’d give it a shot, worse case scenario you cancel IFR and go VFR into VGT.

A few years ago I did some flying with an extended family member of mine who lives in Albuquerque. He owns a Commander 690 and I suggested that we take it out to LAS off the cuff like... he said that he flew into McCarran before and said that they tend to frown upon light GA, but I dunno how true that is.
 
eman1200 said:
While I don’t have any idea how your response is related to the OPs question, I am curious about the ‘cheap shuttle’. U got a link handy?
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No link, sorry. Just some hangar talk with our airport director mentioning that there were flights out of Kinston, KISO, that go to Las Vegas about twice a week. He sounded certain of his facts and is in a position to know. But that was six months ago and I didn’t look at it any further.
 
Morgan3820 said:
No link, sorry. Just some hangar talk with our airport director mentioning that there were flights out of Kinston, KISO, that go to Las Vegas about twice a week. He sounded certain of his facts and is in a position to know. But that was six months ago and I didn’t look at it any further.
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By the look of ISO on FlightAware, it looks pretty dead to me...like three GA flights on the whole board. Unless it’s some sort of a charter, which certainly wouldn’t be cheap, I’d say your airport director is full of hogwash.
 
Ryanb said:
By the look of ISO on FlightAware, it looks pretty dead to me...like three GA flights on the whole board. Unless it’s some sort of a charter, which certainly wouldn’t be cheap, I’d say your airport director is full of hogwash.
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yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. it's a really odd airport, in the middle of nowhere, kinda sleepy, and ELEVEN THOUSAND feet long. seemed like an odd place to have a flight to vegas, especially twice a week.
 
One of our FOs flies his Cardinal RG in there several times a month to go to work (he lives in Laughlin) he has never reported any issues. He even has some kind of deal worked out with the FBO for relatively cheap parking.
 
eman1200 said:
yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. it's a really odd airport, in the middle of nowhere, kinda sleepy, and ELEVEN THOUSAND feet long. seemed like an odd place to have a flight to vegas, especially twice a week.
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I thought maybe Allegiant, but nope!
 
There’s nothing magical about LAS, and North Vegas or Henderson are nearby if for some reason landing at LAS results in extended delays.

I don’t see any reason not to do it unless cost is an issue.
 
eman1200 said:
yeah, that's kinda what I was thinking. it's a really odd airport, in the middle of nowhere, kinda sleepy, and ELEVEN THOUSAND feet long. seemed like an odd place to have a flight to vegas, especially twice a week.
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It was always a long runway because it was an emergency reliever for Seymour... at least that what I was told. Then in the 90’s the local government started the global transpark development zone. It was an initiative to bring business into the area and they were hoping to get some type of large freight operator in the airport. They expanded the runway and supposedly rated it to handle an-225’s. There were also several highway infrastructure upgrades to get from iso to interstate corridors.

Like most government decisions it was a bad one. Now we have a sweet runway where you can do 4 touch and goes per lap in the circuit.

There is also a fair amount of spooky flying between Kinston and Smithfield. So there may be a shuttle to Vegas. You just can’t buy a ticket.
 
VWGhiaBob said:
Anyone done it and have stories?

I’m a new IFR pilot and own a Cirrus SR22. I need to go to Vegas tomorrow morning (the Saturday before New Years), returning Sunday am. I usually go to KHND, but it’s so far and they are having their usual gusting crosswind issues.

I’m thinking of filing IFR to KLAS. The Cirrus site says most pilots have good experiences. However, one guy claims he was forced to hold for 2 hours.

This Saturday is probably one of the busier days of the year for Vegas. Anyone here have any first hand experience on arriving IFR or VFR to Vegas???? How about getting a clearance and taking off to So Cal?

Or should I chicken out and go to KVGT?

Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...

I’ve flown into KLAS probably a dozen times. It’s really no big deal, especially if you’re IFR. I’ve only had to hold once (for about 10 mins) and that was because they had to close one of the 19s briefly.

It’s convenient and frankly easy. Go for it! In fact I’ve never flown into Henderson or North lV.

Oh, and stay at Atlantic. Much better rates than Signature. Super nice folks too.
 
I recall being all a-twitter about being asked to go to DFW recently and calmed down once I realized; it's just an airport.
Like all the others it has concrete, fbo, controllers, and other airplanes.

Be prepared for the things that might be different:
More traffic, holding, a backup plan
Complicated taxiways.
Maybe a controller that is not cool (hey it's ok, they are human - be polite and try to comply)
I just talked to a guy who went there and said, referring to atc "They are always so relaxed & welcoming at Vegas!"
 
Landing Fees said:
Hire an instructor and get some XW training. Day rate for a CFI can’t be that bad. Who wouldn’t jump at the chance to fly to Vegas, short notice for a free hotel room and some spending money? Well I wouldn’t but we have a new puppy.
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Agreed.
OP, Looks like KLAS wind forecast is the same. With my experience, I'd rather take the xwind over all the notams, frequencies, jets, runway crossings, landing on a wide runway in a little plane with high winds, possible long complicated taxi instructions, multiple ground freqs....

I've flown there enough professionaly to know they are great controllers, and it's easy for airliners to get around, but a small xwind at a simple airport sounds more relaxing. Now, if you're wanting to push your comfort zone and increase experience, then do it! It will for sure keep you on your toes and be a (jet) blast!

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You are IFR rated, so you should be used to dealing with ATC. You have a fast capable airplane, file and go as long as the weather isn't crap. Remember, you are PIC, ask for what you need. Let us know how it went.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
It was always a long runway because it was an emergency reliever for Seymour... at least that what I was told. Then in the 90’s the local government started the global transpark development zone. It was an initiative to bring business into the area and they were hoping to get some type of large freight operator in the airport. They expanded the runway and supposedly rated it to handle an-225’s. There were also several highway infrastructure upgrades to get from iso to interstate corridors.

Like most government decisions it was a bad one. Now we have a sweet runway where you can do 4 touch and goes per lap in the circuit.

There is also a fair amount of spooky flying between Kinston and Smithfield. So there may be a shuttle to Vegas. You just can’t buy a ticket.
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The “boondoggle “ name for that was “Global TransPark”. What a waste of money. Think there’s a small MRO on there now


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I know with a still-warm IFR rating, you want to forget VFR and use your new certificate. That was me two years ago. And yet my first flight with family was VFR. That's because some flights just aren't IFR-friendly, and you'll figure out what those are. This may be one of those for you.

In my opinion, LAS is a great example of a not-so-grand idea of an IFR trip.

It's one of the Flow Control airports. Also known as the Ground Delay Program. I've sat on many an airliner bound for Vegas, and we wait, not for an IFR Clearance, but instead for our departure time as the computers figure out our arrival order before we even taxi from the gate. I can't imagine on a GA aircraft that Flow Control will be your friend. Take off VFR, and you don't have flow control.

It's also a good way for Signature or Atlantic to charge you some serious $$$ just for the privilege of arriving. Those two FBOs are famous for breathtaking costs.

Here are some options in order of my personal preference.

1. Fly to a LAS area reliever airport. Henderson comes to mind, and in fact I'm planning to be there in March.
2. Fly to LAS VFR with Flight Following. Use your IFR skills to fly the best, most precise VFR flight you've ever done, and land when they work you in.
3. Fly to LAS, IFR, and see what kind of Expected Departure Clearance Time you get, and fly super-close to your filed flight plan, else risk long delays while Flow Control calculates a new arrival window. (might trigger 2-hour holds over the VOR?)
 
Polarisguy said:
The “boondoggle “ name for that was “Global TransPark”. What a waste of money. Think there’s a small MRO on there now


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Yep. That’s also why license plates sold in that area were GTP##### plate numbers. Had one of those on my car for a while.
 
Mountain Air Cargo, a FedEx feeder, maintains their ATR fleet at ISO. Besides that, I don’t think much is going on there these days.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
I recall being all a-twitter about being asked to go to DFW recently and calmed down once I realized; it's just an airport.
Like all the others it has concrete, fbo, controllers, and other airplanes.

Be prepared for the things that might be different:
More traffic, holding, a backup plan
Complicated taxiways.
Maybe a controller that is not cool (hey it's ok, they are human - be polite and try to comply)
I just talked to a guy who went there and said, referring to atc "They are always so relaxed & welcoming at Vegas!"
Click to expand...

Getting your IR is the first step. You need to use it not to lose it and it’s not only about weather.

This looks like a great trip and excuse to get rid of the big airport heebeegeebees. Treat it like an experience/training flight and do it IFR. I would suggest not bailing out and doing it VFR even if it the right thing to do for expedience purposes.

One other thing that might be different is the use of arrival and departure procedures (I’ve never flown into Las Vegas so I have no idea.). My experience is that I never get a STAR (old school) because I’m slow and low but big airports routinely hand out departure clearances. Helps to know what to expect and be familiar with the usual one(s). Listen to CD at the hotel for insight.

One of the coolest thing about light plane flying is being able to get to small airports that are closer to your destination than the big one. But one of the other cool things is being able to go into the biggies to pickup/drop off a passenger or on those rare occasions when the big airport is closest to your destination or it simply has the facilities that you need.

I do KCLT semi-frequently but have been into KEWR and KMIA when it made sense. Always IFR but usually hoping for and getting VMC. The only places around my stomping grounds I’ll never go are KLGA, KORD, and probably KATL but never say never.


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LAS is NBD. If you are arriving/departing peak times you may get held until they have a hole in the big iron but lots of single engine GA go in there. By time you factor in travel time and shuttle fees, LAS costs are not that much more significant IMO. Just let them know you can accept a Visual and short approach weather permitting. If they gotta route you on a published approach, holding is more likely.

I plan on LAS but always have VGT or HND as a briefed backup plan just in case.
 
Ryanb said:
By the look of ISO on FlightAware, it looks pretty dead to me...like three GA flights on the whole board. Unless it’s some sort of a charter, which certainly wouldn’t be cheap, I’d say your airport director is full of hogwash.
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Maybe, maybe not. I can't comment on Vegas, but when I worked the ramp at KACY, we handled several chartered 737's per shift flying groups in for over night junkets. Package deal type thing with casino picking up part of the tab. Offer your regulars a flight, room and a couple meals for dirt cheap and they'll happily come feed your slot machines with their money. Was a common thing in Atlantic City when I was there. Stands to reason Vegas would do the same.
 
Vegas is easy, though I’d probably do it VFR to make things easier on everyone.
 
If LAS is most convenient then plan for it and do it! I’ve only flown into Vegas once and opted for North Vegas as it was closer to my ground destination.

I think a two hour hold sounds ridiculous .... but can’t you cancel your IFR and land at one of the other local airports VFR if that does happen?
 
I think the chute will work OK in Nevada air, so no worries, go for it. . .
 
Also, consider asking for progressive taxi if the taxi directions are complex.
I did that early after getting my IR and taking off at BWI when they had me on the 10k foot runway. I taxied forever...

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tspear said:
Also, consider asking for progressive taxi if the taxi directions are complex.
I did that early after getting my IR and taking off at BWI when they had me on the 10k foot runway. I taxied forever...

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Definitely this if you’re nervous. Taxiing to the FBOs from 19 or 01 is easy.

One time I landed 08R and parked at Atlantic... opposite side of the field. Long ass taxi for sure, but very doable without progressive taxi (I didn’t use it).

Personally, I think that’s likely the most challenging part of flying into McCarran. And it’s unlikely because they usually put GA on the 19s.
 
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