CTAF use of callsign

How do you ID yourself when calling your turns or pattern positions on CTAF?

  • Full tail number on 1st call followed by abbreviated tail number?

    Votes: 75 76.5%

  • just type/color of aircraft? (also just "blue highwing" or similar)

    Votes: 17 17.3%

  • Use a fictitious number to maintain your stealth

    Votes: 6 6.1%
  • Total voters
    98
B

Brad W

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thinking about the recent thread discussing long conversations choking up CTAF
I thought of a sidetack question...

I'll admit to feeling silly sometimes calling out the tail number each time because I figure nobody listening at the uncontrolled field really cares.... and the only thing that really matters is to let folks know to look for 'someone' for example turning final if they are getting ready to pass the hold short line...

Not really any time savings..... "red low wing" vs "N1234A"... but it seems to me that a description is more useful most of the time....
 
It depends. If there a 3 other Sky Hawks in the pattern and they're all white? I'll use my number.
 
tenor.gif
 
Brad W said:
thinking about the recent thread discussing long conversations choking up CTAF
I thought of a sidetack question...

I'll admit to feeling silly sometimes calling out the tail number each time because I figure nobody listening at the uncontrolled field really cares.... and the only thing that really matters is to let folks know to look for 'someone' for example turning final if they are getting ready to pass the hold short line...

Not really any time savings..... "red low wing" vs "N1234A"... but it seems to me that a description is more useful most of the time....
Click to expand...

Nothing to do with time saving or frequency congestion: the FCC regulations require that station identification be a part of each transmission....


87.107 Station identification.
(a) Aircraft station. Identify by one of the following means:
(1) Aircraft radio station call sign.
(2) The type of aircraft followed by the characters of the registration marking ("N" number) of the aircraft, omitting the prefix letter "N." When communication is initiated by a ground station, an aircraft station may use the type of aircraft followed by the last three characters of the registration marking. Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, an aircraft being moved by maintenance personnel from one location in an airport to another location in that airport may be identified by a station identification consisting of the name of the company owning or operating the aircraft, followed by the word "Maintenance" and additional alphanumeric characters of the licensee's choosing.

Bob Gardner
 
“XYZ traffic you have a Mooney ten miles West descending thru 4500 inbound for Runway X, XYZ”.
“XZY traffic Mooney is three miles West entering downwind for Runway X, XYZ”

I was taught to keep it stupid-simple and I’ll use some numbers if there is another Mooney on the air.
 
I generally just list the type when at a non-towered airport. Not too many Mitsubishis in the pattern usually and it keeps the radio transmissions brief.
 
Option 4, type and last 3. More important for them to have an idea of what kind of airplane I am for a speed reference. The last 3 are for tracking purposes, hopefully they can remember 123 taking off, on downwind and on final.


Example,
Skyhawk 123, final 1, full stop
King Air 111 10 mile final runway 3, y'all get out of my way
 
bobmrg said:
Nothing to do with time saving or frequency congestion: the FCC regulations require that station identification be a part of each transmission....


87.107 Station identification.
(a) Aircraft station. Identify by one of the following means:
(1) Aircraft radio station call sign.
(2) The type of aircraft followed by the characters of the registration marking ("N" number) of the aircraft, omitting the prefix letter "N." When communication is initiated by a ground station, an aircraft station may use the type of aircraft followed by the last three characters of the registration marking. Notwithstanding any other provision of this section, an aircraft being moved by maintenance personnel from one location in an airport to another location in that airport may be identified by a station identification consisting of the name of the company owning or operating the aircraft, followed by the word "Maintenance" and additional alphanumeric characters of the licensee's choosing.

Bob Gardner
Click to expand...

And, .... 87.107(a)(4) is why controllers use 'color high/low wing' at FAA supported flyins.

"(4) An aircraft identification approved by the FAA for use by aircraft stations participating in an organized flying activity of short duration."
 
"Skyhawk 7685 with you on left downwind for runway one-niner, request airport bums to get the cooler off of the back of the truck"
 
A type and color is much more useful to me than knowing your reg

But that kind of logic, we won’t be having any of that lol
 
James331 said:
A type and color is much more useful to me than knowing your reg

But that kind of logic, we won’t be having any of that lol
Click to expand...

Next time you're on the 45, looking for that crosswind traffic, see if you can tell what color it is, let alone whether its a Cessna or a Taylorcraft.
 
wilkersk said:
Next time you're on the 45, looking for that crosswind traffic, see if you can tell what color it is, let alone whether its a Cessna or a Taylorcraft.
Click to expand...

I can much easer see colors than some little numbers on the side
 
James331 said:
A type and color is much more useful to me than knowing your reg

But that kind of logic, we won’t be having any of that lol
Click to expand...
Only if there are only a handful of different types flying. Go somewhere even remotely busy and you’re being unsafe not using the reg number.
But whatever. Logic won’t change your opinion. I vote that the next turd on here that starts a thread about this get banned for a few days.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
I vote that the next turd on here that starts a thread about this get banned for a few days.
Click to expand...
:yeahthat:

Haha. Hey, we’ve all beat these topics to death, what’s another go at it?

Seriously though, I’d vote for that too.
 
We could just ignore the AIM and FCC regs altogether and just use CB slang in the pattern so we can sound like a bunch of ignorant hicks.
 
I just ask if there is any other traffic in the area, and if I don't hear anything I don't bother making any calls because there is no one else around
 
Pattern calls are Commander 3 Tango Charlie. Initial ten and five mile call is also type with full call.
 
Where’s the option for full tail number every time? Or at least an “other”? Help, help, I’m being repressed!
 
"Hey white Cessna on downwind, this is white Cessna entering on the forty five. Look out for that white Cessna turning base- he's not talking."
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Only if there are only a handful of different types flying. Go somewhere even remotely busy and you’re being unsafe not using the reg number.
But whatever. Logic won’t change your opinion. I vote that the next turd on here that starts a thread about this get banned for a few days.
Click to expand...

So change your calls as required. Does everything need to be paint by numbers for folks?
 
IK04 said:
"Hey white Cessna on downwind, this is white Cessna entering on the forty five. Look out for that white Cessna turning base- he's not talking."
Click to expand...

That works

I know there are aircraft, their ball park speed and location.

What’s the problem again?
 
James331 said:
So change your calls as required. Does everything need to be paint by numbers for folks?
Click to expand...
Yep. Sure. That’s what I said. Paint by numbers.

what’s wrong with just doing the way the FAA and FCC have told us to so it’s standard. Why reinvent the wheel because you think you’re inventing a better mouse trap that actually is not as good as the guidance from the people that authorized you to operate in US airspace.

whatever.
 
So here’s the deal, OP. You’ll hear a lot of folks claim they identify themselves as “white Cessna” to aid in visual identification in the pattern. The reality is this practice was originated by grumpy, paranoid, anti government tinfoil hat types who are convinced that simply uttering their tail number on the public radio waves will expose them to the attention of the FAA, TSA, FBI, IRS, and the local tax collector’s office. They believe by IDing themselves as White Cessna no one can track them.

Don’t proliferate this silly practice. Pilots who have even a semblance of situational awareness can keep track of aircraft by call signs. If you can’t, keeping track of white cessnas and yellow cubs* isn’t going to make things any easier. Follow the AIM, use your full class sign. Technically only ATC can abbreviate your callsign.

*just kidding. Yellow cub pilots don’t bother with radios.
 
Tarheelpilot said:
Yep. Sure. That’s what I said. Paint by numbers.

what’s wrong with just doing the way the FAA and FCC have told us to so it’s standard. Why reinvent the wheel because you think you’re inventing a better mouse trap that actually is not as good as the guidance from the people that authorized you to operate in US airspace.

whatever.
Click to expand...

Is that a reg?

I’d say just do what seems best for the situation, I mean look how they do it and sun and fun
 
wow, I had no idea this would be such a sensitive topic.....
This was simply meant as a friendly conversation starter...just hanging out at the hangar talking about something that came to mind....
& I'm kinda saddened by the foul folks here....

Tarheelpilot said:
I vote that the next turd
Click to expand...
I expect better manners from a fellow North Carolinian
but anyway, thanks for that.

Brad Z said:
So here’s the deal, OP. You’ll hear a lot of folks claim they identify themselves as “white Cessna” to aid in visual identification in the pattern. The reality is this practice was originated by grumpy, paranoid, anti government tinfoil hat types who are convinced that simply uttering their tail number on the public radio waves will expose them to the attention of the FAA, TSA, FBI, IRS, and the local tax collector’s office. They believe by IDing themselves as White Cessna no one can track them.
Click to expand...

That might be the case for some...but I can assure you that never entered my mind in this context and that aint the point of it. Doubt it is for most....

Personally, I was taught and have always followed the more standard full tail # at initial call-up then "cessna 64E"
But I've also observed when trying to sort out the traffic in a very busy pattern that I can spot the "cessna" on final...and the "piper" on short final....and the "low wing" on base...& I can spot a baron or a bonanza....but I have no idea if the guy calling from "20U" calling extended final is one of the aircraft I can see or if it's somebody I don't see yet.

calling "cessna..." pretty much tells everyone that it's a high wing..... unless it's a low wing cessna..... And in a similar way there are so many other obscure aircraft types that everyone might not know what it looks like. How about that Paramount calling midfield downwind. Most folks wouldn't know which one that is.

So it seems to me that call signs using tail number is useful only for the "tapes". It doesn't really help in checking off the ones you see and the ones you don't see.
 
Brad W said:
wow, I had no idea this would be such a sensitive topic.....
This was simply meant as a friendly conversation starter...just hanging out at the hangar talking about something that came to mind....
& I'm kinda saddened by the foul folks here....
Click to expand...
This forum has been around for nearly fifteen years, so we’ve beat these topics up many many times. If you exercised the search function, rather than beating the dead horse even more, you would’ve found oodles of threads on this subject, so that’s where the sarcasm and buffoonery comes from. No harm, no foul.
 
I usually use N number with ATC but on CTAF, generally some sort of tactical call sign like Ghostrider or something similar.
 
Ryanb said:
If you exercised the search function, rather than beating the dead horse even more, you would’ve found oodles of threads on this subject,
Click to expand...
I'll bet somewhere around 94% of the conversations on this or any forum have been hashed out previously...so if we all followed that sorta rule and never posted a thought, topic, or question that was not completely original then forums would be a rather boring and quiet place to visit........

I'll bet I'm not the only person on this earth to think that while we have copyrights on music, every melody that there is or ever will be has probably been at some point in time thought of or hummed by at least some person or other creature going back in time all the way to the beginning. Is there really any such thing as original?
 
Brad W said:
wow, I had no idea this would be such a sensitive topic.....
This was simply meant as a friendly conversation starter...just hanging out at the hangar talking about something that came to mind....
& I'm kinda saddened by the foul folks here....


I expect better manners from a fellow North Carolinian
but anyway, thanks for that.



That might be the case for some...but I can assure you that never entered my mind in this context and that aint the point of it. Doubt it is for most....

Personally, I was taught and have always followed the more standard full tail # at initial call-up then "cessna 64E"
But I've also observed when trying to sort out the traffic in a very busy pattern that I can spot the "cessna" on final...and the "piper" on short final....and the "low wing" on base...& I can spot a baron or a bonanza....but I have no idea if the guy calling from "20U" calling extended final is one of the aircraft I can see or if it's somebody I don't see yet.

calling "cessna..." pretty much tells everyone that it's a high wing..... unless it's a low wing cessna..... And in a similar way there are so many other obscure aircraft types that everyone might not know what it looks like. How about that Paramount calling midfield downwind. Most folks wouldn't know which one that is.

So it seems to me that call signs using tail number is useful only for the "tapes". It doesn't really help in checking off the ones you see and the ones you don't see.
Click to expand...
What tapes?
 
I much prefer pilots use aircraft type/model to preface their registration as it helps to create situational awareness. I can estimate aircraft speeds and what aircraft is which when there are more than one if I know whether it's a Cub calling 10 miles out or a Cirrus. "N1234 ten miles out" only tells me somebody's out there.
 
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