Cherokee down - Florida

That looks ugly. Lucky they're still alive. Stall?

 
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Hoping they have a quick and full recovery .
 
Article states they clipped trees while landing but the overhead picture doesn’t show the runway at all. Must have been way low/short, not just a little.
 
Crash location is just below the pond at the top of the image.

Screenshot from 2018-03-07 11-22-50.png
 
On centerline, a little low...
 
Ouch! Without seeing anything about an engine failure, my guess would be a stall followed by clipping trees and then *thud!*

Glad they are recovering.
 
Ryanb said:
Ouch! Without seeing anything about an engine failure, my guess would be a stall followed by clipping trees and then *thud!*

Glad they are recovering.
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Base to final, turning stall?
 
As bad as that looks, the cockpit area appears to not be compromised.

If it had caught fire then there would have been a different ending. Which brings up another speculation of how much air was in the fuel tanks.

Happy to hear they survived.
 
Fortunate that the building absorbed some crash energy and slowed deceleration a bit.
 
Zeldman said:
As bad as that looks, the cockpit area appears to not be compromised.

If it had caught fire then there would have been a different ending. Which brings up another speculation of how much air was in the fuel tanks.

Happy to hear they survived.
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Yeah I was also thinking that..

Before Landing:
Fuel....Fullest Tank/ Fuel Pump ON

Might be another likely scenario.
 
Too low for some reason. I have a 180, they are very difficult to stall. In fact (I didn't realize it at the time) I never stalled mine with my cfi. The only time I've ever stalled mine was on my checkride. The dpe said "nope, that's not good enough" and helped me pull the yoke and hold it. That's the only time mine has ever dropped a wing (with me on board) and started to spin. I applied opposite rudder and it immediately recovered. Safest airplane in the sky.
 
SkyDog58 said:
Looks to be quite a bit short of the runway. Too far out to be that low in my opinion.

Hope their recoveries go well.
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His instructor told him he could stretch the glide by diving for the runway.
 
It was windy here today. I went from Panama City to Merritt Island and back this morning. 50kts tailwind down and then right on the nose coming back. Both landings were... sporting. Lots of gusts. Could have been a factor.
 
Challenged said:
Crash location is just below the pond at the top of the image.

View attachment 60755
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Based at Massey's for 30 years, trees are high at runway 18, parallel to Massey road, hence the displaced threshold. My mechanic whose hangar is at the end of 18 told me they were low on the approach. Usually you can see the planes on approach from his hangar. They were not visible and he heard the engine running. This was a second approach, they were low on the first approach and he wondered if they were going to make it the first time. Also told me no shoulder belts and most of the injuries reported to be facial.
 
My Cherokee, although very hard to unintentionally stall, does have a tendency to develop a very fast sink rate with the power reduced...if you're not ready for it, it could bite you.
 
2Airtime2 said:
Too low for some reason. I have a 180, they are very difficult to stall. In fact (I didn't realize it at the time) I never stalled mine with my cfi. The only time I've ever stalled mine was on my checkride. The dpe said "nope, that's not good enough" and helped me pull the yoke and hold it. That's the only time mine has ever dropped a wing (with me on board) and started to spin. I applied opposite rudder and it immediately recovered. Safest airplane in the sky.
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Very difficult to stall, yes. But if you're not coordinated in the base to final turn then you can get into a spin with them. While recovery may be simple enough you have to also watch your altitude loss when that happens.
 
Utter speculation here, but this may have been an example of why it's a bad idea to instruct a family member.
 
i find it pretty hard that a CFI would let a student just fly into trees way short of the runway, I'm betting on a mechanical issue of some kind.
 
George Mohr said:
i find it pretty hard that a CFI would let a student just fly into trees way short of the runway, I'm betting on a mechanical issue of some kind.
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Or the student got them into a bad situation faster than the instructor could get them out of it.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Or the student got them into a bad situation faster than the instructor could get them out of it.
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That's why I brought up that they were brother-sister. Seems more likely to happen than if they were strangers.
 
skippers said:
Based at Massey's for 30 years, trees are high at runway 18, parallel to Massey road, hence the displaced threshold. My mechanic whose hangar is at the end of 18 told me they were low on the approach. Usually you can see the planes on approach from his hangar. They were not visible and he heard the engine running. This was a second approach, they were low on the first approach and he wondered if they were going to make it the first time. Also told me no shoulder belts and most of the injuries reported to be facial.
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That’s horrible.
 
Half Fast said:
Is that a characteristic of most Fred Weick designs? The Ercoupe also comes to mind.
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I always assumed it was Thorp that had more input on the stall characteristic than Weick, just because the Cherokee so closely resembles the T-211.
 
tawood said:
I always assumed it was Thorp that had more input on the stall characteristic than Weick, just because the Cherokee so closely resembles the T-211.
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Beats me. It just crossed my mind that what you described sounded similar to an Ercoupe's behavior. I've never been up in either one, though, so I can't offer a comparison.
 
James331 said:
Never got how that's so dangerous
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An uncoordinated stall in a turn at low airspeed 500ft off the ground. Seems pretty dangerous to me. It needs to be a point of emphasis in training as well as the BFR because there are still too many of these.
 
labbadabba said:
An uncoordinated stall in a turn at low airspeed 500ft off the ground. Seems pretty dangerous to me. It needs to be a point of emphasis in training as well as the BFR because there are still too many of these.
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Why are you uncoordinated and why are you stalling

Still don't get it


Also looking at the ACS, betcha we are going to start going backwards in safety
 
James331 said:
Why are you uncoordinated and why are you stalling

Still don't get it
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It's really quite simple. People screw up. They get distracted, they react poorly when they get flustered. AKA being human.

Not understanding how someone can stall a plane at 500' during a base to final turn is the same as not understanding how two cars can contact each other on an interstate highway.

Now to be clear (because otherwise someone will assume otherwise) I'm NOT saying base to final turns are dangerous or that flying the pattern without the ball centered is okay and that stalling the plane at 500' is standard operating procedure.
 
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