Cardinal RG down - Worcester County, MA

PeterNSteinmetz

PeterNSteinmetz

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PeterNSteinmetz
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Just the kind of accident I hate to see. The pilot, who appears to have a unique name, has several computer-science relate patents.
 
Sad. 3000ft runway, should not have had to climb aggressively on the way out..
 
I've gotta ask...WTF is wrong with the writer of the article in the 2nd link? First, he says that the name of the deceased pilot is being withheld pending notification of the family. Then, the very next thing he says is that the plane has N-number blah blah blah, and is registered to a Mr. so and so. Now, sure....the pilot may not be the owner, but that's rolling the dice. Where TF is the writer's common decency?

Sorry, had to vent for a moment.
 
Interesting. Hate to see any accidents, but especially fatal ones. Note that there was no fire. Could he have taken off with basically empty fuel? RIP


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vkhosid said:
I've gotta ask...WTF is wrong with the writer of the article in the 2nd link? First, he says that the name of the deceased pilot is being withheld pending notification of the family. Then, the very next thing he says is that the plane has N-number blah blah blah, and is registered to a Mr. so and so. Now, sure....the pilot may not be the owner, but that's rolling the dice. Where TF is the writer's common decency?

Sorry, had to vent for a moment.
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Using common decency would technically be editorializing. The writer was merely expressing the facts.
 
vkhosid said:
I've gotta ask...WTF is wrong with the writer of the article in the 2nd link? First, he says that the name of the deceased pilot is being withheld pending notification of the family. Then, the very next thing he says is that the plane has N-number blah blah blah, and is registered to a Mr. so and so. Now, sure....the pilot may not be the owner, but that's rolling the dice. Where TF is the writer's common decency?

Sorry, had to vent for a moment.
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The same type of moron who showed pics of the Thunder Mustang canopy frame with the pilot’s name on it, before family was notified...
 
JohnAJohnson said:
That is looking probable. NTSB Report.
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Yikes- in our club plane. My rule is to dip the tanks before every flight even if I think I was the last to fly it. This reaffirms this. Many of times i have guesstimated the amount of fuel and been wrong when I dipped.
 
Very very sad. I'm very anal about preflights, per the checklist, sometimes I get strange looks from other pilots, but you know what, I will continue to be anal about preflights. The only choice this guy had was trees, sounds like he stalled and spun it though, he might have had a chance if that didn't happen.
 
Wow! No fuel. Hard to believe a qualified pilot can takeoff with NO fuel in the tanks.
 
Rcmutz said:
Wow! No fuel. Hard to believe a qualified pilot can takeoff with NO fuel in the tanks.
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Had a guy here flame out in his military training jet due to too much air in the fuel tanks.

...As he was taxiing out to depart.

He found a different way to mort himself in the same airplane a year or two later.
 
NTSB found a total of 7-8oz of fuel in the plane. Just don’t see how people let this happen.
 
BrianM said:
NTSB found a total of 7-8oz of fuel in the plane. Just don’t see how people let this happen.
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Relying on memory rather than rote? Check the tanks every time. I wonder if he was flying over to Stow where gas is 2 bucks a gallon cheaper?
 
Yeah, even when you’re the only pilot, plane kept in a locked hangar, whatever, checking under the fuel caps then oil is essential practice.

It doesn’t matter if fuel is 50 cents a gallon cheaper over yonder, put in enough(and reserves) for the flight.

That broken crankshaft may bite you, the ‘low hanging fruit’ of low fuel shouldn’t.
 
Lack of fuel notwithstanding...a good reminder for a mental “if the engine quits below xxx agl, land straight ahead” briefing. Crashes are much more survivable if they are flown into vs stalling a couple hundred feet in the air.
 
Makes you wonder what the pilot was thinking when he landed. Unusable fuel is about 2 gallons per tank... 12lbs... was that a mis-print. 3 gallons vs 3 oz per tank... makes more sense with the engine sound changing as fuel sloshes in the tank nose up vs nose down...
 
FlySince9 said:
Makes you wonder what the pilot was thinking when he landed. Unusable fuel is about 2 gallons per tank... 12lbs... was that a mis-print. 3 gallons vs 3 oz per tank... makes more sense with the engine sound changing as fuel sloshes in the tank nose up vs nose down...
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I don't know, 3 oz versus gallons, these ntsb guys shouldn't make a mistake like that, plus there is usually a header tank in our planes which would give you just enough fuel to taxi, runup and get off the ground if you are having a really bad day. Regardless, it's about 30 less gallons than I would ever consider taking off with. (SR22)
 
So my dad has a similar crash back in the 1970s in a 210. Real simple cause. They forgot to sump the airplane or purge the fuel.


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Running out of fuel during cruise because the pilot losing track of time is one thing, but taking off with a nearly empty tank defies all logic. I wonder how many medical personnel and supplies had to be dispensed for this accident during this CV19 crisis.
 
Jmcmanna said:
Lack of fuel notwithstanding...a good reminder for a mental “if the engine quits below xxx agl, land straight ahead” briefing. Crashes are much more survivable if they are flown into vs stalling a couple hundred feet in the air.
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Keep in mind that a witness said it stalled. That usually means they heard the engine quit, or wide RPM reduction.
 
You know, thinking about this accident, this airport is in kind of a remote country location, I'm wondering if his gas was stolen. Tanks emptied by some kid with an old muscle car, or some idiot pilot looking for free fuel? That could explain empty tanks and if the pilot didn't check before every flight he could have thought he still had the gas he left the airplane with.
 
PaulS said:
You know, thinking about this accident, this airport is in kind of a remote country location, I'm wondering if his gas was stolen. Tanks emptied by some kid with an old muscle car, or some idiot pilot looking for free fuel? That could explain empty tanks and if the pilot didn't check before every flight he could have thought he still had the gas he left the airplane with.
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...and continued on to rig the fuel gauge to indicate more fuel than what was in the tank?
 
smv said:
...and continued on to rig the fuel gauge to indicate more fuel than what was in the tank?
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I've never trusted a gas gauge, never. That can work against you if you don't visually check the level before you go.
 
PaulS said:
I've never trusted a gas gauge, never. That can work against you if you don't visually check the level before you go.
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So if you got into an airplane that you "thought" had full tanks and the gauge indicated the tank was empty, you would simply take off thinking to yourself the entire way to the crash "Stupid fuel gauges are never right."

Wow...
 
smv said:
So if you got into an airplane that you "thought" had full tanks and the gauge indicated the tank was empty, you would simply take off thinking to yourself the entire way to the crash "Stupid fuel gauges are never right."

Wow...
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WTF is wrong with you, I would never say that, I visually check the tank every time before start the engine. Quit making crap up.
 
PaulS said:
WTF is wrong with you, I would never say that, I visually check the tank every time before start the engine. Quit making crap up.
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Not "making crap up". You did say it...
 
on some aircraft there is no way to visually check the tank,so you either fill after every flight or trust the gauge.
 
smv said:
Not "making crap up". You did say it...
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No, I didn't say what you posted, you made that scenario up and it's quite a leap from what I actually wrote, lol.

I check the tanks every time I fly, visually, I know what I start with and I calculate how much fuel the flight will use, I used to do it manually, now Foreflight does it automatically. If you're a pilot, you should do that too. The fuel gages are nice, but I don't trust them, you shouldn't either.

I fly a plane with a fuel totalizer, I trust that more than the gauges, it gets adjusted, if necessary before I start. If I'm not able to land with at least an hours worth of fuel I stop and get more.

This guy took off with no fuel. I have no idea if he looked at his gas gauges or not, but it was an older plane and I'm betting they weren't that accurate. Regardless, I doubt he looked at the tanks to see how much fuel he had.

How does that happen? I don't know, maybe he never checked, or maybe he left the plane the day before with more than enough fuel to make the 15 minute flight to Stow for cheap gas and someone drained his tanks before he got there. Plausible, but we will probably never know.

Just about every instructor I've flown with will visually check the tanks and the oil level if they weren't there when I checked the oil. The gas level, doesn't matter if they were right behind me when I checked it visually, they want to see it too. Why do you suppose that is? Hint: It's not because they think I'm a moron.
 
No wing strut to stand on. Maybe someone 'borrowed' his foot stool.

Not even gonna comment on gas gauges in old airplanes.
 
PaulS said:
What aircraft, single engine piston, are those?
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DA-40? Unless it's topped off or you have a fancy fuel checker you cannot see the fuel level. Dip sticking doesn't work because of the shape of the tank. Also, I could be wrong, I have around 10 hours in the DA40 and it was a few years ago. I seem to remember it being a PITA, especially when the previous renter broke the fancy fuel checker.
 
Low wing for the win, I put an eyeball on the gas level during preflight. We usually leave it at the tabs, which is 25g per wing. After startup, cross check fuel gauges that they read 150# each or thereabouts.
 
frfly172 said:
My Liberty Xl2
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Nice plane, you have some advanced avionics in that airplane if I recall correctly. Not a lot of those made. Most airplanes you can visually check the gas. So how do you make sure you have enough gas?
 
Bill Jennings said:
Low wing for the win, I put an eyeball on the gas level during preflight. We usually leave it at the tabs, which is 25g per wing. After startup, cross check fuel gauges that they read 150# each or thereabouts.
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Yup, even the 172 I flew for a while, had tabs or the collar if I remember correctly and a dip stick so you knew how much gas was in the tanks. I really didn't trust those gages.
 
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